ASW from surface ships + sonar question (Full Version)

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Owl -> ASW from surface ships + sonar question (11/10/2010 7:51:29 PM)

I don't know if I'm just having a run of bad luck or if I'm doing something wrong. I have recently started playing HCE again and am finding that my ASW screen of task forces seem to usually find submarines the hard way (i.e. torpedoes inbound). In the last few days this has happened several times and I have yet to locate a submarine from the screening ship's sonar - ever. It is not active, tail is streaming. Platforms are Spruance DD's, OHP FFG and/or Knox FF. Attackers are sometimes diesel boats which I know are hard to detect, but as often they're Victors. It seems like just by luck I should occasionally get a passive sonar contact! Note - taskforces are set to 'cruise' and the screen ships are using sprint/drift as far as I can tell. I do occasionally set the TF to creep when suspecting a sub is close.

A second question - When a torpedo is inbound your assistant constantly bugs you to turn on active sonar. Why? Does this provide a benefit of some kind?




Warhorse64 -> RE: ASW from surface ships + sonar question (11/11/2010 12:01:40 AM)

It may simply be that you're having a run of bad luck with the surface ships, because it does sound like you're using them properly. That said, however, I always try as much as possible to rely on air-dropped sonobuoys as my primary ASW detection mode, and preferably active buoys, even if that means accepting an inferior torpedo loadout on the a/c.

With torps inbound, they suggest you turn on the active sonar since you have nothing to lose (the sub already has a firing solution on you) and it might give you a detection. This does actually happen every once in a long while ... [8D]



donaldseadog -> RE: ASW from surface ships + sonar question (11/11/2010 5:44:56 AM)

My understanding is that subs are in reality difficult to detect, that is why they are so fearsome.
Subs under control of AI (your opponent) also seem to me to be perhaps the best used of the various platforms, sometimes the AI can be a little stupid about some things but with the subs it seems to do pretty well. 
If you want to spoil your game but see what is happening use the ctrl-alt-s keyboard short cut (see all or 'cheat mode') and you might pick up why the subs are hard to detect. If you use the auto save, and just picked up an inbound torpedo, use "save as" to get a different saved game name and come back later using the cheat mode to see what was happening.
I think I've read hints on group speeds that suggest something between 'creep' and 'cruise' might be wise if subs are suspected, I normally pick about 12 kts and drop as many sonar buoys and get as much MAD equipment in the air as I can. Still get chased (and hit) by torpedoes though.[X(]
Don Thomas



CV32 -> RE: ASW from surface ships + sonar question (11/11/2010 3:52:03 PM)

What battleset/scenario are you playing, Owl?



Owl -> RE: ASW from surface ships + sonar question (11/11/2010 5:11:30 PM)

Warhorse - How do you force active sonobuoys in HCE? I take manual control and lay patters of the passive ones (time consuming, but pays off at times). Guess I need to re-visit the rulebook! The other problem is that with the formation as you go out from center more and more area exists. Each concentric patrol zone is bigger and harder to cover with sometimes limited ASW.

CV32 - I've been moving around battlesets - Original GIUK, NACV and then the 2003 versions of them.

I think I'm mostly having bad luck. I am using the tactics we used when I was in the Navy many years ago now (back with Victors and such were in use, so about right per game time). I'm guessing that I'm blundering on subs that are parked so are very quiet.
I 'could' change my courses around I suppose from the ones set by the scenario designer, but I don't like to do that. I try to play like I don't know I'm in a PC game as much as possible!

I didn't know there was a "see all" mode! That could be useful.

By the way, does the ships anti torpedo device like the US Nixie work whether sonar is active or not? The device is sort of a active sonar emitter so it would follow if the game treated it rather like ECM which only works of the EMCON is relaxed.




CV32 -> RE: ASW from surface ships + sonar question (11/11/2010 8:03:01 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owl
Warhorse - How do you force active sonobuoys in HCE? I take manual control and lay patters of the passive ones (time consuming, but pays off at times). Guess I need to re-visit the rulebook! The other problem is that with the formation as you go out from center more and more area exists. Each concentric patrol zone is bigger and harder to cover with sometimes limited ASW.


Use the "." [period] key to manually drop sonobuoys. Note as well that your ASW aircraft on patrol will use their active dipping sonar if they have them.

quote:

CV32 - I've been moving around battlesets - Original GIUK, NACV and then the 2003 versions of them.


Okay. I ask because the sonar signatures are different between the older battlesets and the EC2003+ battlesets.

quote:

I think I'm mostly having bad luck. I am using the tactics we used when I was in the Navy many years ago now (back with Victors and such were in use, so about right per game time). I'm guessing that I'm blundering on subs that are parked so are very quiet. I 'could' change my courses around I suppose from the ones set by the scenario designer, but I don't like to do that. I try to play like I don't know I'm in a PC game as much as possible! I didn't know there was a "see all" mode! That could be useful.


Try running at creep intermittently while streaming the passive towed array (especially in a well equipped ASW ship like a Spruance) and see if your 'luck' improves.

quote:

By the way, does the ships anti torpedo device like the US Nixie work whether sonar is active or not? The device is sort of a active sonar emitter so it would follow if the game treated it rather like ECM which only works of the EMCON is relaxed.


There is no currently no torpedo decoy model in HCE.



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