Weapons choice (Full Version)

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daemon1129 -> Weapons choice (4/27/2011 9:49:48 AM)

So I start messing around with the designs and curious about what type of weapons on what type of ship. At first I thought I should put laser or area on "tanks" and missiles on Long Range ships. I didn't find the torpedo any good when missiles seems to be the same as them but no damage loss with distance. Turns out, all the battles I have either end up me swarming and destroying a system with surprise attack with overwhelming numbers, or just me defending, well with numbers once again. So how important are weapon choices? What about Ion? I don't see the point of it when I can easily destroy everything with numbers. Is it more of a personal preference? Or am I wrong?



Data -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 9:52:31 AM)

You're right. And also, the same reasoning for missiles worked for torps back in the day when there were no missiles and beam weapons were clearly less effective compared to torps.



cookie monster -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 10:20:29 AM)

What Data said.

I've just upgraded all my designs.

And what happens???!!!

The pirate frigates have appeared with titan beams and 100 firepower. Using my exact design.

I knew this day would come!



Data -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 12:49:00 PM)

Use only battleship designs for any purpose. The pirates can steal anything up to the ocassional cruiser but they won't have enough time to use battleships....only if you leave them alone.



cookie monster -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 2:17:54 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Data

Use only battleship designs for any purpose. The pirates can steal anything up to the ocassional cruiser but they won't have enough time to use battleships....only if you leave them alone.


So that would mean I'm stuck.

Surely I can't retro fit a frigate into a capital ship? I think not.

This strategy would have to be began at the start of the game?

I think the pirates on many has killed the AI's industry. I can deal with it, they can't.



daemon1129 -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 2:44:37 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Data

You're right. And also, the same reasoning for missiles worked for torps back in the day when there were no missiles and beam weapons were clearly less effective compared to torps.


I'm a bit confused with what you said. So does that mean whatever weapon type I use is fine? Or are you saying missiles are overpowered now? Also what about Area? I always fine them to be so close range its useless, but if I put 3 of them on a minning station they do well holding off small to even medium raids. The AI just seems to ram into my station in clusters and Area deals with them nice and easy.

quote:


Use only battleship designs for any purpose. The pirates can steal anything up to the ocassional cruiser but they won't have enough time to use battleships....only if you leave them alone.


By battleship do you mean Capital Ships? So even a capital ship with mining engine for mining purposes?



Data -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 2:50:01 PM)

Yes, afaik missiles are overrpowered now but not so much as torps used to be.
No, you don't need to use capital ship desigs for mining ships, the pirates only steal military designs.



cookie monster -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 2:52:48 PM)

He means use only capital ship designs for all military ships so as to prevent the pirates stealing your escort/frigate/destroyer designs.

You would have to do this from the start of the game however.

I don't think a 200 firepower pirate frigate is really in the spirit of the game myself.

For designs use maxos blasters then titan beams

Give them your best long range missile too

Loadsa fuel tanks at least 500.

Beg borrow and steal all race specific techs such as Haakonish Mega Density Fuel Cell, Sluken Engine Thrusters, Dhayut Hyperdrive

Take a look at the latest components under sort by type and pick what you need



daemon1129 -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 2:53:42 PM)

Good thing I wanted to use mainly missiles before realizing how much better they are compare to others.  So being overpowered won't ruin it for me.  But only build captial ships seem a bit boring.  Hopefully they will fix this?



Data -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 2:53:47 PM)

Indeed, you can't retrofit frigates into a capital ships and this should work from the start of the game.
But your observation about AI's industry is interesting, we could use this to feed better designs to the pirates; designs against we can figth but the AI could not.
For example, design a frigate with advanced but not recent tech to be stolen by the AI but you use a capital ship with latest generation tech.

Sadly, this is not that useful as we can beat the AI as it is without using exploits like this.



Foraven -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 4:08:31 PM)

Never seen the Pirates steal my designs yet... When does that happen? 

Edit : About weapons

I don't feel missiles are that overpowered; yes they are long ranged and don't lose damage over range, but they don't have that much damage potential so armors are pretty good at absorbing them (but AI's designs usually don't have much armor). Torps do a lot of damage but are terrible against fast moving targets that keep at range. Long range beams are good for kiting but not as damaging as maxos or the other blaster. Titan beams are a late game tech, they are meant to be much more powerful than the earlier ones.

In my game i designed a ship with tons of blasters and no shields, relying on armor and self repair as defense. It does rather well against space monsters and ships alike.



Data -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 7:15:42 PM)

quote:

Never seen the Pirates steal my designs yet... When does that happen?


all the time, even from the start of the game
not sure if there are particular conditions that determine this, everybody experiences it...since you don't maybe we should compare game setups, maybe we can find out what's different in our cases. Any particular setting that you use in all your games?



Foraven -> RE: Weapons choice (4/27/2011 11:24:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Data

quote:

Never seen the Pirates steal my designs yet... When does that happen?


all the time, even from the start of the game
not sure if there are particular conditions that determine this, everybody experiences it...since you don't maybe we should compare game setups, maybe we can find out what's different in our cases. Any particular setting that you use in all your games?


Play Human republic with a dozen of AIs (and allow independents to form empires). Use pretty much everything else at default. But there is no human pirates, that may be why they don't steal my designs.



Data -> RE: Weapons choice (4/28/2011 5:58:27 AM)

Hmm, interesting....if that is so we can edit some human pirates in the game and watch what designs they use. I'm out of the game for a while but this looks like a good excuse to get back into it.
Nice find, Foraven [sm=00000436.gif]



daemon1129 -> RE: Weapons choice (4/28/2011 6:38:16 AM)

I never experience that either. Perhaps it is because I always take out pirate bases ASAP, but ya.



Data -> RE: Weapons choice (4/28/2011 7:53:21 AM)

Yes, taking them out early prevents this. They can't prosper if you let them exist but prevent their attacks, they only develop if they succeed in their attacks.



Foraven -> RE: Weapons choice (4/28/2011 6:16:23 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Data

Yes, taking them out early prevents this. They can't prosper if you let them exist but prevent their attacks, they only develop if they succeed in their attacks.


They would not accept protection fees/alliance if it was less lucrative. They also get quite a lot from selling informations (i do buy a lot of them). We can also hire them to pester other empires, but i think they lose more ships than it's worth.



Data -> RE: Weapons choice (4/28/2011 6:23:44 PM)

quote:

We can also hire them to pester other empires, but i think they lose more ships than it's worth.


Maybe use this for training them as they regenerate their ship designs this way.



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