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treespider -> RE: Several issues arising out of game. (5/18/2011 9:29:38 PM)
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ORIGINAL: witpqs
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ORIGINAL: JWE
Before this devolves into the usual, must return, for just a moment, to the intent of the OP. Jonathan and Ramon have both commented on the apparent lack of AT for Chinese units. While I do agree Chinese units are quite thin in this respect, I must suggest ya'll take a look at Treespider v witpqs's AAR at http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2754161, where a bunch of Chinese units (ordinary Corps stuff) attack a Japanese stack with a bunch of Infantry and a pantload of Tank Regiments, and absolutely smoke them; 72% casualties (killed or disrupted, mostly killed) to vehicle units. Several other Combat Reports, at other places, show Tank/Vehicle devices incurring reasonable casualties.
Spidey and witpqs are playing Spidey's mod which is based on Babes. Really think that Babes data tweaks (in this area) represent a noticeable improvement in combat outcomes.
Ramon, Jonathan, take a vacation in the Balearics (and invite me along). When you come back, try out a Babes scenario. Ciao. J
Thanks for the referral! [:)]
You all know about Babes. What Treespider did in addition was (in no particular order):
- Make a bunch of industry centers in North America that must be repaired, so supply available from North America starts out low and ramps up over time.
- Changed certain production parameters so places like Palembang (and maybe all refineries?) produce squat for supply.
- Reduced the size of various airfields with an eye toward slowing things down.
- Made big changes to the Japanese economy with the aim of putting more historical stress on the Japanese merchant fleet. The idea being that those ships would be required to carry back to Japan much more stuff than has been seen in AARs so far.
- Added many bases and tiny "political" units in China to simply act as molasses to slow down advances.
- Increased garrison requirements in China for both sides.
- Added oil and resources at the Panama Canal which can be shipped to Australia to keep the civilian economy going.
- Along with a change in at least one of the Babes scenarios, various ships' cargo capacities are reduced so as to require more trips (or ships) to move the same amount of supply.
Some house rules are required to keep it real, such as the Allied player can not turn off industry or repairs to industry except in China. So, you've got to bring that fuel into Australia to keep industry going (and resources too).
I'm certain I omitted 27 things Treespider did, so maybe he'll chime in with anything critical I missed or more detail.
A large number of the Kwantung Army units are now permanently restricted and thus cannot be bought with PP. This includes much of the artillery, AA, engineer, and armor assets which add little to the Manchukuo garrison Requirement. In regular games most players strip the Kwantung Army of these assets, something which did not happen IRL. When coupled with the HR preventing units from leaving Manchuria/Korea without paying PP it does create even more of the strain felt by the Japanese IRL.
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As the thread is about China: So far, China is working out quite well. The point was to make China much more of the stalemate that it was in real life and the changes are doing that. The availability of Japanese offensive power is reduced. Chinese offensive power is a bit less than it was (owing to higher garrison requirements), and the Chinese have a greater ability to harass the Imperial supply lines. We have not yet gotten to the point where the Chinese are supply-starved, as the Burma road only recently closed.
The Chinese still, however, lack much real offensive punch. The attack in question was a two-stage affair. First, the Imperial troops attacked what they probably thought was a smaller force than it actually was. It was in reality more than twice their size (and AV) and somewhat dug in. The attack went badly, blunting the IJA units and certainly burdening them with disruption. The second stage was that the Chinese shock attacked, purely opportunistically. The attack went well, definitely aided by the failed IJA attack the day before.
I thought if I massed tanks with some quality Inf Div. I would have been able to achieve more. I do believe part of my failure was a lack of PREP. I've found that PREP is more important than it once was. I failed to prep for the dotbase in which George's army was located. In normal AE and other versions the hex in question would not have had a base...in my version most cultivated hexes in China have a dot base.
The extra bases create an opportunity for the Chinese to prep for far more fall back positions than regular AE. In addition the extra bases and Political units help to create a smoke screen that the Chinese can use to hide regular army units that can be used to harass LOCs "behind" my lines.
For screen shots see my brief AAR HERE
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In China, use good defensive terrain. Concentrate enough troops. Don't get cut off. Use interior lines to redeploy as needed. Threaten and cut off the IJA's supply lines. Build forts. Counter enemy offensives with offensives in other areas that the IJA is compelled to address. Give your troops time for the at-start disabled squads to repair. Pay attention to your units' experience, morale, fatigue, and disruption. Except in really overwhelming numbers, Chinese units will not be good offensive units until their experience is in the mid-50s.
Hope this helps.
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