Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (Full Version)

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Larsenex -> Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/12/2011 7:26:44 PM)

My current rig is a core 2 duo E8400 (3gig), Not overclocked, Gforce GTX 260, 4 gigs ram, Win 7 (64bit) Pro, 300 gig HDD, Asus mobo, cable, yadda yadda yadda.

I read here that this game supports multi core use. Is this true? How well? What about higher graphix cards and/or much more memory?

I ask because I am going to build a new system late February/early March. I rarely play shooters but will ocassionally load up Call of Duty and shoot some poor bastards till I feel better (beats kicking the Kat).

Anyway I was curious if I would see a performance increase jumping to a (much) higher system.

I have in mind this kind of settup...

I7 950 (socket 1366) (3.05 gig) overclocked to 3.6 or 3.8.
12 gigs of ram (3-4 gig sticks to stay in triple channel)
Geforce 470 or 480 (depends on cost at time, might get 2)
EVGA Motherboard or Asus, socket 1366.
Win 7 Pro (64 bit)
2 SSD Drives each 150 gig, one for Windows one for games.
1 HDD 800gig for storage of files such
I am also thinking about a new monitor but would take suggestions on that..

Anyway, back to the question. Does DW make good use of Quad Core Processors and will more than 4 gigs of ram help with very large Galaxys?






Data -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/12/2011 7:29:24 PM)

Elliot and Erik do check these threads also but this type of question you may wanna put in the tech support section also for more visibility



Larsenex -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/12/2011 7:34:53 PM)

I almost posted this in the Tech/help, but thought this was a general question. Thanks.



Erik Rutins -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/12/2011 8:51:31 PM)

Hi Larsenex,

The answer is yes, and we'll make even better use of multi-core processors going forward. The best performance in DW is generally seen on a system with multiple processor cores and 4GB of memory, running a 64-bit operating system.

Regards,

- Erik



Raap -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/12/2011 10:03:34 PM)

On my qx9650@3.8ghz and a Radeon 5870, the only performance issue I have is when I zoom out. The fully zoomed out view is very 'laggy' or sluggish. I always run at 4x speed, but it doesn't seem like it gets any better at 1x speed. Everything's completely smooth when zoomed in on one system or just viewing a few systems slightly zoomed out though. Still rather annoying, as I spend most my time zoomed out except when issuing fleet/ship orders. Can't figure out what the problem is either, since it seems the GPU is barely doing any work at all and the CPU usage is usually around 25-30%( one core and sometimes part of the others).

Maybe it's the big background image for the galaxy?



samspackman -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/13/2011 12:15:02 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Hi Larsenex,

The answer is yes, and we'll make even better use of multi-core processors going forward. The best performance in DW is generally seen on a system with multiple processor cores and 4GB of memory, running a 64-bit operating system.

Regards,

- Erik


I am running a system which has all of these specs, but the game still seems to lag and stutter, even with only 500 planet systems. What are some optimisation tips?



Shark7 -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/13/2011 6:51:11 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Larsenex

My current rig is a core 2 duo E8400 (3gig), Not overclocked, Gforce GTX 260, 4 gigs ram, Win 7 (64bit) Pro, 300 gig HDD, Asus mobo, cable, yadda yadda yadda.

I read here that this game supports multi core use. Is this true? How well? What about higher graphix cards and/or much more memory?

I ask because I am going to build a new system late February/early March. I rarely play shooters but will ocassionally load up Call of Duty and shoot some poor bastards till I feel better (beats kicking the Kat).

Anyway I was curious if I would see a performance increase jumping to a (much) higher system.

I have in mind this kind of settup...

I7 950 (socket 1366) (3.05 gig) overclocked to 3.6 or 3.8.
12 gigs of ram (3-4 gig sticks to stay in triple channel)
Geforce 470 or 480 (depends on cost at time, might get 2)
EVGA Motherboard or Asus, socket 1366.
Win 7 Pro (64 bit)
2 SSD Drives each 150 gig, one for Windows one for games.
1 HDD 800gig for storage of files such
I am also thinking about a new monitor but would take suggestions on that..

Anyway, back to the question. Does DW make good use of Quad Core Processors and will more than 4 gigs of ram help with very large Galaxys?






That system is very similar to mine (you are going for a better graphics card and I do not have SSDs). You will be pleased with DW performance with that system. I have no complaints with mine, able to play 1400 star system games with ease.

For comparison, I have:

I-7 Core 930 Bloomfield 2.93 Ghz
12 Gigs of RAM
GeForce GTS 250
Win 7 Home

Bigger monitor is always better, I'm thinking of upgrading to a 23" Wide screen myself.



Tampa_Gamer -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/13/2011 8:57:50 PM)

Shark7, on a related note I am on the same quest of replacing my beloved Viewsonic p225f CRT. I build a new system about every 3 years, but I have held on to my CRT since it has been great for gaming at 1600x1200 85hz for years. Unfortunately, it has recently started to fade badly (e.g. brightness and contrast at almost 100% and I am still having trouble seeing certain things in dark games) so I too am looking for a 23-26" LCD/LED. I have managed to thoroughly confuse myself looking at the usual forums (Anandtech, Toms Hardware and Hardforum.com). Just when I think I have found the perfect match, I find there is a significant flaw that turns me off (most recently this was with the Dell U2311H that everyone seems hyped up about but appears to have a recall going on.
So if you find something, please let me know and I will do the same. Thanks



unclean -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/13/2011 9:18:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: V for Vegas
I am running a system which has all of these specs, but the game still seems to lag and stutter, even with only 500 planet systems. What are some optimisation tips?


There's a few:
In advanced settings, turn of nebulae - HUGE performance boost.
Turn down your desktop resolution. Here's the method I use. This one gives a large boost as well.
Turn down the star density setting in options. Gives a small but noticeable gain.

I've tried a few other things like turning off windows compositing and changing some graphics driver settings, but they didn't seem to do anything.



Shark7 -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/13/2011 11:35:37 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tampa_Gamer

Shark7, on a related note I am on the same quest of replacing my beloved Viewsonic p225f CRT. I build a new system about every 3 years, but I have held on to my CRT since it has been great for gaming at 1600x1200 85hz for years. Unfortunately, it has recently started to fade badly (e.g. brightness and contrast at almost 100% and I am still having trouble seeing certain things in dark games) so I too am looking for a 23-26" LCD/LED. I have managed to thoroughly confuse myself looking at the usual forums (Anandtech, Toms Hardware and Hardforum.com). Just when I think I have found the perfect match, I find there is a significant flaw that turns me off (most recently this was with the Dell U2311H that everyone seems hyped up about but appears to have a recall going on.
So if you find something, please let me know and I will do the same. Thanks



Right now I'm using a 18" AOC and have had no problems with it. I also have a 18.5" Wide Screen Acer at work and it too works perfectly. I think the key is not to buy an unknown brand, stick with the more reputable companies and you should be fine.



caerr -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/14/2011 3:50:03 PM)

Since this is somewhat of a general performance thread, is anyone having extreme slowdown issues when there is lots of stuff happening on the screen?

One specific case might be the kaltor infested base you need to investigate along the storyline.

Or just large scale battles with maybe hundreds of guns firing at the same time.

I have quad core 3ghz, HD5850, 4 gigs of ram and Win 7 and I've managed to get below one frame per second in certain scenarios. Also I wouldn't describe 1400 stars late game smooth going either.



BigWolfChris -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/14/2011 4:10:31 PM)

Always had that problem
Just always presumed it was due to the game not currently being optimized fully yet (either CPU or Graphic rendering optimized)



Shark7 -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/14/2011 5:15:46 PM)

Most likely grahpics, I've found that when I experience the slowdown at zoom out, going to the planet/ship view completely eliminates the slowdown...processing doesn't seem to be the issue, but rendering all the stuff going on to the screen does.



Baleur -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/15/2011 7:56:15 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: unclean

quote:

ORIGINAL: V for Vegas
I am running a system which has all of these specs, but the game still seems to lag and stutter, even with only 500 planet systems. What are some optimisation tips?


There's a few:
In advanced settings, turn of nebulae - HUGE performance boost.


So true.. I wish i could have nebulas but for some reason they drain down my fps when zooming in our out like crazy, or not really fps but.. It stutters like crazy, every single zoom level takes a sec or two to load.
I really dont know why, other games can manage it, this game cant. I do hope a graphics engine rewrite is in the plans for Distant Worlds 2.

Also if the dev's are reading, the option to turn off nebulae does NOT affect the actual gas clouds, so when zooming into those it still stutters like nuts.



solops -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/16/2011 4:36:38 PM)

So what do I have to do to get DW to use my multi-core? Is it automatic?



Raap -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/16/2011 5:03:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: caerr

Since this is somewhat of a general performance thread, is anyone having extreme slowdown issues when there is lots of stuff happening on the screen?

One specific case might be the kaltor infested base you need to investigate along the storyline.

Or just large scale battles with maybe hundreds of guns firing at the same time.

I have quad core 3ghz, HD5850, 4 gigs of ram and Win 7 and I've managed to get below one frame per second in certain scenarios. Also I wouldn't describe 1400 stars late game smooth going either.

Strangely, no. I always play 1400 stars, and zoomed in to system view everything is smooth here no matter how much stuff is happening or how many ships are fighting. This even at 4x speed, which is my default. I only get slowdowns/choppiness late in the game, and even then it's only when zooming out so that at least 1/4 of the total galaxy is visible. Pretty much anything else is perfectly smooth( except opening ships/bases windows and such, of course). I only have a slightly better system than you( c2Q 3.8ghz, 8gb ram, 5870) and I'm also running Win7, so it's kind of odd.

You're using latest video card drivers and such? I also have the in-game fps capped at 70fps through the game-menu, though I'm unsure if that has anything to do with it.



Spacecadet -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/16/2011 6:19:28 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tampa_Gamer

Shark7, on a related note I am on the same quest of replacing my beloved Viewsonic p225f CRT. I build a new system about every 3 years, but I have held on to my CRT since it has been great for gaming at 1600x1200 85hz for years. Unfortunately, it has recently started to fade badly (e.g. brightness and contrast at almost 100% and I am still having trouble seeing certain things in dark games) so I too am looking for a 23-26" LCD/LED. I have managed to thoroughly confuse myself looking at the usual forums (Anandtech, Toms Hardware and Hardforum.com). Just when I think I have found the perfect match, I find there is a significant flaw that turns me off (most recently this was with the Dell U2311H that everyone seems hyped up about but appears to have a recall going on.
So if you find something, please let me know and I will do the same. Thanks


Pretty much in the same boat as you.
My CRT seems/ed to be getting dimmer and dimmer so I've been looking into LCD's for a couple of months.

I really don't like anything I've seen about any of them [:(]

I finally broke down to choosing between a Dell U2410 and the ASUS VW266H - I definitely wanted 1920 x 1200 and not 1080.

Ended up going with the ASUS VW266H as there was talk of the Dell having a "grainy" or "dirty" look to it from the anti-glare coating. I've seen that "dirty" look on other Monitors and didn't care for it.

Still tweaking the ASUS, but it's pretty crisp and was a pretty good deal for the price.


DW sure looks different on it, I can tell you that [8D]








caerr -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/16/2011 8:38:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Raap
Strangely, no. I always play 1400 stars, and zoomed in to system view everything is smooth here no matter how much stuff is happening or how many ships are fighting. This even at 4x speed, which is my default. I only get slowdowns/choppiness late in the game, and even then it's only when zooming out so that at least 1/4 of the total galaxy is visible. Pretty much anything else is perfectly smooth( except opening ships/bases windows and such, of course). I only have a slightly better system than you( c2Q 3.8ghz, 8gb ram, 5870) and I'm also running Win7, so it's kind of odd.

You're using latest video card drivers and such? I also have the in-game fps capped at 70fps through the game-menu, though I'm unsure if that has anything to do with it.


Can you do a quick test? Design a starport with around 200 area weapons and spawn 100 or so enemy ships around it, you can do it quickly by entering the editor. If you have smooth fps on that one I definitely have some sort of problem.



Zhany -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/16/2011 10:15:29 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: caerr


quote:

ORIGINAL: Raap
Strangely, no. I always play 1400 stars, and zoomed in to system view everything is smooth here no matter how much stuff is happening or how many ships are fighting. This even at 4x speed, which is my default. I only get slowdowns/choppiness late in the game, and even then it's only when zooming out so that at least 1/4 of the total galaxy is visible. Pretty much anything else is perfectly smooth( except opening ships/bases windows and such, of course). I only have a slightly better system than you( c2Q 3.8ghz, 8gb ram, 5870) and I'm also running Win7, so it's kind of odd.

You're using latest video card drivers and such? I also have the in-game fps capped at 70fps through the game-menu, though I'm unsure if that has anything to do with it.


Can you do a quick test? Design a starport with around 200 area weapons and spawn 100 or so enemy ships around it, you can do it quickly by entering the editor. If you have smooth fps on that one I definitely have some sort of problem.



I tried this on my system Core I7 870 4gb ddr3 ram gtx470 video card and I defiantly got a major slow down when the 200 area effect weapons went off but was otherwise game play was smooth when the area weapons did not fire.



Raap -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/16/2011 10:15:57 PM)

I'll see if I can try it out when I get home. I certainly think it's possible to slow the game to a crawl though, the lag I have on the zoomed out galaxy map would indicate such, but it hasn't actually happened in any regular game situation for me. Then again, I rarely actually see the AI using bigger fleets than 40'ish ships tops, and when I send my torpedo ships to wipe those fleets out it's always a smooth battle.

Maybe it could be AoE weapons causing it? I'd assume even a single fire from such a weapon likely has more of a performance impact than 10 other ships firing. I never really use them myself since they just destroy my own ships unless they are flying completely solo. Also kind of annoying to have my space ports destroying every civilian ship close to them, both my own and allies', if I mount them with AoE weapons.



caerr -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/17/2011 1:27:22 PM)

It's not just AoE weapons specifically, however they seem to cause the worst kind of performance hit for me. Like you said, maybe something to do with so many hit calculations happening at the same time. My game also ran smooth when nobody was firing, and then below single digits.

This somehow reminds me of PSG slowdowns from the X space sim series.



Raap -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/17/2011 3:12:52 PM)

I tried your scenario myself now, and I definitely have significant slowdowns when the space port is firing its AoE weapons. Seems to be smooth when only the ships are firing on the space port however.

Regarding AoE weapons, I wasn't necessarily talking about hit calculations though that could certainly be part of it. But if that was a problem, then the whole game should slow down even if you were viewing another system at the time of the battle, since it would indicate a CPU bottleneck. It could be just the huge sprite or whatever that makes up the actual AoE graphics; it's probably much more graphically intensive than the rather small laser and torpedo sprites, especially when there's dozens of them at the same time.

I guess modern video cards just aren't designed with intensive 2D graphics like these in mind.



caerr -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/17/2011 7:53:54 PM)

Out of curiosity I did the scenario again, but this time I monitored my cpu and gpu usage. I was expecting to see either gpu or cpu at 100%, or something simple like that. Unfortunately that wasn't the case.

Single core usage seemed very high, even while paused. Gpu got occasional spikes up to 80%, but was idling a surprising amount of time.

I don't really know what to make of it, it may be that this aspect of the game isn't fully optimized yet.



Raap -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/17/2011 8:32:28 PM)

Yeah, same as me. It's usually maxing out one core and sometimes parts of another, and the GPU usage is usually around 0%. Since this isn't 3D, the video card isn't really using its potential(shaders, geometry and such). Not sure there's anything the developers can actually do about that problem though. Unless hardware acceleration isn't already implemented. It could be the game's using the CPU for both graphics and gameplay.



Setekh -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/18/2011 2:00:58 AM)

It's not using a hardware renderer. That's why your video card is practically idling.
It's rendering 2d images via the software renderer (CPU)



Shark7 -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/18/2011 3:18:26 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Setekh

It's not using a hardware renderer. That's why your video card is practically idling.
It's rendering 2d images via the software renderer (CPU)



While the 3d hardware is not in use, the software renderer still has to generate all those textures (and size, as in pixel size, matters. A 1024 x 1024 texture will render faster than a 2048 x 2048 texture, etc)...hence the slowdown. This is the reason the modding guide suggests that added in shipsets all have their .png set to 200 x 200 in size.

Even with 3d, the biggest drain on your graphics is not the geometry, but the textures, shaders and shadows...however, a high poly model would be harder on the system.

For example, if the game were 3d, many of the ships in my shipset would be very stressful on the graphics renderer, the geometry in some of those models is in excess of 150k polygons after subdivision.



Nibelung44 -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/18/2011 10:52:57 AM)

I don't want to appears trolling, because I would really like to play this game (an excellent design anyway), but I can't (play it). Because even paused, I get stutters and hiccups... And I have a very decent computer (4 core, 8 gig of RAM etc.). I updated my video driver to no avail also.
That it only uses software rendering don't surprise me though. Windows display a bit slowly with several apparent refresh seen.



WoodMan -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/18/2011 11:00:27 AM)

Scrolling isn't exactly smooth in the sector view and such, its actually smoother in parts where there are less stars, the screen even actually scrolls faster there and then when I get to the dense centre of the galaxy it scrolls slower.

As for zoomed in, turning down the nebula background graphics to low made a massive difference.  I get slow down when around loads of Kaltors and also when fighting battles near Gas Giants(thats weird) but I would estimate, not having actually recorded it using Fraps, that its more around the 15fps mark at these points.  At other times, there is generally no performance issue other than scrolling while zoomed out.



J HG T -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/18/2011 11:58:27 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Nibelung44

I don't want to appears trolling, because I would really like to play this game (an excellent design anyway), but I can't (play it). Because even paused, I get stutters and hiccups... And I have a very decent computer (4 core, 8 gig of RAM etc.). I updated my video driver to no avail also.
That it only uses software rendering don't surprise me though. Windows display a bit slowly with several apparent refresh seen.



Strange...
I have 3.2 Ghz P4 and 1 gig of RAM and I can play the game just fine. Only when the fleets and battles start to get really big the performance starts to suffer greatly. It's still fully playable even with these slowdowns.
Hope the patches optimize the graphics-engine more.



Data -> RE: Multie Core use and efficiency, questions. (1/18/2011 12:01:32 PM)

ya, we'd need like a gaalian graphics-engine with some cool module and artefact [:)]



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