RE: Testing WITE

RE: Testing WITE (Full Version)

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Gary Grigsby's War in the East Series

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FredSanford3 -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 3:40:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 From Matix's own site "Gary Grigsby’s War in the East represents a truly epic representation of the Second World War on the Eastern Front and is unparalleled in its scale, detail, and ambition! but unfortunately in its original form, which cost me a lot of money, it is flawed as proved by many threads and comments on this forum. All I am saying is that Matrix, or 2by3 games, should have have said this is a not fully developed and possibly flawed product on release and asked those of us who bought it to help in its testing, not sold it to us as a "finished product". whatever, man. I bet they'll give you a refund if you email Joel.

bairdlander2 -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 3:44:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 Matrix, or 2by3 games, should have have said this is a not fully developed and possibly flawed product on release and asked those of us who bought it to help in its testing, not sold it to us as a "finished product". If they said that before release no one would have bought it and we would not be able to give feedback,as we have been to the devs since release.I dont know why you dont understand this.Its the same for every piece of software released.Let the customers do the testing.I dont have a problem with it.Its better then them releasing product and saying "go f*** yourselves were not going to do any more work or release any patches".

randallw -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 3:45:20 AM)
The only awful ( or should I say significant ) programming problem i've personally perceived is the problem of fighter units not going up to defend air bases. Other people have commented that AA fire is not decently effective. Did I ever feel that the game, out of the box, was not a proper product, and should not have been released? No.

Senno -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 3:46:13 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 From Matix's own site "Gary Grigsby’s War in the East represents a truly epic representation of the Second World War on the Eastern Front and is unparalleled in its scale, detail, and ambition! but unfortunately in its original form, which cost me a lot of money, it is flawed as proved by many threads and comments on this forum. All I am saying is that Matrix, or 2by3 games, should have have said this is a not fully developed and possibly flawed product on release and asked those of us who bought it to help in its testing, not sold it to us as a "finished product". You've not played any MMO's have you? They are under constant revision and rebalancing, for example. NeverWinter Nights patched quite often, as I recall. And the fact that the game works out of the box on untold numbers of systems, even homemade systems, mitigates against your charge of not finished product. You are also ignoring the users who disagree that things are severely out of balance, or think that beta 5/6 has corrected some of the percieved flaws with the '41 blizzard. In short, things may or may not be in perfect balance. But you are asking for a lot if you expect any company to admit they sold you a non-working product. Hello lawsuit in this litigious climate. I have taken your complaints seriously, but the fact that you start making them on a weekend, tickles the back of my head a bit. If things were so serious, wouldn't a weekday when more official types were about be more reasonable time to file this complaint?

2ndACR -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 3:48:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 From Matix's own site "Gary Grigsby’s War in the East represents a truly epic representation of the Second World War on the Eastern Front and is unparalleled in its scale, detail, and ambition! but unfortunately in its original form, which cost me a lot of money, it is flawed as proved by many threads and comments on this forum. All I am saying is that Matrix, or 2by3 games, should have have said this is a not fully developed and possibly flawed product on release and asked those of us who bought it to help in its testing, not sold it to us as a "finished product". No, the game was playable right out of the box and stable. We are a vocal and opinionated group. But we also have faith in 2by3 and Matrix. They listen and correct. There is not a single game released that does not have issues in them. The game is even very enjoyable against the AI. No game company can match the finding issues that a huge fan base can find. Same for the "never thought anyone would try that strategy" that shows up when a game is released. Just a fact of life. Now, that said, if it was ANY other game company than 2by3/Matrix, I would be leery. But I have been around a while, along with a lot of us. The only game of 2by3 I don't own is World at War, but it is just not for me. I have the utmost faith that issues will get resolved, and the game will only get better. So, how about just sitting back, play the game, find issues, report them and have some faith. Name me one game outside of the Matrix family that has had this many player requests, fixes in this short of time frame? Good luck. I have a slew of games that never got fixed.

bdtj1815 -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 3:51:01 AM)
Many of you are misrepresenting my comments. I love this game but just think it wrong for a company to sell a game, for a pretty hefty price, and then expect us, "the players", to make it right on a forum. How many people who paid their money, don't visit the forum every day like I do to find the patches, are playing a flawed game? Forget the questions of game balance, but units arriving at the wrong time, UI problems etc. SORRY for Ł70 I do expect a game of this sort to be up to scratch on release. This is not a console shoot-me-up game. PS. From a thread above can someone tell me what a "MMO" game is? And to Senno, why is it being a weekend so strange, it is when we have most time, and as Matrix and 2by3 are so amateur I would have thought it is most likely it is when their personnel are available to comment

Templer_12 -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 3:52:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Senno quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 From Matix's own site "Gary Grigsby’s War in the East represents a truly epic representation of the Second World War on the Eastern Front and is unparalleled in its scale, detail, and ambition! but unfortunately in its original form, which cost me a lot of money, it is flawed as proved by many threads and comments on this forum. All I am saying is that Matrix, or 2by3 games, should have have said this is a not fully developed and possibly flawed product on release and asked those of us who bought it to help in its testing, not sold it to us as a "finished product". You've not played any MMO's have you? They are under constant revision and rebalancing, for example. NeverWinter Nights patched quite often, as I recall. And the fact that the game works out of the box on untold numbers of systems, even homemade systems, mitigates against your charge of not finished product. You are also ignoring the users who disagree that things are severely out of balance, or think that beta 5/6 has corrected some of the percieved flaws with the '41 blizzard. In short, things may or may not be in perfect balance. But you are asking for a lot if you expect any company to admit they sold you a non-working product. Hello lawsuit in this litigious climate. I have taken your complaints seriously, but the fact that you start making them on a weekend, tickles the back of my head a bit. If things were so serious, wouldn't a weekday when more official types were about be more reasonable time to file this complaint? bdtj1815 sounds British. Maybe he is out of tea? [8\|]

bairdlander2 -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 3:53:59 AM)
It is what it is and nothing we can do but wait for patches.They are working on them,its not like they are sitting in the tropics drinking margaritas and counting the money we spent.

2ndACR -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 3:55:43 AM)
No, not misunderstanding you at all. A game this complex, will always have some teething problems. Like I said above, if it was ANY other company, I too would be leery. But this is 2by3 and Matrix we are talking about. We get to talk to the Devs themselves. They are active, support is active. Unlike alot of other game companies out there. MOO3 anyone?

Mynok -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 3:59:14 AM)
Amen. Witp had issues out of the box. 2by3 corrected them over time. They are a responsive developer I have utmost confidence in. Their track record speaks for itself. In the meantime, I'm having great fun playing it as it is, despite its flaws. How is this a problem? Don't see it.

bdtj1815 -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:02:09 AM)
quote: bdtj1815 sounds British. Maybe he is out of tea? No English actually, and still celebrating our victory today over the French!!

Senno -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:03:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 Many of you are misrepresenting my comments. I love this game but just think it wrong for a company to sell a game, for a pretty hefty price, and then expect us, "the players", to make it right on a forum. How many people who paid their money, don't visit the forum every day like I do to find the patches, are playing a flawed game? Forget the questions of game balance, but units arriving at the wrong time, UI problems etc. SORRY for Ł70 I do expect a game of this sort to be up to scratch on release. This is not a console shoot-me game. I don't believe they expect us to? You have completely inverted the relationship and seem to be holding their openness and willingness to communicate with players against them... Many developers are not like that at all. And don't release patches when things don't work. The game was completely playable out of the box, and has been improved with every patch. And your migrating list of complaints is making the itch at the back of my head worse.... MMO= Massively Multiplayer Online; Warcraft, Ultima Online, City of Heroes, for example. As to it being the weekend: You can see who is online as easily as I. I see one official type name now, after none for the last several hours. Server time is 4:03 AM or so. How many official complaints do you file at your bank at 4:03 AM on a Sunday? Most people like to keep regular office hours, if possible. Being available at all hours isn't a wonderful thing, if you're the one who has to do it. So your charge coming as late as it does is kinda like releasing bad news at 5:00 on Friday, when the newsrooms are closed down til Monday. The 24 hours cable news cycle has changed this a bit, but it's still done now, seemingly as a tradition, lawl.

Templer_12 -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:03:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mynok Amen. Witp had issues out of the box. 2by3 corrected them over time. They are a responsive developer I have utmost confidence in. Their track record speaks for itself. In the meantime, I'm having great fun playing it as it is, despite its flaws. How is this a problem? Don't see it. Absolutely! And what a brilliant, fantastic software that's today! [&o] And whenever a new patch for WitE comes out, there is always a new challenger in the game.

bdtj1815 -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:13:09 AM)
What is "starcraft II"?

bcgames -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:26:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 "I bought this game on the day it was released and I think it has many things going for it. What I did not realise when I paid my Ł70 was that I was not buying a finished product. So far I have had to download six patches and still I read that the "game will only be balanced" "possibly in a year" when enough people play it who can point out its faults. 35 years ago my first wargame, bought as a present for my fifteenth birthday, was "Drang nach Osten" by GDW. In real terms it probably cost in 1974 more than WITE today but worked "straight out of the box" and is still playable today without amy major modifications. When I bought WITE I wish someone had written on the Matrix website that "this game will be great when you all find what is wrong with it now". bdtj1815, It sounds like we have walked the same path. I bought DNO way back in the 70's and shelled out the additional $12.95 (or whatever it was) for the expansion game, "Unentschieden". My brother and I played this set of games over and over again; it was all great fun. Later, I bought Fire in the East...and we played some more. Now it is 2011 and I eagerly await the release of "Total War" for $195: Total War by HMS/GRD One of these days, I hope somebody will get that board game right! Until then? I'll keep investing in the effort...cuz the results keep getting better. Even boardgames have "patches" (aka "errata" in the old days). Hang in there. It's the journey that counts and changes are always exciting--for the good or ill. [8D]

Angelo -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:29:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 What is "starcraft II"? Now I know your having one on us! [:D]

bdtj1815 -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:29:31 AM)
Lots of Matrix "Legion of Merit"ers and "Veterans" reply so presumably friends of the company, but I am sorry but WITE was released as an unbalanced and unfinished product and unlike "war in space22" (or whatever) should try and recreate the history it advertises as purporting to represent . For gods sake most of you have posted to this effect in other threads. Can you not see my point. That many people who do not have your commitment to this product, and do not follow this forum religiously, did still expect, especially after how it was advertised, the ultimate "War in the East" game might be disappointed.

Senno -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:31:23 AM)
I'm not quite that old, but I did play GDW's The Third World War series, and set them all up on one giant dining room table to play all together. Man 1 turn took days...... And yes, the errata came in the box, and as games in the series were released, they fixed rules and counters from the older games with errata to errata, lawl.... The "good old days" are best viewed with rose tinted glasses.....[;)]

cookie monster -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:31:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: randallw The only awful ( or should I say significant ) programming problem i've personally perceived is the problem of fighter units not going up to defend air bases. Other people have commented that AA fire is not decently effective. Its not a programming problem you just have to set your fighter interception doctrine to 100-150%. Read this http://witewiki.com/index.php/Air_Doctrine Massed AA is deadly.

bcgames -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:33:05 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 Can you not see my point. Yes, I do.

Senno -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:37:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 Lots of Matrix "Legion of Merit"ers and "Veterans" reply so presumably friends of the company, but I am sorry but WITE was released as an unbalanced and unfinished product and unlike "war in space22" (or whatever) should try and recreate the history it advertises as purporting to represent . For gods sake most of you have posted to this effect in other threads. Can you not see my point. That many people who do not have your commitment to this product, and do not follow this forum religiously, did still expect, especially after how it was advertised, the ultimate "War in the East" game might be disappointed. I'm sorry, but having an issue with a segment of the game does not equate to "unbalanced and unfinished" game. You are entitled to your viewpoint, of course. But we are also entitled to ours, and do disagree. We will have to agree to disagree I suppose. And I bid you good morning (good night for me).

2ndACR -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:38:21 AM)
Those Legion of Merit and such goes by post count. Just like yours says recruit. Not friend of company per se. But ever since I found Matrix Games, I cannot remember any other game I bought from any other company. The support here is superb. They have always been responsive. Spent since I have spent a lot of money with them, I guess I fall into their friend category. There will be no making you happy I guess, and I cannot convince you. I have faith, because I know it will only get better with time. Mainly because neither Matrix nor 2by3 has ever let me down. Ever. Not once. And probably never will. Have a good day.

bdtj1815 -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:40:29 AM)
quote: quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 What is "starcraft II"? Now I know your having one on us Why?

bcgames -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:42:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: 2ndACR I have faith, because I know it will only get better with time. Mainly because neither Matrix nor 2by3 has ever let me down. Ever. Not once. And probably never will. There it is. It's the journey. Come along.

Templer_12 -> You're shameless! (2/27/2011 4:46:59 AM)
Friend of the company? Now I'm offended! [sm=mad-1003.gif] [sm=character0272.gif]I am a Matrix fanboy! [sm=character0272.gif]

Angelo -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:49:39 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 quote: quote: ORIGINAL: bdtj1815 What is "starcraft II"? Now I know your having one on us Why? You never heard of Starcraft?

cookie monster -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:50:53 AM)
Ive never heard of starcraft. But I only play WITPAE and WITE.

Templer_12 -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:51:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: 2ndACR Those Legion of Merit and such goes by post count. Just like yours says recruit. Not friend of company per se. But ever since I found Matrix Games, I cannot remember any other game I bought from any other company. The support here is superb. They have always been responsive. Spent since I have spent a lot of money with them, I guess I fall into their friend category. There will be no making you happy I guess, and I cannot convince you. I have faith, because I know it will only get better with time. Mainly because neither Matrix nor 2by3 has ever let me down. Ever. Not once. And probably never will. Have a good day. Word for word - I will sign this! [8D] Wise words from a Texan. Cowboys do it all!

Angelo -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:55:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cookie monster Ive never heard of starcraft. But I only play WITPAE and WITE. Ok, start here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StarCraft. I'm a wargame fanboy have been since the early 70's and even I will admit that Starcraft is a great game.

cookie monster -> RE: Testing WITE (2/27/2011 4:56:31 AM)
I checked out the mans prior posts. He was bitchin about a game in 2006. Only posts to moan. Unconstructively.........................................

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