Chain of Command??? (Full Version)

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WhiteElephants -> Chain of Command??? (8/10/2002 5:30:01 AM)

I was wondering if someone would be so kind as to explain the chain of command with regards to who reports to who. I'm guessing the Sgt's report to the Lieutenants (the B0 unit leader for example) then the Lieutenants report to the A0 unit, yes? And the range of influence is three hexes for each commanding officer without radio contact or somesuch... (I can look this part up).

Am I missing anything?



G_X -> (8/10/2002 7:08:14 AM)

Infantry Section/Squad commander reports to the Platoon level commander, Platoon reports to Company commander, or, if there isn't a company commander, to Battallion commander, if possible.

Tank/Vehicle commander reports to Tank Squad/Platoon commander, So on up the chain.

I dunno if the A0 unit can actually be used for rallying purposes. I've never tried.




And Both units have to have radios to be in Contact.



WhiteElephants -> (8/10/2002 7:14:52 AM)

Ok, lets see if I have this straight.

The C1 unit would rally with the C1 units leader, then the C0 units leader, then from there is where I get confused. If I understand what you're saying there is a unit between the C0 unit and the A0 unit, yes?

If so, then my next question would be, how do I determine who that intermediary unit is?

Thanks for the patience.



G_X -> (8/10/2002 7:51:52 AM)

Ok, if you bought an Infantry Platoon

C1 would rally, failing that, C0 would rally C1, failing that, A0, if possible, would rally C1

If you bought an Infantry Company there's an extra step. C1 would rally, failing that, C0 would rally, failing that, B0, C0's superior, would attempt rally, then I think A0 would rally.

Does that make sense? Now I'm not ~sure~ on all of this, usually I just stick to if C1 doesn't rally, and C0 can, C0 will, as I've only rarely seen anything higher happen.



WhiteElephants -> (8/10/2002 3:50:12 PM)

Yep, makes sense to me thanks.



Capt. Pixel -> Rally 'round the flag, Boys. (8/11/2002 1:02:32 AM)

I always rally prior to starting my turn. I figure the boys will do better if they're rallied up first.

I start with the A0 and proceed throught the roster in order. I try to make sure that higher level authorities are in as rallied a condition as possible. I think this might help the rest of the platoon get their act together.

At the end of the turn, I go back through the roster and rally everybody one more time, just to be sure. This addresses the effects of my recent movement and fire (and return fire) during the current turn.

Also, changing conditions during the turn for each unit may allow a rally where it wasn't possible before. (eg. Having a SturmTiger blow up near you usually has a positive impact on nearby infantry units.)

And a little tidbit I just recently learned: Right click the 'R' button on the command screen to force a maximum rally for the unit. I love this trick - must have saved me hours in reduced 'rallying' time. :D



Major Destruction -> Re: Rally 'round the flag, Boys. (8/23/2002 5:46:31 AM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Capt. Pixel
[B]
I start with the A0 and proceed throught the roster in order. I try to make sure that higher level authorities are in as rallied a condition as possible. I think this might help the rest of the platoon get their act together. [/B][/QUOTE]

This is excellent advice.

Your A0 unit will rally a suppressed unit so long as they are very close together. however, if the A0 unit is suppressed he will fail the rally request on the other unit.
If you rally A0 first, then he may be sufficiently rallied to help rally the close units that ask for help later on.

But, it is not sufficient to simply go through the roster from A0 to Z5. For maximum benefit, you should rally A0 first, then the highest Company commander, followed by all other Co Commanders in order, then all of the Command posts, and finally all of the other units in order.

caveat- A unit that fails a rally attempt on itself will not be available to rally a subordinate unit later on.

I never rally my units at the end of a turn, relying on the autorally feature, which I believe is more useful.



Major Destruction -> Re: Rally 'round the flag, Boys. (8/23/2002 5:53:00 AM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Capt. Pixel
[B]I always rally prior to starting my turn. I figure the boys will do better if they're rallied up first. [/B][/QUOTE]

I don't agree so much with this practice.

Units are more likely to rally if:
They are not under bombardment nor under a bombardment target.

They are not directly threatened by a superior enemy unit.

They are not surrounded by friendly units that are also heavily suppressed.

They are not surrounded or outnumbered by enemy units that are not suppressed.

They have not fired on and destroyed an enemy unit immediately prior to the rally attempt.

Units will be more likely to rally if:

They are surrounded by friendly units that are not suppressed or can "see" more friendly units that enemy units.

They have fired on an enemy unit and scored some damage.

They are close to a command post or A0 or company commander that is not suppressed

Units will not rally if they have already failed a rally attempt.



rbrunsman -> (8/23/2002 6:18:24 AM)

Good advice Major D. It is quite an art to know when to rally and when to wait for a more promising attempt. It is much better to wait to rally a unit if you can make his immediate situation appear much better to him after a few "badies" have been removed from his vicinity. If a unit fails a rally, it takes a lot of "good news" for him to regain the ability to rally in the same turn.



Capt. Pixel -> (8/23/2002 7:06:53 AM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by rbrunsman
[B]Good advice Major D. It is quite an art to know when to rally and when to wait for a more promising attempt. It is much better to wait to rally a unit if you can make his immediate situation appear much better to him after a few "badies" have been removed from his vicinity. If a unit fails a rally, it takes a lot of "good news" for him to regain the ability to rally in the same turn. [/B][/QUOTE]

This is a good point. I've found that after you've improved the ambience of an area, you might just get an additional opportunity to rally a previously un-rallyable (I make these words up :) ) unit.

I would only delay a unit's chance to rally if I felt there was a real prime opportunity to clear the area of threats first. Keep in mind that unsuccessful attempts may prompt opportunity fire that will further worsen a unit's already poor status. Splash damage would be a likely culprit, or units sharing a hex.

Each unit's situation should be evaluated individually. :cool:



maniacalmonkey -> rally (8/25/2002 1:20:10 AM)

I must say that the "rally" feature is one of the few things in this game that I don't like. I mean, come on:

Staff member: Colonel, our right flank is falling back!

Colonel: Dammit, forgot to press "r"!

It's unrealistic, and having to go all through your roster pressing "r" is a pain.


But now that we're on the subject of HQ's - could anyone explain to me how the Command Control option works? I've tried the manual but couldn't really figure it out.



Major Destruction -> (8/25/2002 3:17:46 AM)

The German machine gun opened fire, straight down the road. It was in a perfect position, at the perfect time, to wipe out the company.
The fire split the platoon. The seventh man behind Welsh stayed in the ditch. So did the rest of the platoon, almost 30 men. They were face down in the ditches on both sides of the road , trying to snuggle in as close as they could.
Winters jumped into the middle of the road, yelling "Move out, Move out!" It did no good, the men remained in the ditches.............
Winters threw away his gear, holding onto his M-1 and ran over to the left side, hollering like a mad man, "GET GOING!"
He started kicking the men in the butt.

He was pressing the r- button.

What is wrong with having this portrayed in the game? It happened. The game models it very well.

You will have to read the rest of Band of Brothers to find out what happened;)



antarctic -> (8/25/2002 2:54:07 PM)

[QUOTE]You will have to read the rest of Band of Brothers to find out what happened[/QUOTE]

Dang! Just as I was getting interested!

Antarctic



maniacalmonkey -> (8/26/2002 5:25:33 AM)

Don't worry, I saw the TV series, it all ends well - except for that fella who was blown half to bits in the village :)

But I think it should happen more spontaneously, I mean, the NCO's should kick the men into action regardless of what the battalion commander is doing. How is he going to rally folks from his command tent anyway? Suppression isn't something that comes from orders, it's in the minds of the men. IMO the battalion level of play in SP:WAW doesn't justify a separate command for every encouraging shout (or kick in the butt :)).



Major Destruction -> (8/26/2002 11:36:56 AM)

It does happen that way too. The NCO's do effect rally. But you have to play the game too.

So as the player you have to intervene to rally on behalf of the officers when the NCO's fail.

Of course you could also play AI vs AI and simply watch the action...........kinda like the difference between watching TV and reading the book.

:p



challenge -> Re: rally (8/27/2002 2:40:05 AM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by maniacalmonkey
[B]But now that we're on the subject of HQ's - could anyone explain to me how the Command Control option works? I've tried the manual but couldn't really figure it out. [/B][/QUOTE]

C&C works about the same as the rally chain of command. A Pltn Leader is a 2ndLt. He can generate 1 or 2 Command Points each turn and can hold a maximum of (?) [I]3[/I] (not sure on the exact number at this rank, might be two) until the next turn. These points are used to give orders to the platoon's squads/vehicles. These include changing mode (defend/advance), changing objective, or calling in the artillery.

If the Plt Ldr doesn't have enough points, he can draw from the Company Commander, a Captain or 1st Lt, who may earn up to three C&C points. These are used by platoons in the company, for the Co Commdr's platoon, or any company support elements. The AO unit can hold up to three per turn and earn up to three more (I think). These are usable by any unit in the Btln. Like rally, the unit needs to be in contact (visual = 3 hex max; radio can be much farhter away) to use the C&C points of a higher unit.

Points are generated according to some formula that accounts for the experience of the commander, the rank, suppression and a bunch of other stuff I can't remember at the moment.



fud -> (8/27/2002 2:52:48 AM)

Lots of good advice. I'd add one thing that's been kinda touched on - you may get another chance to rally a unit after you move it's commanding unit close. I mean, C1 fails to rally and is out of contact with C0. Later you move C0 adjacent to C1, re-establishing contact. Voila - you can now try to rally C1 with C0.



maniacalmonkey -> (8/27/2002 4:19:18 AM)

Thanks for the tips on C&C, I'll have to go check it out sometimes. In return, I will stop nagging about the "r" button :p



Irinami -> (9/9/2002 8:02:00 PM)

I always say A0 rallying as something like one of the below:

"[B]Come on you apes, you wanna' live forever??[/B]"

"[B]Get up or I'll shoot you myself![/B]"

(Yes, both stolen from Starship Troopers.)

"[B]*********, pin that MG42 and there's beer in it for all of ya'![/B]"

"[B]*********, pin that MG42 or your the recon element tomorrow![/B]" (We all know they're red-shirts. :P)

"[B]... Comrade Cowardski, is it just me or are our IS tanks aiming a little too low to hit those Panzers?[/B]"
"[B]Maybe we should move, I don't think they're trying to hit the [I]Panzers[/I] anymore... [/B]"

;)



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