Ally found World Destroyer, what shall I do? (Full Version)

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WoodMan -> Ally found World Destroyer, what shall I do? (9/6/2010 9:36:49 PM)

My Mutual Defence Pact partner has just found a World Destroyer and got a big fleet of ships guarding it so its unlikely I can do the steal a wreck by having my military next to their constructor trick.

i don't really want them to get it because I know they will either:

A) use it on me
B) use it on someone else, lowering their rep and making everyone go to war on them, which ain't good considering I have to join with them to honour the defence pact.

Shall I send in my fleet and blow the dang thing out of the sky before the repair is finished?



ehsumrell1 -> RE: Ally found World Destroyer, what shall I do? (9/6/2010 11:15:48 PM)

Had that situation once....
Sent in two escorted constructors and ordered them to build two "well shielded" defense bases, one on
each side of the world destroyer. Prayed they would be built before the World Destroyer was....they were.
I then broke off relations and sent in a small fleet to engage their fleet (true suicide mission). In the
meanwhile though, the cruisers escorting the constructors started blasting the unfinished World Destroyer
and was able to destroy it while their fleet was busy with my two defense bases and the strike fleet.

I wanted to try a plan of using my constructors on the World Destroyer and try to finish it for myself [sm=00000028.gif]... but I didn't think my constructors would finish before my bases were torpedo fodder.
Also, I wasn't certain I could keep them from being attacked either. That was my experience Woodman.



WoodMan -> RE: Ally found World Destroyer, what shall I do? (9/7/2010 12:08:06 AM)

Well I decided to let them keep it, but then unfortunately my relations started to get worse with them because they covet my colonies and resources, also they have drawn me into a war with a more advanced race who are on the opposite side of the galaxy, god knows how they managed to get attacked by the from all the way over there [:D]

So, I changed my mind and sent in a reclaimed Cruiser (from the same debris site as the world destroyer) and destroyed the World Destroyer before it was complete.

This had no effect on my relations with them, which leads us back to the old talking point of whether a ship should be claimed before or after a repair starts on it, I basically just destroyed their hopes of dominating the galaxy (the extra 9000 firepower of a World Destroyer would have made them 2nd most powerful after a very advanced Quameno civ that is far away from us) and suffered no penalty for it.



torrenal -> RE: Ally found World Destroyer, what shall I do? (9/7/2010 1:10:10 AM)

My advice:
1) Send in your own fleet.  As a mutual defence partner, I *think* it would have no impact on relations
2) Repair (or blow up) every *OTHER*  abandoned ship in the system.  Once this is done, the other fleet will depart.
3) Keep your fleet on station, the world destroyer will likely devolve to your ownership on its completion, owing largely to the presence of your fleet.
//Torrenal



the1sean -> RE: Ally found World Destroyer, what shall I do? (9/8/2010 4:51:17 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: WoodMan

Well I decided to let them keep it, but then unfortunately my relations started to get worse with them because they covet my colonies and resources, also they have drawn me into a war with a more advanced race who are on the opposite side of the galaxy, god knows how they managed to get attacked by the from all the way over there [:D]

So, I changed my mind and sent in a reclaimed Cruiser (from the same debris site as the world destroyer) and destroyed the World Destroyer before it was complete.

This had no effect on my relations with them, which leads us back to the old talking point of whether a ship should be claimed before or after a repair starts on it, I basically just destroyed their hopes of dominating the galaxy (the extra 9000 firepower of a World Destroyer would have made them 2nd most powerful after a very advanced Quameno civ that is far away from us) and suffered no penalty for it.



Definitely a dilemma!



Jeeves -> RE: Ally found World Destroyer, what shall I do? (9/28/2010 1:02:47 AM)

I plan on solving that problem by having a super area weapon ship fire upon the world destroyer, not damaging it, but catching the "ally" constructors in the blast. Clean house periodically to make them send another constructor. The problem is usually not urgent since it takes several years for their PUNY little constructors to finish a world destroyer. My current game is the first in which an AI empire got to a world destroyer before me, so there may be an unsuspected flaw in my strategy...



Hohenlohe -> RE: Ally found World Destroyer, what shall I do? (10/10/2010 1:19:09 AM)

I would prefer this way:
1.) send your two best forces in the system attacking the ally constructor manually and the manually attacking the next biggest enemy ships until no one remains and then claim the WD for you and send two escorted construction ships to him repairing him.
2)Additionally build a Defensive Base near him. Then repair the ships inside the debris and retire them all for possible access to new technology.
3)Do not let it happen that the WD will owned by another empire because you will end to be sacked by them.
To prevent that case I suggest you that you design at start an expensive version of an Exploration vessel with more thrusts and fuel cells and energy collectors and some armor and some beam weapon. If you are the first who can claim him try your best to do so.
4)Prepare some ship designs with a very long range to be build at that time in your greatest Starport near to the WD. For that Case design a new Large Starport with around ten shipyards so that the first batch of these ships will be build fast. I hope you own enough money around that time.
Consider to stop all construction ships and unnecessary buildings, even scrap some ships from the queue..
As soon as you got the claim on the WD you are relatively unbeatable by other empires due to the strong firepower owned by the WD.

greetings

Hohenlohe




Aures -> RE: Ally found World Destroyer, what shall I do? (10/10/2010 4:13:23 AM)

Good advice.

I actually had some fun when a rival empire claimed a WD. They were pretty small in comparison to me and had their territory inside mine. They had been a thorn in my side for a while but I hadn't bothered dealing with them. I finally got around to going to war with them and I had a blast chasing their WD across space as they desperately tried to stop me blowing it up. Got it after a while, the WDs are powerful but they are not an I win button by any stretch.

Once you get a WD make sure you don't have attacks set to automatic. Or you might find the AI has decided to blow up a planet for you. That happened to me when I wasn't paying attention, all I caught was the last half of the planet exploding animation.

My advice would be to build a big invasion force and get it into position around all their systems. Then get the troop ships really close to all their planets, withdraw from the defence pact, declare war and land all your troops before their space ports know what is happening. Wipe them out in one stroke and you will get all their ships. Time it so that you invade just before or after they have finished the WD. They will do all the work for you and you get the WD and all their other planets and ships as a bonus. Of course I have no idea whether you are in a position to do that or not.

That or let them get it and then withdraw from the mutual defence pact and declare war on them. Give yourself a bit of a challenging opponent for once. Have some fun destroying a fully functional WD.



Hohenlohe -> RE: Ally found World Destroyer, what shall I do? (10/10/2010 3:00:09 PM)

It is new to me that you could inherit the enemy ships in such a manner. In my recent games I won two subsequent wars against two slightly weaker opponents as I was the strongest one ingame with a similar tactic. After my learning from the first war I consquently prepared my forces for invading all enemy planets at the same time after destroying any ports and bases around. I had never regarded gaining any ships after that. Most of the enemy military ships were blown up so that I had no resistance anymore. Especially after I made a year long subversive actions against the enemy like sabotage constructions at his main starports.
At the same time I got access to the World Destroyer and the nearby debris field ships without any interference as nearby allied pirates made my opponents happy as they battle with them. As I prepared all for a third war against the strongest opponent my game crashes due to some editing at start as I assume.
So I can that only try with a completely new game.

greetings

Hohenlohe


edit: I am trying a new game with a slightly modified Zenox race. I gave them the Superlaser beam weapon from start and try to build some decent capital ship. Regretable the World Destroyer seems to use some higher construction technology as I can get, but with some workaround it can happen. But equivalent to the real WD Super Laser my one uses around 680 points equivalent to some 450 points of the WD.





Aures -> RE: Ally found World Destroyer, what shall I do? (10/11/2010 2:07:32 AM)

Just in case there is some confusion the super laser is different to the death ray. The death ray is pretty good compared to earlier tech weapons but is outclassed by the higher tech ones. You cannot obtain the death ray or super laser by using the game editor to edit techs. You have to find the death ray in a ruin and use the super lasers on WDs. I have not tried retiring WDs, so maybe you can build your own super lasers that way but I doubt it. If you are editing outside the game rather than using the in game editor it might be possible, you should give yourself the best construction tech using the game editor to test out if you really can build functional super laser designs. Let us know how you go, it would be interesting to know if this is possible. Fighting an AI that can build super laser designs would be a good challenge.

The key to getting an appreciable pay off from taking the last planet in an empire is to invade all their planets in as coordinated a manner as possible and avoid destroying any assets you don't have to. If you follow the AI attack suggestions you will blow up most of their ships and bases during a war. It is really just an extension of rush invading a world with a space port so you get to keep it rather than spend time blowing it up. You don't get any notification that you have gained ships, you have to find them on the map or the ship list. If you have a lot of ships and the enemy doesn't have many left it is easy to miss them.

Currently I am "farming" races with special tech. I am leaving them alone until they can get big enough for their ships to yield a decent research bonus after I take them over and retire all of them. This is on a very slow research game so I need to retire a lot of ships to up my tech. I have previously taken over an empire and gotten all their ships, I will let you know if it doesn't work out like that in my current game.



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