RE: Customized Grand Campaign

RE: Customized Grand Campaign (Full Version)

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Priapus1 -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/13/2011 3:06:18 PM)
OK guys, I'll slow down. Yes, I agree the bridge battles would be much more enjoyable if the germans fielded more units and the timer wasn't comically short. I've massively increased the number of BO units at the start of the campaign in an attempt to represent the scattered forces in the region. I'll write a full description of changes when we make a proper release. I'm around on GR if you guys want to do some testing. edit: Is anyone talented with graphics? I'd like to add some more vehicles, but have never used photoshop so have no idea how to go about it. Also, there appears to be some erratic limit to how many units some BOs can receive. Some can have a full roster, whilst others are limited to 6 or 7 units. I can't figure out why. Any ideas? ... It's a complete mystery to me. I'm able to give full rosters to the major bridges and nijmegen town however am limited to a maximum of 7 units for the minor bridges. There's no mention of a limit in the workbook. I don't know if this is something hardcoded or some figure in StaticBGs I am overlooking.

xe5 -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/13/2011 6:01:53 PM)
Lack of consistency when editing the 5 rows of unit/location data, one row for each difficulty level, per static BG. For example, you might have 15 teams coded for some BGs at Elite difficulty (first data row) and 15 teams coded for other BGs at Recruit difficulty. So when you play on Elite youre not seeing 15 teams for the BGs whose Recruit data you edited. [image]local://upfiles/31774/FC1FD75E9401426F93795ABB07CE12BF.jpg[/image]

Priapus1 -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/13/2011 7:36:45 PM)
... I'm aware that the other lines of data are for the different difficulty settings. This mod is designed specifically for line vs line.

xe5 -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/13/2011 10:22:53 PM)
Upload your StaticBGs.txt file and it wont be a complete mystery much longer.

tigercub -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/14/2011 2:11:02 AM)
Davidss can the LOS from windows be widened? i feel they are to small as it stands.

davidss -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/14/2011 2:52:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tigercub Davidss can the LOS from windows be widened? i feel they are to small as it stands. Hi, In order to make a window with wider LOS; you would need to recode more width (more single elements) in the map itself. Are you testing with LSA Elements Real Walls v1.2? If so, window width shouldn't be a problem .. since exterior wall LOS is unblocked when soldiers are adjacent. If you are testing with v1.3 ... then you can see the problems associated with wall LOS blocked even when adjacent. Problem like not as many soldiers getting LOS and the four man MG teams having the main gunner with LOS less consistently. That is why I decided on exterior walls with LOS when adjacent for GT2.1

Priapus1 -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/14/2011 3:16:57 AM)
I don't think exterior walls having their LOS blocked will be an issue for LSA. Windows and doors are not only more frequent in LSA compared to TLD, they are also much larger. Every building has a finite number of windows and doors and I think it's more realistic that every team member won't be able to fire at a target at the same time. I also think it's much more realistic that MGs aren't able to sit in a corner of a building and shoot at a 270 degree angle. The best they can achieve now is a 180 degree angle. MGs behaviour seems different in LSA too. They tend to have preference to set up on windows, with other team members moving out of the way to allow them. I've reduced all heavy MG teams to 4 men in an attempt to stop crowding and decrease the chance of the MG not receiving an LOS. I'm really impressed with the new elements data, with the exterior walls blocking LOS, and really want to keep it in.

davidss -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/14/2011 3:31:40 AM)
.

STIENER -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/14/2011 3:31:42 AM)
Priapus.....message me in GR if your around please right now......[:)]

tigercub -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/14/2011 5:54:00 AM)
I have done all the lastest changes ask for Priapus ...plus some more reserched changes...Stiener do you know if the US were getting the use of the British Sabbo rounds for the 57mm from 6 pounders? there were getting HE rounds from the pomps but thats all i can find.

STIENER -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/14/2011 6:37:25 AM)
interesting question tigercub.....i didnt know the yanks were getting there HE rds from the brits. they couldnt possibbly have been getting all there HE rds from them......but on further reading on the internet, it appears your right ...brit and yank ammo was interchangable between the the 6 pdr and the 57 mm [ its the same damn gun ] [&:] i found some info on the APDS rounds for the yank 57mm, they too were from the brits in limited quantity's. one source said that the 57 mm shooting the APDS was not very accurate with it tho. so in limited quantity's, yes the APDS was used in the yank 57 mm [8D] who new???

tigercub -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/14/2011 9:36:04 AM)
yes the 57mm is the same gun and The US never made HE or sabbo rounds...my file have been updated again today.

STIENER -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/15/2011 7:06:17 AM)
Priapus heres my german BG recomendations for the new mod. [ line settings in the game? ] these changes are based on three books in particular, "it never snows in september"and "the forgotten army", and "sons of the reich, 2nd SS panzer corps". my recomendations are for improvment of game playability and still maintain a certain amount of historical accuracy. the problem with LSA IMHO is that the germans lack alot of the equipment that was avalible to them historically in the game or was not included in the game because of alledged few numbers of this equipment or lack of written records. the book "it never snows in sept" has allot of information derived from from many personel interviews with german soldiers who were in Campaign, including Heinz Harmel commander of the 10 SS and Karl - Heinz Euling. 107 PZ BDE [ the numbers for this BG are TOTAL numbers of squads, NOT added to whats already in the game bg, unless stated] sept 18 9:00 6 shreaks, 5 assault engineer squads [ take out the lame pioneer squads ] 10 PZ Grd squads, 10 PZ Grd mg squads, 6 hmg squads, 8 zugtrupp. ADD...6 lmg squads, 3 20mm h/t's, 3 37mm h/t's KG Reinhold sept 18 6:00 ADD...4 PZ Grd, 4 PZ Grd mg, 3 mark 4 tanks and 1 mk 4 command tank. sept 18 15:00 ADD..reinforce with 3 mk 4 tanks, 1 mk 4 command tank, 6 SS PZ Grd, 6 SS PZ Grd mg, 4 shreaks, 2 8cm mortors,4 hmg, 6 lmg and 6 zugtrupp. [ all SS of course] KG Euling sept 18 00:00 REPLACE the 1 stug with 4 Jag 4 tanks. ADD...2 hmg h/t's and 2 37mm h/t's sept 18 15:00 ADD...reinforce with 2 SS stugs, 6 SS zugtrupp, 5 SS PZ Grd, 5 SS PZ Grd mg, 4 SS assault engineer, 4 shreaks, 4 hmg, 6 lmg, 2 75mm pak, 4 20mm flak and 2 8cm mortors. [ all SS of course] Eulings BG should absorb the static BG at Nijmegan to get at least 4 88 flak guns. the 88 flak guns and 20 and 37 mm flak guns were an intrical part of the nijmegan defences for Euling and Reinhold. 280 Stug BDE sept 19 6:00 TOTAL Stugs should be 2 stuh 42's and 4 Stug 3's. ADD...6 Grenadier squads, 8 lmg, and 4 zugtrupp. KG Chill ADD...1 more Jagdpanther [ total = 2 ], 1 Stug 3, 3 FJ 75mm pak's, 3 FJ 75mm inf guns KG Harder sept 17 18:00 ADD... 4 SS zugtrupp, 4 SS PZ Grd, 4 SS PZ Grd mg sept 20 6:00 ADD 1 Panther tank KG Gaebner sept 17 15:00 ADD.... 4 SS Puma's, 4 SS 251/9 75mm h/t's, 6 SS pzaufklarer mg, 6 SS lmg, and 4 SS zugtrupp. KG Brinkmann sept 18 00:00 ADD...6 SS pzaufklarer mg, 4 SS lmg, 2 SS zugtrupp, 4 251/9 75mm h/t's KG Henke static BG at Nijmegan bridge Henke had a Flak Battery used in the duel purpose role of AA and A/T....4 or 6 88 flak guns and another 4 20 mm and 37 mm flak guns???? KG Spindler sept 17 15:00 ADD...4 SS PZ Grd, 4 SS PZ Grd mg, 2 SS hmg, 6 SS lmg, 1 flak 88, 3 251 hmg h/t's, 1 flamethrower team, 4 250/9 h/t's, 2 Stug 3's, 2 75mm pak's. sept 22 6:00 ADD..reinforce with 4 SS assault engineer squads with flamethrowers. KG Knaust sept 18 12:00 ADD.... 2 flak 88's, 6 Grenadier, 6 Grd mg. sept 22 6:00 ADD... reinforce with 6 SS assault engineer squads with flamethrowers. [ this BG looks good for the anmount of tanks that show as reinfocements in the game ] KG Walther sept 22 6:00 ADD.... 4 75mm pak's, 2 Panther tanks, and 2 75mm Inf guns. sept 23 9:00 ADD.. reinforce with 5 SS Jag 4's, 4 SS PZ Grd, and 4 SS PZ Grd mg KG Jungwirth sept 18 6:00 ADD.... 6 FJ shreaks, 6 FJ lmg, 3 FJ 75mm pak's, 3 FJ 75mm inf guns. all the other BG's in stock LSA should be LEFT ALONE for now IMHO untill we play test these BG's to see how the game NOW plays. IMO the new assault engineer squads should all be 8 man squads with explosives, fausts, mp 40 sub machine guns, lots of grenades, and a flamethrower. [ Tiger..ur opinion? ] Hope you gents like what ive got here. its my opinion that if too many BG's are given tanks and or equipment that wasnt present historically it may skew the game drastically. what i have presented here i think is somewhat historically correct, maybe not as far as numbers go but as far as what type of equipment was there and who had acces to it. [8D] by increasing the numbers of equipment a bit, [;)] we get back the playabilty of the game.[:)] RD Steiner

Overkenshin -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/15/2011 7:32:41 AM)
looks good Mike

Priapus1 -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/15/2011 2:40:52 PM)
Thanks for the comprehensive list Steiner. I'll begin work on the changes today.

Priapus1 -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/15/2011 3:09:20 PM)
OK, first question: Why haven't you given 107 panzer brigade any panthers? I based its current set up on this web page: http://www.axishistory.com/index.php?id=512 It won't stand a chance at halting the allied armoured BG's, even temporarily, along the eastern route if all it receives is shreks and half tracks. Question 2: Are the above figures additions to be made to the stock game or my modded BG's? I assume the former? When you say "ADD" I assume you mean reinforce? The game only reinforces at midnight, therefore it's not possible to reinforce during the day. Question 3: According to your suggestions Harder should be available on the first turn. Where should he be located in the north? i.e. west or east? If it's possible could you state which map you think he should begin at. Actually, could you give suggestions for starting locations for all the armoured BGs. Most importantly, were the tanks challenging the paras located in the north west or mainly, or even solely, focused on the arnhem area? Brinkmann crossed the ferry at Doornenburg to support the nijmegen defence, right?

STIENER -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/15/2011 5:51:18 PM)
Priapus 1] sorry for the minor confusion on 107 PZ BDE....in all the BG's listed including the 107 PZ BDE...you keep all the other stock squads and vehicles that are in the stock BG / forcepool lists in the game. all you change or ADD [ mostly add ] is what i have listed. so the 107 PZ BDE has about 12 panthers and 4 jag 4's in the stock game. [:)] heres a new recomendation list for the 107 PZ BDE so its the same as all the rest of my list..sorry for the confusion there.. 107 PZ BDE sept 18 9:00 ADD...3 20mm h/t's, 3 37mm h/t's, 3 shreaks, 2 PZ Grd squads, 2 PZ Grd mg squads, 2 hmg, 4 zugtrupp, 6 lmg, and remove the pionere squads and replace with 5 assault engineer squads, 2] yes the above additons are to the STOCK game. your editing the BG forcepools, so why cant you add the new number of squads to the BG units lists like you did with your game files?? i dont get that? as for reinforcing...same thing....your editing the stock game files at at certain time and date im assuming for each BG just like looking at each forcepool make up in the scenario editor??? the stock game reinforces at other times, other than midnite im pretty sure. 3] Harder arrrives in the stock game on sept 17 at 18:00 at Valkenhuizen....at the time i listed above. all the stock game arrival times are accurate as well as what maps they come in on. IMHO you dont have to change any of that. remember, you dont have to reinvent the wheel here, if you dont want to. keep it simple and easy IMHO [:)] Brinkmann didnt cross the ferry...he fought at arnhem mostly until the arnhem bridge was recaptured and then moved down towards nijmegan.

Priapus1 -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/15/2011 9:10:22 PM)
Parts of the 10. SS panzer crossed the Pannderden ferry. Maybe I'm think of Euling. I can't find the source where I read that now. I'm not 100% sure about reinforcements. I did some testing a couple of days ago and it was all very confusing. Take it easy with the BGs. I was only asking if your suggestions are based on the stock games forcepools. I'm going to continue to use my modded FPool files and make reductions based on the above. edit: Are your tank figures at a 1:1 ratio?

Priapus1 -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/15/2011 11:18:24 PM)
Do you guys think it is feasible to do a 1:1 ratio for troops and tanks? I'm doing some calculations after increasing most team sizes... if each BG has 15 slots each battle with each team consisting of an average of 6 men and on average you lose 6 (40%) of those teams each battle, that gives an mean battle casualty rate of 36 men. There are 50 turns between the 17th to the 25th of September. If our average BG is in combat for a third of those turns that is a total casualty rate of 16.7x36 = 601.2. There are 31 allied BGs. 31x601.2 = 18637 total casualties for the allies. That is fairly close to the real figures of between 15326–17200 (according to wikipedia...). Perhaps my estimate of a 40% loss rate each battle is a little high. I have too much free time. What do you guys think?

STIENER -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/16/2011 4:15:36 AM)
Hi Priapus the 10SS BG's that crossed at the Pannderden ferry were Rienhold and Euling. you were 1/2 right [;)] between them they had the bulk of the 10 SS troops per say. brinkmann which was the 10 SS recon was at arnhem as well as some other 10SS troops in Knaust and spindler i believe. my tank figures are more like 50% of what was historical. as an example Rienhold had 16 mk 4's and 4 stug historically. Euling got the 4 stugs [ and initially 4 jag 4's ] and rienhold kept most of the mk 4's with him on the north side of the river at nijmegan. so by me giving rienhold 8 mk 4's and euling 2 stugs thats 50% but i gave euling all the jag 4's so that 100% but fo the most part im using 50% as the rule. not sure what you mean about take it easy with the BG's? didnt mean to ruffle your feathers........if i did[&:] i didnt understand the initial question i guess. sorry. im not a big fan of the 1 to 1 ratio thing. i dont think you can make it work the way you would like. 40% casualtys in CC may be but in real life its not anything close to that. id prefer you to spend your time getting the BG's a wee bit more back to historical and playable levels please [:)] thats just my opinion tho.

Overkenshin -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/16/2011 5:06:41 AM)
Glad you guys are getting things sorted. I'd agree with both of you. We should try to spice up the GC a little especially the infantry teams themselves but Force-pool wise try to keep things historical where possible. Steiner i think you mentioned something about both sides historically having much more equipment (grenades, ammo ect) than might be suggested by field manuals ect of the time?.. A 2:1 ratio seems like a good idea to me. Remember that a max of only 5 vehicles can be fielded in one battle so its difficult to represent the allies much greater tank numbers. This problem is exasperated by the GC being quite short timescale wise. The superior quality of german hardware (thanks to Tigercubs historical data) means that , especially in a defensive role, just 4 or 5 germans tanks (even stugs) could potentially hold of a full group of allied armour for several turns. By the time allies have broken through the GC might be almost over! Tim dont worry if Steiner seems slightly.. abrupt, its just his style ;). Whenever we play h2h he types everything in CAPS so i always think hes shouting at me!! [:'(] [&:]

DesertedFox -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/16/2011 12:23:23 PM)
quote: Tim dont worry if Steiner seems slightly.. abrupt, its just his style ;). Whenever we play h2h he types everything in CAPS so i always think hes shouting at me!! "Steiner" in Canadian actually means "angry little chap".[:'(] Hi Mike, Long time no speak and even longer that we played. I am settled back in Thailand now for good, so maybe we can kick off a game in due course when this mod is sorted. Cheers, Mark

tigercub -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/16/2011 12:29:00 PM)
Priapus The first Bridge battle can u give the US parra 15 units on map as it stands its a none battle. Tiger!

Priapus1 -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/16/2011 3:08:58 PM)
Sorry Steiner, I misinterpreted your multiple question marks as a sign of annoyance. I'm tempted to give this 1:1 ratio a shot. I really think it's feasible. The numbers seem to work. For example; Krafft had 422 men on the 17th. As most infantry units now consist of 7-6 men this gives a total of 60 units. I don't think that is too outrageous. My only fear is that if a large German BG gets disbanded it could permanently lose several 1000 men in one fell swoop. However, I'm still unsure how the mechanism for surrounding BGs from the same formation absorbing troops from disbanded BGs works. I may have to activate respawning for disbanded BGs to avoid this. Again, I'm not sure how this works either. Does the disbanded BG reappear at a random german held supply depot? The closest one when it was disbanded? One thing I used to insist on when playing TLD was that neither myself or my opponent could take a VL in the last minute of play so to avoid any incredibly annoying and gamey last minute dashes to take land or even taking your opponents or your own last VL without having a chance to counter attack. There is no greater annoyance in CC after a well fought battle losing your whole BG because your last VL was taken in the dying seconds of the battle. You're not always limited to five tanks. Tanks can be dropped into both the Vehicles and Support columns in the BG selection screen. Anyway, with the new larger and relatively well armed infantry units the price for units has sky rocketed so it will be difficult for the german player to field 8 tigers at one time, at least without fielding zero infantry. Tiger, the first 2 bridge maps were historically not taken by the americans. In game this is important because if either of them are taken the allied armour can drive straight to the support of the AB holding off the minor german counter attack in the south west. There shouldn't even be battles on those maps as those bridges were blown as soon as the americans were seen approaching. But yes, I may get rid of limitations on what can be fielded by smaller BGs.

tigercub -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/16/2011 4:05:47 PM)
My idea is for the each battle to way in favor of the side that historically that held or took the bridge but to give a small chance to the other side using the timer as the key to balance the battle.

ErwinPdL -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/16/2011 5:23:18 PM)
1st of all give you two Congratulations for the Work. The Real Wall Mod is incredible. I'm playing a OP (Arhem Paratroops) against the IA in LSA and became hard to defeat, which is a new challenge to practise tactics and more realistic behaviour of infantry. I gonna continue testing against the IA. Tonight gonna stay in GR if you want continue Testing Priapus. Keep up the good work.

STIENER -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/16/2011 9:07:32 PM)
Deserted Fox LMAO [:D] ya a game would be good[8D] i believe we still have a 1/2 finished SAS game going too.........i still have the saved game file.....

STIENER -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/16/2011 9:20:05 PM)
Priapus you pay me to be blunt [;)] i still think your talents are going in the wrong direction here...changing the game to a 1 to 1 ratio isnt nessisary IMHO. if you really want to try that your going to have to get some guys that no how the game system operates to help you figure it out. your asking all the questions already. theres alot in the game with reinfocements and point system and disbandments etc that we / you dont understand how it works, and if you keep blundering along your wasting alot of time and energy for nothing, so to speak. altho you'll probably figure it all out eventually if thats what you want to do. i still think your talents should be directed towards tweaking the game as it is, to make it better within the force pools as they are. with that done and tigers new data it could be the historical game we all want it to be. another thought on the 1 to 1 ratio......what about the allied side? it may be do-able on the german side based on how small some of the bg's are but the allied side is different ...your dealing with full stength divisons there. just my thoughts tho, priapus [8D]

ErwinPdL -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/16/2011 9:24:56 PM)
LoL I know who you are ;) NP and sorry for the delay but: I aren't in Hurry. Look for me in GR and we continue playing SAS CC5. See you in Battlefield and prepares coffins for your troops. But a Lot :P That Modification on LSA is a good advance in CC, at least for me and need testing, mate. CC5 included in tLD SAS Mod ported with real wall mod of TigerCub would be terrific.

DesertedFox -> RE: Customized Grand Campaign (7/17/2011 1:37:39 AM)
quote: LMAO ya a game would be good i believe we still have a 1/2 finished SAS game going too.........i still have the saved game file..... My goodness, you hoarder!!!! Did we have issues with SAS? If not happy to continue that beasty. I gave up on GJS with CC5, constant crashes. Cheers, Mark

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