RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (Full Version)

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randallw -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 3:00:56 AM)

Building your tank or infantry armies is way off in the future.  You have to survive the rest of the year first, then pick out which units you want in the front line and which will sit out and refit ( to get experience/morale up ).



jomni -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 3:23:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sillyflower
I also disbanded Corps HQs as quickly as I could after putting at 0 support level for 1 turn to get rid of support units. I'm not sure what happens to them if still attached to corps when I disband, and I've been too lazy to check how to remove them by hand.


I save my admin points by not deibanding the Corps HQs. When the Corps HQs disband on schedule, the units automatically attach to the Army HQ at no cost. As for support units? I'm not too sure. The AP's are better spent on buiding infantry divisions and forts.



randallw -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 8:54:51 AM)

The support units are supposed to head up to the HQ that controlled the Corps HQ.



sillyflower -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 1:43:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tophat1812

Here we have the all too familiar Cat-Box of Smolensk and Vyazma. Again I need to cobble together another line to hold for a turn.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/9F1E7C6534654E799478BA868FD8A009.jpg[/image]


Probably posting too late to help this time but I would move the 2-11 inf division 6 hexes NE of Smolensk a couple of hexes SW towards S. Not enough to cut off his supplies totally but would lengthen supply chain (especially for armour around Vyazma), hold up any following inf and ?make him a little more cautious which all add up to a little more delay.



sillyflower -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 2:01:28 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jomni

quote:

ORIGINAL: sillyflower
I also disbanded Corps HQs as quickly as I could after putting at 0 support level for 1 turn to get rid of support units. I'm not sure what happens to them if still attached to corps when I disband, and I've been too lazy to check how to remove them by hand.


I save my admin points by not deibanding the Corps HQs. When the Corps HQs disband on schedule, the units automatically attach to the Army HQ at no cost. As for support units? I'm not too sure. The AP's are better spent on buiding infantry divisions and forts.

I didn't notice that disbanding cost me any APs. I agree with your strategy if I'm mistaken.. I did spend APs on improving some commanders, but against AI I could afford not to build more divisions.



karonagames -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 2:04:32 PM)

Have to say I am getting very nervous for Uncle Joe.

Using the "3D" approach to Soviet defence in 1941: Delay, Depth and Digging, I can see plenty of Delay (checkerboard), occasional Depth (Carpet), and only a bit of Digging at Leningrad. By Turn 9 I try to have my first lvl 3 entrenchment line running from Rzhev to Kaluga, with further lines 2-3 hexes back, the idea being that the defenders get pushed back and stack in each subsequent line, so when then get to the "Alamo" line 2-3 hexes in front of Moscow, you have 3 units stacked in lvl 4 entrenchments with defensive CVs of 40+. 6 Tired GE Infantry divs have a hard time cracking that and need deliberate attacks that will slow him down further.

I don't see many level 3s in front of Moscow atm.



Avenger -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 3:35:43 PM)

Leningrad looks pretty good, but I have to agree with you about Moscow.




Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 6:22:47 PM)

Situation in the north at the start of RED Army turn 10. Note a lone rifle bgde formed.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/131BA2B4067241B4AC8E70DC9D7631F6.jpg[/image]



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 6:25:42 PM)

As so much time has passed since last update and I have completed my RED ARMY turn#10 I am skipping ahead to END of turn 10 situation reports.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/4725C507A58B4ED2BB5C3C5867ADF01C.jpg[/image]



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 6:29:06 PM)

Situation on the Ghost Front after my RED ARMY turn 10. Even if he makes a push here the terrain is such that it will be slow going for him.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/85CB788B532E4075AF86EA9E8064BB2E.jpg[/image]



Flaviusx -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 6:33:32 PM)

You really should have some kind of a fort line dug in from Rzhev to Kaluga by this point, you are relying too much on the checkerboard. The German has 7 more clear turns here and a checkerboard isn't going to stop him by itself.




Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 6:40:12 PM)

The situation at Moscow after the RED ARMY turn 10 moves. I don't like it either and will now take some draconian measures.

1) Set all infantry in hexes close to Moscow in "static mode".....this will free-up transportation and allow a 10% faster entrenchment rate.

2) Look-up the bloody rule about mobilizing the population to help fortify!

3) ALL new reinforcement come to Moscow with the exception of what appears near Leningrad.

4) Look at all my corps/army support units,thought I had construction battalions in the mix,where the hell are they and why so little progress.

5) SHOOT! Errr,ummmmn I mean replace any marginal commanders in the Moscow area.

6) See about Emergency railing-out of Moscow Industry! I have been good about getting everything out before capture by the GERMANS! BUT,here is the big exception.....I have moved nothing from Moscow! Worried he may well try and surround it!

7) On turn#11 some 25 Soviet Divisions activate..They are coming to Moscow!!!!! Shells can fill-out en-route,I have done that before. I already have 4 divisions on the rails to Moscow and 6 shell-Divisions there as well.



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 6:41:47 PM)

Forgot to post the Moscow screen-shot...Yea,it's as bad as it looks,also an opportunity.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/ED4CC5EEF564473BA56A11331B7E9872.jpg[/image]



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 6:43:22 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

You really should have some kind of a fort line dug in from Rzhev to Kaluga by this point, you are relying too much on the checkerboard. The German has 7 more clear turns here and a checkerboard isn't going to stop him by itself.




I agree with you! Will build more fortified areas and I have shell divisions and real divisions on the way. I want him in a city-Fight loosing boys before Mud. I just have to stop him isolating Moscow and starving me out.



Flaviusx -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 6:48:08 PM)

Uggh.

Don't like the static mode idea at all. Buy more construction battalions and/or RR brigades. If you have enough of these you can get forts dug in fast. And the cities will help. You've got plenty of APs to spare. I think your command and control could use some tightening, too, you've got too much stuff attached to STAVKA and are underutilizing your Front commands.

Static mode throws away all possibility to run or counterattack. (Yes, counterattack. It can be done, with some care.) You can reactivate static units, but they won't be able to attack on the turn they get reactivated, cost a ton of APs to get back into play, and their movement won't be amazing on the turn they get reactivated.

You have to be very very careful about static mode in 1941. I frankly don't think it's necessary on an active front if you've gotten your construction unit situation sorted out.



karonagames -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 6:48:55 PM)

He will be short of supplies, which should slow him down a bit, and he may get greedy and push his spearheads too far. If you have cavalry and or tank brigades around that can mess with his supply lines, you may buy enough time to get an Alamo Line built.

Interesting time ahead.























Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 8:59:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BigAnorak

He will be short of supplies, which should slow him down a bit, and he may get greedy and push his spearheads too far. If you have cavalry and or tank brigades around that can mess with his supply lines, you may buy enough time to get an Alamo Line built.

Interesting time ahead.


"May you live in interesting times."


Indeed it will be interesting and frankly I'm looking forward to it. He has 4 turns of good weather before"MUD" and then the winter. I have a fair amount of boys in the pipeline.....going to read up on attachments to get this down and fortify. I want him committed to getting in the city...that is where i can meet and kill his troops.

Look at the situation right now.yea,his ARMOR is close.....infantry is lagging behind. Does he have the time?

Are the Russians done for? [&:]

Or possibly...... Does he have me right where I want him?

Tell me this with 4 turns before Mud how does it end well for Jerry if he gets to RED SQUARE?



















Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:03:02 PM)

My cavalry raid last turn came within a couple hexes of over-running a German air-field unit. He is thin between Bryansk and Gomel.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/9B4A3006907041A199F5F1915073E897.jpg[/image]



jjdenver -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:04:37 PM)

I don't think losing Moscow is a game loser. Just get the important factories moved out (i.e. not the ones that end production soon like Mig3) and retake it in the winter. That's what I think - although I'm just whistling in the wind since I haven't played any game this far yet haha. :)



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:05:06 PM)

Gomel is so gar back from the front-line and Kursk seems more appropriate area.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/09934183456E4CE6B10BF90142679B13.jpg[/image]



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:07:58 PM)

A rather annoying collapse but we can absorb it for now. Just 4 turns more until "mud" moves into the equation.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/CCF7416591D648B48492F7BFC0FDB186.jpg[/image]



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:09:22 PM)

A wider perspective on the southern situation.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/0C0D494A9AE84BB0849679CB0F5148CD.jpg[/image]



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:11:26 PM)

And the southern Front after RED Army turn 10.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/2A16CA277A184B29817F3C6162A4901D.jpg[/image]



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:12:37 PM)

This rounds out the various Front situations.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/3DB7A44B98B047D7ACFB266AAA6F9516.jpg[/image]



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:14:29 PM)

For those interested in a clash of Armor in August 41'.

[image]local://upfiles/19413/AAECEBEE6EF9466EA60DDCBEA34BF633.jpg[/image]



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:16:05 PM)

And of course the comparative losses screen:

[image]local://upfiles/19413/7ED355AF77C94B688486FE91C1E51F3B.jpg[/image]



Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:33:15 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

You really should have some kind of a fort line dug in from Rzhev to Kaluga by this point, you are relying too much on the checkerboard. The German has 7 more clear turns here and a checkerboard isn't going to stop him by itself.



Hmmn,7 turns of clear? I miscounted and thought there were 4 after this turn. There is no fort line between Rzhev and kaluga There is a partially dug-in screen he will or can keep eating through.

Remember the movie Pork Chop Hill with Gregory Peck?

There is a Red Chinese psychological warfare officer who plays music over a loudspeaker system. After the Americans retake the hill he tells them:

Congratulations,but i must point out. The more ground you take,the more you have to hold.



Flaviusx -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:42:21 PM)

First mud turn is 18.




Tophat1815 -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 9:57:49 PM)


Yep,a whopping 7 turns to go..... I am reading the manual right now. I have already formed a Tank/Mech army of 4 armor divisions and 3 cavalry divisions. We shall see how those units have filled-out this turn. Time to start looking for an opening.

Or perhaps 2 Armies with 1 pure cavalry and another pure tank.



Flaviusx -> RE: Tophat1812(REDS) vs Moses(Krauts and friends) (1/4/2011 10:05:55 PM)

To be honest...I like rifle units for counterattacks more than mech in 1941. Cavalry is great for raids and for isolating enemy units. These are actually your most mobile units until tank corps come along.

But the armor just kind of sucks from a mobility standpoint. It takes 16 mps to launch a deliberate attack with mech. 1941 Soviet mech divisions top off at 18 mps, which means they can move a hex or two at most if you plan on attacking with them deliberately. Hasty attacks with them are extremely chancy since their CVs aren't high by and large.

A half dozen rifle division can wreck an overextended, fatigued and isolated panzer division and have enough movement left over even after a deliberate attack to resume defensive positions. With good leaders, anyways. I'd be getting your 6 and 7 point infantry leaders near Moscow.



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