cat herding question ? (Full Version)

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Timmeh -> cat herding question ? (1/17/2011 12:00:09 PM)

GC 41' pbem, 8 surrenders first turn. Several Russian units still routed in the now german owned ZOC pockets.


Looking at pic, (start 2nd turn) several units still routed. I assume these units will bounce back to Russian held territory, no surrender and escaped men and machines if attacked this turn ?

[image]local://upfiles/19119/3E62EE1A606E4BAAA89B30FEC8744A24.jpg[/image]


edit. only unit moved was the one SEC to the northern most pocket. I guess I need an experienced player to confirm that I should wait to attack these still routed units.




Muzrub -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/17/2011 12:11:30 PM)

I'm also unsure what to do with routed units- should I leave them and confirm a pocket or drive right through them.




Timmeh -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/17/2011 12:14:11 PM)


I know they take a hit in numbers when they relocate, but poop! I'd of been much better off had these units rallied to start turn two then...




vinnie71 -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/17/2011 12:22:19 PM)

Aren't routed units in pockets destroyed if attacked on the subsequnt turn after they rout?




Timmeh -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/17/2011 12:43:06 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Offworlder

Aren't routed units in pockets destroyed if attacked on the subsequnt turn after they rout?


confirmed, sorry to create any doubt there... just attacked and yes, units routed and attacked the next turn in a pocket are destroyed.




byron13 -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/18/2011 4:47:32 AM)

Well, let me ask that question again. If I recall, I've had the area between Konigsberg and Riga pocketed and, on the following turn attacked routed units. I'm pretty sure they bounce onto the island/peninsula north of Riga. I haven't understood that since I did understand that pocketed routed units are supposed to shatter. Does it have something to do with naval transport or something?




cookie monster -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/18/2011 4:52:49 AM)

They can rout outta the port

if they are completely surrounded for one turn and not in a hex with a port they will surrender




Muzrub -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/18/2011 5:19:43 AM)

So you should leave routed units be?




Klydon -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/18/2011 5:31:05 AM)

If you can leave routed units alone that you can pocket next turn, then that works the best, but sometimes they are sitting in the wrong spots (where you want to go for example and there is not a good way around where they are). 




randallw -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/18/2011 5:42:41 AM)

If you move up to a routed unit it will run away, in some possibly random direction, for an unspecific amount of hexes.




PMCN -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/18/2011 8:18:17 AM)

The manual says they have chance to shatter depending on their current morale else they just pike off towards a rail line hex nearer their HQ or if that is not possible what radnallw said.

Added in Edit:
Changed "...will shatter..." to "...have chance to shatter depending on their current morale else..." after having re-read the manual on this point. There is also some more complexities to the surrender rules but they mainly would seem applicable to German units being compressed in a pocket.




56ajax -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/18/2011 9:01:54 AM)

generally speaking if you bump into a routed unit it tends to relocate in an easterly direction, which as the AXIS, is the last thing you want...so i leave them alone...




bwheatley -> RE: cat herding question ? (1/18/2011 3:52:16 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: byron13

Well, let me ask that question again. If I recall, I've had the area between Konigsberg and Riga pocketed and, on the following turn attacked routed units. I'm pretty sure they bounce onto the island/peninsula north of Riga. I haven't understood that since I did understand that pocketed routed units are supposed to shatter. Does it have something to do with naval transport or something?


I think routed units only shatter if they are grouped with a combat unit and forced to "retreat".

Here is a snip from the manual

Next, each unit must check to see if it shatters or routs. A unit that is in Supply and forced
to retreat may shatter at the conclusion of the combat instead of retreating if it is extremely
weak due to a combination of low morale, experience and TOE percentage and is no longer
considered a viable combat unit. A unit that is already routed may shatter if in a hex that is
attacked and forced to retreat (15.9.2). A combat unit that is in Supply and forced to retreat
will rout at the conclusion of combat if the final combat value odds ratio is greater than the
morale of the unit. For example, at the conclusion of a battle, a unit with morale of forty will
rout if the attacker’s adjusted CV is greater than forty times the defender’s adjusted CV. The
exception is that if a unit has a valid hex to retreat to, then it will not be susceptible to a rout
as long as it passes a check where the unit Morale is greater than or equal to 40+die(15).
This means that units with morale that is 55 or greater will never rout. Units that rout will
perform a displacement move instead of a normal retreat (15.9.4, 15.10). Support units suffer
the same fate as that suffered by the unit they are attached to, although support units never
remain routed.




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