RE: Attention to orders (Full Version)

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obvert -> RE: Attention to orders (1/14/2014 9:39:00 PM)

I admire your grit! Keep it going DOCUP.

Also, don't just shovel this under the rug. Make sure you understand what led to this disaster. Your opponent is playing well of course, but there are a few things that seem like they could have been avoided. Pick this apart and make sure you learn from it.



zuluhour -> RE: Attention to orders (1/16/2014 1:51:09 AM)

Still here with you as well, can you send some kind of small SCTFs at the KB, force him to retire?



veji1 -> RE: Attention to orders (1/16/2014 10:50:57 AM)

You are a great player Docup, just to be playing a PBEM at this date is being a great player anyway ! Keep up the fight and I admire your grit.



DOCUP -> RE: Attention to orders (1/16/2014 9:42:04 PM)

Thanks Guys.

Been busy here at home.  With the Chemical spill in the drinking water, working 8 12 hour midnight shifts in a row and some personal things, I haven't been able to do anything.

I also want to say.  That I am not angry at Koniu or anything.  He is playing a great game.  Hes a better player than I am.

Obvert:  Your right I made mistakes and need to take stock of them. Thanks.

Kurt:  I am going to try and do that and send one to cover my lone CV from a SAG. I am thinking about putting my CVEs into the same hex to provide some fighter cover along with LRCAP. Thanks

Veji1: Thanks.  When I saw the turn.  I never thought of quitting.  My thought was this is going to be a long boring war.

Now I need to spend some time with the wife.



zuluhour -> RE: Attention to orders (1/16/2014 11:20:32 PM)

Seems I play most of the war carrier-less.[:(]



JocMeister -> RE: Attention to orders (1/17/2014 9:56:07 AM)

Hang in there DOCUP. It can still be a lot of fun! [:)]

It doesnīt have to be a couple of boring months. But you will have to adjust your play accordingly. Even with all CVs gone you should have some CVEs by now? 10-15 or something? And soon they will start pouring in. Soon your CVE fleet alone will be bigger then the KB. Dump the 9 TBs from them and let the fighter squadron fill out the capacity. That should give you a 300-400 plane CAP for now. Not stellar but enough to withstand a medium sized LBA strike in the BETA. You need Hellcats or Corsairs. Wildkittens wonīt do it. Never, ever use Kittens on CV/CVLs/CVEs. That is almost the only benefit an allied player has from PDU ON. Donīt waste it!

The key is to be where the KB isnīt. It will be the same as playing in 42. You have to be where the KB canīt reach in time to intervene. My bet is koniu is going to keep the KB somewhere close enough to the DEI as this is the most dangerous approach for him. This opens up CENTPAC, NOPAC, Sumatra, Adamans and the Burmese coast. You have to feint and deceive to get him to move the KB to where you want to. In this case force him to be honest in the DEI and keep KB there while you do something somewhere else. Or try to fool him with a fake invasion somewhere, wait and see if the KB shows up and then do something in the DEI. You have many, many options still open for you.

Oh, and buy back any destroyed CV fighter squadrons you can. Its expensive as hell but worth every little PP. When they resize to 42 planes in 44 they will be GOLDEN as sweepers. Donīt bother with the DB/TB squadrons. In the BETA they are not worth the price.

Its a cat and mouse game and its fun as hell when it works. [:)]




DOCUP -> RE: Attention to orders (1/17/2014 1:24:48 PM)

Joc: Good advise. I have bought back all the other CV squadrons and will do so with these. Thanks

I have the itch and the time to play again.

Need some advise guys.

1: I have 2 damaged CVs. Essex has moderate damage and can make only 1 hex distance. I have directed it to head straight to Darwin. Bunker Hill has more damage with some fires and can make 11 Knots. CVL can make it to safety with no problem. I am thinking of detaching it and sending it to Darwin by its self. I will put some LRCAP over the Essex.

2: CVEs they should be able to make it out of harms way. They will head to Darwin at full speed.

3: SAGs they will head to Darwin. I am not worried about them.

Saumlaki: I have my amphib, SAGs, PT TFs here. Amphibs will stop unloading and move at best possible speed to Darwin. My xAKs with supplies will stay and unload. PT boats have be broken down into 6 ship TFs 3 will head towards the KB to delay any SAGs and do what they can to help my ships flee. One PT TF will head west 1 hex and take up a patrol area to delay any SAGs hunting my CVs.

If I can save these 2 CVs it will be a win for me. I am thinking of loading up some troops from Hawaii and landing them on Roi Namur since I know where the KB is.

Let the advice flow guys.



DOCUP -> RE: Attention to orders (1/17/2014 1:25:28 PM)

Map

[image]local://upfiles/35564/69B544BD9EA1443880B2B6190787717A.jpg[/image]



JocMeister -> RE: Attention to orders (1/17/2014 2:06:47 PM)

I would divide Bunker Hill and Essex and set them both to full speed towards Darwin on their own. Each in their own TF. They are 98% lost anyway. No use wasting the CVEs and CVLs in a futile attempt to save them.

You could try and send some SAGs towards the KB. Nothing too valuable though. But some DDs should make it in and back at full speed. This could cause a bit of ruckus among the CVs and perhaps force them to retreat a hex or two eating OPS.

Good luck! [:)]



DOCUP -> RE: Attention to orders (1/19/2014 2:37:19 AM)

23rd Dec 43

I still suck as a player.

Burma
I have over 2,500 AV in the hex south of Taung Gyi.  I am going to try a deliberate attack and see what happens.

Saumlaki
I won't forget this place.  Our troops take it, Jap troops are still in the hex, I will attack again tomorrow.  My CVs just might make it to Darwin.  By the end of the turn tomorrow they should be 1 hex away.  I did lose 2 CAs and a DD battling a 3 BB Jap SAG while covering the withdraw of the CVs.  No Jap ships were sunk.  That sucked but oh well.

Ok guys, time to tell me what all I did wrong.  I know it took me to long to attack.  I should of known that Koniu would of brought every CV in the Jap arsenal.  I should of put all my CVs in one TF.  What else did I do wrong.  Also lets start talking about where I go from here. 

Japs need oil. I could prep and send everything to DEI when I get some power back.  Try the N home islands.  Charge down Burma or into China.  These are all options.  I might even be able to go thru CENTPAC later on.   Start talking.  No more lurking in the shadows.  I need help.



JocMeister -> RE: Attention to orders (1/19/2014 7:55:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DOCUP

23rd Dec 43

I still suck as a player.

Burma
I have over 2,500 AV in the hex south of Taung Gyi.  I am going to try a deliberate attack and see what happens.

Saumlaki
I won't forget this place.  Our troops take it, Jap troops are still in the hex, I will attack again tomorrow.  My CVs just might make it to Darwin.  By the end of the turn tomorrow they should be 1 hex away.  I did lose 2 CAs and a DD battling a 3 BB Jap SAG while covering the withdraw of the CVs.  No Jap ships were sunk.  That sucked but oh well.

Ok guys, time to tell me what all I did wrong.  I know it took me to long to attack.  I should of known that Koniu would of brought every CV in the Jap arsenal.  I should of put all my CVs in one TF.  What else did I do wrong.  Also lets start talking about where I go from here. 

Japs need oil. I could prep and send everything to DEI when I get some power back.  Try the N home islands.  Charge down Burma or into China.  These are all options.  I might even be able to go thru CENTPAC later on.   Start talking.  No more lurking in the shadows.  I need help.


Sacrificing those CAs and DD might have saved your CVs. A very good trade IMO. [:)]

Iīm not much more experienced then you are but here is my take on what went wrong. As you say it simply took too long to get into position and koniu had time to get everything in place. Since you were unable to get into such a position where you could do the invasion in 2-3 days it put you at a disadvantage from the beginning. Personally I would have scrapped the invasion when it was spotted already around Horn Island. There were several things working against you.

-While you had almost CV parity against the KB (including your CVEs) you not only have to cover your own CVs but also the Ampibs which is a distinct disadvantage.

-You had no aid from LBA while koniu had.

I always try and aim for a 2 day invasion. On D1 you are spotted. D2 you land and on D3 you are gone. Not easily done and requires a bit of help from the weather gods.

Its still to early to call the operation a failure though. You did get the troops in place and now have a solid base to expand from. If you manage to expand from that small bridgehead it would be a tactical defeat but a strategic win. As you say the oil is absolutely critical and you will soon get the first batch of B29s. With an allied foothold at Saumlaki you have very much but a knife against the Japanese throat.

Koniu will now have to divert a lot of assets (probably including the KB) to keep you pinned in place. This will open up other areas for you. Just try to keep the pressure up in the area so he canīt guard you with just a token force. You have 4 bases in the DEI now. Build them up to a solid platform from which to can expand. Where you want to go is Timor and its TWO level 9 AFs. This should be perfectly doable under LBA if you can get the bases built up.

I would look to open up a second front somewhere a couple of days sailing from the DEI. Force koniu to make the hard choices and divide his forces. GJ showed the error of an allied single vector advance when he smacked Q-ball around for a year.

If you can get those bases built up koniu is in big problems and it would make the losses worth it. Or at least not have made them in vain.

You are doing better then you think you are! You are playing against an excellent player and that is a big challenge. You have foothold in the DEI and its not even 44 yet! How can that not be good?! [:)]



zuluhour -> RE: Attention to orders (1/19/2014 12:10:04 PM)

....and remember, God is represented here as a six sided anomaly.



DOCUP -> RE: Attention to orders (1/19/2014 3:30:15 PM)

Koniu is an excellent player.  Thanks for the info Joc.  I will have to sit down and look around.

24th Dec 43

China
My units trying to sneak behind Taung Gyi has been spotted.  I will have to send them back to Burma.

Burma
My attack dosent go so well.  We lose 6k worth of men to about 1k of Japs.

N Oz
Bunker Hill has FLT damage jump to 89 she is one hex away from Bathurst Island.  I will stop her there for some repairs, if she makes it. Some of the KB is above Ambon.

Still love this game. 



JocMeister -> RE: Attention to orders (1/19/2014 4:23:45 PM)

Did Essex make it?



DOCUP -> RE: Attention to orders (1/20/2014 9:09:42 PM)

Joc:  Yes the Essex made it.  The Bunker Hill was 1 hex away from Bathurst with 89 float on cruise speed.  She jumped like 30 points on the last turn, I hope she can make one hex without sinking.  Both ships have lest than 40 major damage of all types.

Burma
I am going to start pushing things in Burma. Taung Gyi will receive some sweeps in the near future then bombing missions.  I have 100 P47s, 100 P38s, 64 Spit VIIs, 36 F4s and other fighters in Burma. Taung Gyi had 125 fighters last turn.  I was thinking of LRCAPing 1 P47s squadron with the rest sweeping.  Maybe not all the groups but a good portion. After the fighters are gone, start bombing the AF to get at his supply.  His supply has to be hit or miss by now.  I am also thinking of bring up some troops to Magwee and then moving down the road next to the river.  This way I won't have to cross the river.

I have 1 Indian ID with 2 Indian BDEs prepping for the island west of Rangoon.  I am moving ships into theater, might be awhile.  I will have some American units prepping for Moulmein.  I am hoping to be able to get some units on the yellow road that runs towards Chang Mai.  I know he spotted my units trying to sneak in from China.  If I can get units on this road I will force him to move units to counter them.

Timor AO
I still have units prepping and move for targets in the Timor region.  I need to find out if the KB or part of it is still in the area. I am going to try and send some Engs and BFs to Babar and the other islands I hold around Saumlaki.  I am also eyeing a few bases on the coast of New Guinea that are still in my control but have no troops.  Some ships are at pier side repairing from the last battle. 

East coast of New Guinea
I am moving troops around with intentions of making some moves but it will be hard with no CV support.  Shortlands, Manus are high on my list but may have to wait.

Cent Pac
Troops are prepping for various bases.

I am trying to figure out where I should go.  I am thinking one massive invasion of Sumatra at some point in 44.  If I land and don't get kicked out, I can interdict and bomb his oil supplies.  This will hurt him in 45 and 46.  I will also make moves in Cent Pac and other areas.  So he can't keep the KB in the DEI.  If he does great.  I'll move in other areas.

I could cut down to Bangkok or Canton (China) and have bombers and search planes flying for his oil convoys.  Until he reroutes them.

Nor Pac
He has built this area up pretty well.  I don't know what he has stationed there though.



DOCUP -> RE: Attention to orders (1/23/2014 2:19:42 PM)

26th Dec 43



China

Japs bomb my small units trying to sneak into Burma



Burma

We sweep Taungy Gyi. Not bad screen shot below.



N Oz

Bunker Hill sinks.


[image]local://upfiles/35564/A30070949D784455A4625ABF4DEEACE1.jpg[/image]



DOCUP -> RE: Attention to orders (1/23/2014 2:20:23 PM)

26th Dec 43



China

Japs bomb my small units trying to sneak into Burma



Burma

We sweep Taungy Gyi. Not bad screen shot below.



N Oz

Bunker Hill sinks.


[image]local://upfiles/35564/EF8EEF32D51946619F3EC0617ADB15BB.jpg[/image]



zuluhour -> RE: Attention to orders (1/23/2014 10:07:58 PM)

I just checked on my air groups destroyed...........[X(]. I thought I was short naval aviation squadrons.



zuluhour -> RE: Attention to orders (1/30/2014 11:07:06 PM)

Alright Joe, There needs to be some cheer in here! Perhaps Ann can help.


[image]local://upfiles/37319/57119EA98E1748CFB002B2F1FE26652A.jpg[/image]



zuluhour -> RE: Attention to orders (2/2/2014 12:22:35 AM)

Don't make keep posting period porn in here!



JocMeister -> RE: Attention to orders (2/2/2014 2:30:20 PM)

When was the baby due? He hasnīt been logged on since the 23rd!



zuluhour -> RE: Attention to orders (2/2/2014 2:35:49 PM)

AH HA!! passing cigars.......but I thought the event had already happened......&^%$ getting old......sigh



DOCUP -> RE: Attention to orders (2/2/2014 4:46:58 PM)

May 14th is the expected date of Ava Brooke guys.

I haven't posted due to personal issues and not feeling like it.  I am fighting that downward spiral and game depression.  I will try and post some but I expect to get interrupted before I can get a full post in.

Jan 4th 44

KB still around Truk

Burma
Did a DA on Taung Gyi.  We lose around 1,200 and japs lose around 600 troops.  Other than that nothing much has changed.

Timor AO
Babar is being built up.  Took a beating on a Jap sweep several days back.  Lost some LSTs and a few LCIs along with 2 DDs.  The Japs lost a DD.  We have sunk a few xAKs by sub and by bombers.  1 AO sunk another damaged by a sub.

Marshalls
AFs are closed due to Naval bombardments.  Lost some more LSTs here also.  I had an amphib op going against Roi Namur, but it was spotted 2 days before it could land, so I aborted it.  KB showed up 3 days later.

I don't think that I will be able to win the game maybe a draw.  If I am to win I will have to do some big moves.  So I am thinking about where and when.  I am thinking about DEI and maybe Northern HIs.



JocMeister -> RE: Attention to orders (2/2/2014 4:50:19 PM)

Hang in there. It will turn eventually. [:)]



DOCUP -> RE: Attention to orders (2/2/2014 4:51:35 PM)

I hope but I still wonder.  Reading your AAR and when you had that last CV battle and everyone told you that you where done.  It hit me that damn I'm done too.



zuluhour -> RE: Attention to orders (2/2/2014 5:25:51 PM)

Your lucky your back or the AAR would look like the wall in the head at Hiva oa. [:D] Damn it! Joe, I only have Lexington, repairing well but stuck in a lagoon months from combat and Hornet, one day from her refit. She has no planes. Everything from scratch rebuilding her groups, I hesitate to look at the pools. I've done well with army air forces but may have neglected the marines and navy. I should get a turn tonight and we'll see. I can dig walking away for a breather. The game is ridiculously consuming. I think I saved about three thousand dollars on restaurants and happy hours last .......



JocMeister -> RE: Attention to orders (2/2/2014 5:36:04 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DOCUP

I hope but I still wonder.  Reading your AAR and when you had that last CV battle and everyone told you that you where done.  It hit me that damn I'm done too.


Iīm far from done. A lot of people are too loss averse. Ships are tools to be used and sometimes they sink. As long as they do that for a purpose Iīm fine with it. You just have to make sure yours didnīt sink in vain. You have a foothold in the DEI. Thats a game changing event. Losing a couple of CVs isnīt.

Hang in there! [:)]



DOCUP -> RE: Attention to orders (2/5/2014 2:11:14 AM)

7th Jan 44

Jap CVs around Truk

Burma
Has been quiet.  Tomorrow it will get loud.  I learned from the first sweep of Taung Gyi that Koniu will bring in more fighters after I sweep.  I can't go fighter to fighter with him.  So I have to risk this operation.  200 fighters will sweep, hopefully before the bombers go in.  Almost 100 4Es with 150 escort fighters.  32 2Es will go in during the night.  I hope to shut down the AF or atleast damage it enough to hamper his operations.

Timor AO
Jap CL TF raids Saumlaki and sinks a bunch of PT boats.  Georges sweep Babar and get the short end of the stick.  67 are shot down for only 15 of mine.  I landed a NBF at the dot base south of Saumlaki.  I will start to build up this base with the others.

Marshalls
Naval bombardment TFs hit Wotje and Maloelap.  I lose a bunch of SBDs attacking one of the BB TF with air cover from CVs.  I also lose a bunch of PTs here also.  It looks like Roi Namur's AFs are open again.  I will have to shut it down again.   Subs are now in position around these islands and more are on the way.

Still looking for ideas of future ops guys.  Come on you guys have some ideas.



zuluhour -> RE: Attention to orders (2/5/2014 2:14:16 AM)

most involve nylons at this time of the evening.[;)]



Alfred -> RE: Attention to orders (2/5/2014 2:26:27 AM)

Re request for future suggestions, could we have screenshots of all the theatres plus data on what is in situ for both sides?

Far too often Allied players are impatient to send in bombers.  Hoping to get a sweep in before the bombers strike on the same day, is not the way to gain air superiority.  Without air superiority, bombers will always be subject to enemy CAP.

Sometimes, not attempting to blast an enemy airfield back to the stone age is good tactics.  Leaving an enemy airfield heavily overloaded can be beneficial too.

Alfred



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