games and RPing (Full Version)

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Data -> games and RPing (4/10/2011 8:28:56 AM)

We all seek certain things in games and we can resort to RP when we don't find them. I, for example, am still looking for something like this:

1) To be able to walk inside my ship and repair/equip it like an actual engineer (have the inventory like in xcom for example)

2) To be able to walk outside the ship on planetary surfaces and explore / research ancient civs (something similar to starcon)

...and much more.

From a strict RP point of view rpg and adventure games (SQ still rules here) fit the bill but there every option you have is related to the storyline and you're not free to go much beyond it.

Have tried tons of games to find this ideal setup but the ones that allowed me to properly RP are SR2 and DW. A good game will offer you plenty of elements for RP but a great one will already have them incorporated in the game itself.

So here it is: given all that you're looking in the ideal game which actual games did offer you the least trouble with RPing? [:)]



Bingeling -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 9:07:59 AM)

Strange wish to have a game do all that, unless...

Eve Online got station walks in the pipeline. But is not what you describe.

The Old Republic may be good (I hope so), and will have some of this. But this will of course be a mammoth theme park MMO.



EaglePryde -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 9:29:30 AM)

It's hard to find the ideal Game. There are some that come close but are then missing features you'd find in a different game. Games are somehow a mix and match where all nice stuff are scattered among them but none has somehow every possible feature you'd wish for (just talking about 1 genre).

I'm not talking about putting FPS into 4X space games but rather following example.

GalCiv2 had this very nice ship building stuff and was very nicely done in many ways. I just found it lacking from the battle perspective where you couldn't do anything.

Sins of a Solar Empire hat a fluid and "Self control" combat but was heavily lacking in RP (Empire/Planet) managment and customization options for ships/stations/etc.

Ai War had this brilliant setup regarding tactical build up and combat and the AI was brutal but had nothing else.

Star Ruler is very much sandbox and young but at present has not much RP value and i doubt it will.

Those are just a few examples.

DW is compared to others the most complete game in this genre up to date and imho has a good foudation for adding even more RP value in the future without having to sacrifice any other feature.

I suppose this is what your trying to say, that a rather "complete" game isn't found that easy.



Data -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 9:35:29 AM)

Indeed but....one can only dream [:)]



EaglePryde -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 10:20:34 AM)

Hmm..I don't know it would work but i'd have to come up with an idea for a game like DW to get those 2 features in i would try to do it this way.

I would do them like a very simple minigame.

1.) I would reorganize ship layout to be a grid, maybe even multilayer like in Space Empires V. I would add crew to every ship that is split up into technical/security etc. like in Star Trek. You could issue repair orders if you have the needed crew and repair bays through simple clicks on the damaged section/component. If you loose some of your staff your ship could get stranded in space.

2.) security staff could be for defence against boarding

The second thing about planet exploration would be like this:

Ships can find ancient ruins but as the player youd have to bring a ship there yourself or use the scout who found the ruins. From this ship you could send down a search team to the planet. You'd be able to see the same grid type setup like in my previous ship suggestion. You could split your search team among the grid to look closer in each section. After a random amount of time you'd get feedback if you have found something or not. If you haven't you'll send your people to another section in the grid to search there. This way you'll search the whole planet until you uncover the ruins.

You could also search planets without having found ruins becacuse your scanning tech could be to low or because some techs can only be found this way.
Maybe you'd be able to find some minor civilization through it who could then become allies or just another minor faction in the universe. In theory this could be expanded even further :)

This would add a bit of RP value twords those 2 things and could be done during some "off time" [:D]



J HG T -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 10:31:20 AM)

To answer Datas original question:

DW, SR2, Deus Ex (I will defend this games name to DEATH! Don't get me started!), Fallout 1, Fallout 3 & New Vegas (I love them personally. The only problem they have is the dated engine which causes all the other problems) and Freelancer (In some degree. Had lots of lost potential).
There's probably some more but these are the ones I remember right away.

Honorable mention go to Mass Effect 1 & 2. Not RPGs in the common sense, but still great story-driven RPGs.

What I'd personally like to see in DW is features that help to understand the habits and way of living of each race. We have a basic information of each race which we can use to relate to them, but we don't have any insight how the individuals of the race live and go on in their daily lives, or how their society works in general. This may sound trivial but I think it's important in SciFi to tell as much as possible about each race. Good examples here would be Mass Effect, Sword of the Stars and Space Rangers 2.

The more you understand, the more you care. The more you care, the more you can relate. The more you relate, The better for RPing.

I hope the next expansion adds all kinds of cultural and social aspects to research and population management. This would make the people and aliens of your empire feel something more than just numbers in the info-screen.





Shuul -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 11:12:26 AM)

Don't forget about X3: Terran conflict, with all the community mods and plugins it gives very much RP possibilities. Right now, in my game, i am the founder of new pirate clan, trying to survive in dangerous galaxy. Im hunted by Argon police and naval forces but have good reputation with other pirate clans, sometimes they give me cover, when im asking for it. Etc... Its really great game, where you can be a privateer, pirate, mercenary, smuggler, join naval forces etc... All the community work really expand games possibilities.



Data -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 11:23:34 AM)

Indeed, almost all these games are good examples and I've tried them all at one time or another. Except Deus Ex, will research a bit on it.
Thx for the feedback, guys.



J HG T -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 11:39:58 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Data
...Except Deus Ex...


Really, Data?

[image]http://i18.tinypic.com/48paeyc.jpg[/image]

It's widely considered as crime against humanity to un-install Deus Ex.



Bingeling -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 11:50:30 AM)

The strange thing about Deus Ex, is that it did not grab me the first time. Did not get far and left it.

Then I tried again... How I love that game [&o]. I still think the opening is less than stellar, though.

Another game that I struggled with getting going is Planescape: Torment, and that is probably my favorite game ever. Took a while to grab me, but what a grab.



Igard -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 12:33:21 PM)

I'm keeping my eye on The Old Republic, but the game I'm really looking forward to is The Elder Scrolls V.

Star Trek Online is fun at the moment with all the new user generated content and soon we'll see an episode almost every week. So it'll get better.



Shuul -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 1:49:58 PM)

Bad that from videos and screenshots Old republic looks just like many others WOW clones. StarWars content is great, but i want good fresh gameplay



Bingeling -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 1:58:46 PM)

I am a Bioware fan, and I don't really dislike WoW. I am just tired of WoW...

Some of the same principles and a new settings, new classes, new abilities. It will keep me entertained for a while. And I expect Old Republic to have high production values, how many game since WoW have had that? Age of Conan was for instance quite fun for a while, but it dried up, and content was far too tightly packed in zones. Also, there were holes in the levelling experience. That I tried my first instances and hated them did not help my interest in the game at all.

Of course, WoW also had holes, I played as Horde, and it could be tricky at some boundaries between zone levels if you did not plan well. The choice between too orange and too green. But Old Republic will compete with a mature WoW, and I expect no holes in the levelling curve, and some Bioware high quality content storywise. The danger is "too easy" and thus not interesting enough.

Will it be good? I hope so, but I am of course not sure it will grab me. But they will try to grab me. I am ready for a new MMO, but dropped Rift. It would not feel like a lasting experience anyways, with the Republic looming on the horizon. Maybe if the Old Republic sucks.



Torgrim -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 2:04:26 PM)

Still waiting for a remake of Star Control 2 :(

Can only dream i guess.



Shark7 -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 3:51:29 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: J HG T


quote:

ORIGINAL: Data
...Except Deus Ex...


Really, Data?

[image]http://i18.tinypic.com/48paeyc.jpg[/image]

It's widely considered as crime against humanity to un-install Deus Ex.



Yes, but what if you have it for PS2 and not PC? [;)]



Data -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 4:13:16 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Torgrim

Still waiting for a remake of Star Control 2 :(

Can only dream i guess.


We're all dreaming about remakes for a ton of good old games, StarCon 2 among the first of them...still puzzles me how no one attempts that (not to mention the one that attempt and fail really bad).



Data -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 4:14:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: J HG T


quote:

ORIGINAL: Data
...Except Deus Ex...


Really, Data?

[image]http://i18.tinypic.com/48paeyc.jpg[/image]

It's widely considered as crime against humanity to un-install Deus Ex.



High praise indeed, now I have to try it [:)]



J HG T -> RE: games and RPing (4/10/2011 4:31:40 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shark7

Yes, but what if you have it for PS2 and not PC? [;)]


Go catch a Grey Death.

Seriously though, I've never seen PS2 version in action or heard anything special about it. Apparently it was playable but wasn't really anywhere near the orginal PC version.
I play Deus Ex with HDTP and shifter mods. Makes it even better. Have to hate those one-shot PS20 headshots. Small but deadly gizmo that is.



Shark7 -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 5:08:44 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: J HG T


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shark7

Yes, but what if you have it for PS2 and not PC? [;)]


Go catch a Grey Death.

Seriously though, I've never seen PS2 version in action or heard anything special about it. Apparently it was playable but wasn't really anywhere near the orginal PC version.
I play Deus Ex with HDTP and shifter mods. Makes it even better. Have to hate those one-shot PS20 headshots. Small but deadly gizmo that is.



It was entertaining enough for me to replay it more than a few times. Though I might have to try and find a PC version in a bargain bin if yall keep up this talk about it.



Data -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 7:12:15 AM)

Deus Ex.....I just menntioned it [:D]



J HG T -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 7:19:31 AM)

You know the drill, Data. [:)]

I got the original PC CD Deus Ex as christmas present from my parents in the year 2000. Still the best present I've got in my life. I thank my parents every time I play it.



Data -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 7:30:19 AM)

Not sure if they thank each other for doing it though [:)]
But if you managed to get a social life regardless than all is ok.



J HG T -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 7:44:44 AM)

They trust my knowledge in things conserning gaming as I respect their experience in their jobs. Also, I've always been lone wolf type of person. Being alone long times doesn't bother me much and I actually enjoy it in some degree.

Damn, s**t is getting real. Better get back to the topic.



Shark7 -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 2:58:20 PM)

Hmm Deus Ex and Dues Ex Invisible War...available for DL at Gamestop for $20 each...

And yes, it IS all your fault Data! [:-]



Bingeling -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 3:22:33 PM)

I remember loving Deus Ex.
I remember buying and playing Invisible War. Strange that I can't remember much else about that one...



Data -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 4:09:18 PM)

Glad to hear of it, Shark ....old loves never die [:)]



Lord_Astraios -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 4:16:28 PM)

Nice games you mentioned there plus mods for them makes them more entertaining.

There's Parkan 2,  is actually fun to some point,  you get to board ships,  kill the crew and steal the cargo and the ship will self destruct after you kill everyone,  land on planets and stations then do your stuff,  colonize a planet,  if your ship gets attacked and boarded you need to get off the chair and defend your ship,  and do mission on the side,  attack ships

the bad part is when your in the middle of the campaing and doing a lot of stuff,  you will blow up a fuse because of seeing a lot of robots.  and no humans,  seriously,  in the story,  your fighting this guy in the start but when you get in to your ship something happens,  your ship ends up in a sector of the galaxy filled with a civilization of robots and you're the only human in it.  No variety on who you meet.



Data -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 4:52:56 PM)

Oo yes, I got my fix from Parkan 2 for a while but as you say it becomes really tedious after a while. Still, I know of no recent game other than this that implemented the first person exploring a ship and planetary surfaces thingy



MartialDoctor -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 4:58:11 PM)

One fairly recent one that hasn't been mentioned here is Jade Empire.  Played it on the Xbox myself.  It's been the only RPG I've ever gone back and played again.  I really got into the storyline and setting in that one.

And how can no one have mentioned Wing Commander yet?  One of the best game series ever... [:)]



Shark7 -> RE: games and RPing (4/11/2011 5:01:50 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Data

Glad to hear of it, Shark ....old loves never die [:)]


And there is a new Deus Ex coming out in July (IIRC). So now I'm really getting itchy to replay the first 2...and I may go for PC versions this time around.



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