RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (Full Version)

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Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (9/26/2011 7:47:36 PM)

Turn 131. December 16 1943. Bizzard.

Another wave of Soviet attacks hit the front from Voronezh and south.

[image]local://upfiles/37384/3EAA5FA23C1F4FCA8936AC5130EB9A91.jpg[/image]



Q-Ball -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (9/26/2011 9:00:21 PM)

That's my read: Hiwis do nothing if your armament pool is empty. Tarhunnas has about 150K Hiwis on the map or thereabouts, but with 185K Germans in the pool, it's just window dressing. It doesn't do anything.

I hope the powers that be are watching, because I think the Germans have an armament problem. The Germans SHOULD have a MANPOWER problem, and ultimately the Werhmacht should collapse because of a lack of men. But not a lack of Rifles.

You've only produced 3.5 mil armaments the whole game. In a 1.05 GC game, you start with 600,000, and I had run through that stockpile by turn 7.



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (9/26/2011 9:41:26 PM)

And a somewhat serious Soviet breakthrough at the Crimea...

[image]local://upfiles/37384/A320449F411740B6B62A74DB12A44878.jpg[/image]



gingerbread -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (9/26/2011 9:47:48 PM)

Sorry, I should have been more specific. How much of the 185k manpower is in the active pool? Quite a a lot ought to be in the transit pool, i.e. those that are beeing recycled from disbanded support squads.

I'm not saying there is no ARM issue. The starting pool is used to bring units up to formal TOE (e.g. AT-guns & Cav squads).



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (9/26/2011 9:53:31 PM)

The central front after Axis moves. Two guards rifle corps are firmly encircled, but otherwise the front has a ragged appearance....

[image]local://upfiles/37384/C36965B317714211A5E078ACBC4E4DBF.jpg[/image]



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (9/26/2011 9:56:40 PM)

Active pool, filtered to Germany.

[image]local://upfiles/37384/5E08DFDE91A14158B126A7131988B4DC.jpg[/image]



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (9/26/2011 9:57:22 PM)

And transit pool, likewise filtered to Germany.

[image]local://upfiles/37384/67E0086E048348A280083AC411BA38C9.jpg[/image]



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/2/2011 9:07:58 AM)

Turn 132. December 23 1943. Blizzard.

Panzer forces are railed in to handle the crisis at the Crimea. Hopefully we can repeat last years performance and cut off the Red cancer at its roots...

[image]local://upfiles/37384/51AE73EA7DDE462AB3DA6A47D8A3B60B.jpg[/image]



Speedysteve -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/2/2011 9:53:08 AM)

Doubt it will be a major problem. Once Soviet Arm and Mech units are out in the open, with no forts and a lack of infantry corps on hand they aren't too tough to deal with.



Peltonx -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/2/2011 10:32:54 AM)

The 47mm bug fix will give tarhunnas a big boost. He should now have more then enough arm pts a turn to start draining his manpower pools. My pool increased by 18k the first turn after patch went into effect. So if you manage pool right you have more then enough arm pts to keep all manpower at front. You should as per history have more then enough for art, but we have to see how that works out.



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/2/2011 11:28:44 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Pelton

The 47mm bug fix will give tarhunnas a big boost. He should now have more then enough arm pts a turn to start draining his manpower pools. My pool increased by 18k the first turn after patch went into effect. So if you manage pool right you have more then enough arm pts to keep all manpower at front. You should as per history have more then enough for art, but we have to see how that works out.


That sounds comforting. I had assumed that the effects of correcting bug would over, as the 47 mm AT guns are long gone.



BletchleyGeek -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/2/2011 12:16:23 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tarhunnas
That sounds comforting. I had assumed that the effects of correcting bug would over, as the 47 mm AT guns are long gone.


I'm pretty sure those über AT guns were killing a dozen T-60s with every shot :)



pauk -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/3/2011 5:19:34 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Speedy

Doubt it will be a major problem. Once Soviet Arm and Mech units are out in the open, with no forts and a lack of infantry corps on hand they aren't too tough to deal with.



pffft, your advices here are even worse than those in War in the Pacific forum [:'(].


Hey mate, are you playing this game?



Speedysteve -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/3/2011 7:47:21 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pauk


quote:

ORIGINAL: Speedy

Doubt it will be a major problem. Once Soviet Arm and Mech units are out in the open, with no forts and a lack of infantry corps on hand they aren't too tough to deal with.



pffft, your advices here are even worse than those in War in the Pacific forum [:'(].


Hey mate, are you playing this game?


Lol. Good to see you mate. Surprised to see you in here[;)]

I'm a tester for Wite. At least I was as I'm now at airport with wife for 3 month honeymoon. More testing when back. How are things? PM me



Speedysteve -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/3/2011 8:00:03 PM)

Sorry for the hijack Tarhunnas. Pauk's a funny one [;)]



pauk -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/4/2011 11:02:26 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Speedy

Sorry for the hijack Tarhunnas. Pauk's a funny one [;)]


yes, sorry for hijacking AAR. Speedy, ive sent you a PM.



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/7/2011 8:47:49 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pauk

yes, sorry for hijacking AAR.


NP. Nice tag BTW.

If anyone is wondering about the pause, Gids is busy with IRL matters so turns are a bit slow right now.



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/10/2011 10:31:56 PM)

Turn 133. December 30 1943.

A nasty situation has developed at the Donets, with Soviet attacks from north and south threatening to cut off the defenders. Map before Axis moves.

[image]local://upfiles/37384/2AD7153AD9A04014A0B71081E3D9488D.jpg[/image]



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/10/2011 10:34:25 PM)

And a sudden Soviet assault managed to push back the defenders of one hex of Moscow! [X(]

[image]local://upfiles/37384/89F9D4F7040A486DB358F462F08AFE93.jpg[/image]



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/11/2011 8:37:19 PM)

Losses after turn 133. Counterattacks bluunt the Soviet spearheads, but the ratio is not good enough.

[image]local://upfiles/37384/E57866CDE75C4FEA984076D7F92DDDE5.jpg[/image]



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/11/2011 8:39:34 PM)

And the armaments problem shows no sign of relief.

[image]local://upfiles/37384/28D1244E7DF44ADE9D99CDD13F23685A.jpg[/image]



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/13/2011 10:25:10 PM)

Turn 134. January 6 1944. Blizzard.

The German army is falling apart. Infantry strength is really low. This is a familiar sight by now... The central front.

Hmm, messed that up with the pictures. It should have been a picture with like 15-20 units all with CV 1... you get the idea... This is an overview of the southern front.

[image]local://upfiles/37384/F2687961D2784407B23EC7A3307D42E3.jpg[/image]



Tarhunnas -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/13/2011 10:26:44 PM)

Rifle squads.

[image]local://upfiles/37384/C3F24D667E2B476DA8CF90A4AF962B50.jpg[/image]



Q-Ball -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/14/2011 1:31:32 AM)

At least you are WAY in front of historical lines

Maybe it's time to think of a summer defense line WAY back.....the Dnepr, perhaps?

At this point, you might retreat a couple hexes a turn until MUD, halt, then retreat again.



Flaviusx -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/14/2011 2:17:50 AM)

What's killing you here is the armament shortage. The manpower is there. Close to a half million men in the pools, which is no joke. That would fix your infantry up.

We did nail that armaments bug, but even after that I'm not completely convinced the numbers are right in the late period of the war.

That being said, there's been so many changes to the game since you started this one that it's hard to get a read on things. A fresh start would give better results.

In the meantime, start falling back. You have a ton of space to play with here. You could seriously pull back all the way to Dnepr like Q-ball says and still be incredibly ahead of the game. He'd have a hard time punching past that until the 44-5 winter.




Peltonx -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/14/2011 3:56:42 AM)

Wow yes start building forts on the river, pull back after the ice is out 2 or 3 hexes a turn.

This could really help your manpower shortage. There should be a lack of fighting at that point, because it be hard a hell for him to get over that river.

You turn art ect units down to 50%? I set infantry at 80%

Yes the arm bug really hit you hard. In my games I am gaining about 10k per turn from turns 1-17 then close to 20k during mud. The game I started right after bug was fixed on turn 14 I have 150,000 arm in pool.

With light fighting ect from late 42 to late 43 you would have been able to stock pile a bunch and be using them now as needed.

You should still be fine with them rivers behind you still.

Pelton



Peltonx -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/14/2011 4:04:06 AM)

If you man power gets below 2.3 million your in trouble.

You have allot of tanks I start using them and giving the infantry a brake.

In my game vs Hoooper 2.3 million was the braking point. You need to shorten the front and start putting mech units in line, keep pz units in reserve.



Ketza -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/14/2011 4:22:10 AM)

Static mode is your new friend as Axis.



BletchleyGeek -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/14/2011 11:13:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ketza
Static mode is your new friend as Axis.


That can be quite dangerous when/if the Soviets manage to breakthrough and flank the static units. Being able to move just one hex to the west might well be not enough to restore the balance of your line. It also weakens somewhat the defense, since the vehicle shortage modifier would apply, although that won't be much for Infantry formations.



Peltonx -> RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) (10/14/2011 11:56:28 AM)

I hate to say it, but Tarhunnas will probably lose this game.

After looking at loses per turn, IF Gids keeps the pressure on the German army it will break in 4 to 6 turns at which point most of the German army becomes usless.

Gids will easly beable to advance 4 to 6 hexes per turn on average. The Red army will not be advancing faster then railheads so it can easly keep pushing 4 hex average. So with 120ish turns left Gids can easly be in Berlin long before the game ends, I dont thk hes more then 100 hexes from Berlin.

So even at 2 hexs a turn he can easly win.

This is another example of how far off the game is and not even close to historical at all.

German armerment production is about 50% lower then historical by my guess.

There should be a manpower shortage not an armerment shortage.

Again the game still is babysitting the Russian side way way to much.

Even with Tarhunnas pushing way past historical(12 mil in russian loses) and taking out far more then historical production he is probably going to lose the game or at best get a draw.

Is there some reason why as a German player we should bother invading Russia? There is zero reward for killing 12 mill reds, bagging more then historical production, bagging Leningrad, Moscow-Rostov and pushing way past historical.

The VP conditions are a total joke.
The russian rail system is a joke, way over rated.
The russian prodution system is a joke, manpower way way way over rated.
The german prodtuction system is a joke, the armerment prodution way under rated.

There is no way in hell that Russian moral would do anything other then tank with the losses of Moscow and Leningrad.

At some point the general babysitting of the Russian side needs to come to an end.

Pelton





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