A question to those able to run large carrier battles without a lock-up

A question to those able to run large carrier battles without a lock-up (Full Version)

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Basement Command -> A question to those able to run large carrier battles without a lock-up (10/29/2002 12:32:38 AM)
Some of us can not engage in decisive carrier battles because the game locks-up while these battles are being resolved. Other, smaller battles seem to run fine. We're looking for a trend regarding hardware (video cards etc...) and software (for example operating systems) to help identify the cause of game lock-ups during the IJN attack phases of large carrier battles. So far, looking from the perspective of identifying common aspects of systems that do lock-up has not identified any clear trend. For those of us who HAVE NOT experienced these lock-ups while large IJN air groups are attacking Allied Task Forces, I have a question... What kind of system are you running? What OS, Processor, Video and sound cards? How Much RAM, etc... maybe if we can't identify what percipitates these lock-ups, we can start to get an idea of what works particularly well. Give a hand to those of us who can not really use this game to its potential and post your answers here. Thanks.

thantis -> (10/29/2002 12:50:18 AM)
I have noticed a couple (meaning exactly two) lock-ups during carrier engagements - and it occurred when I tried to exit out of the combat animations. When I hit the exit button at the top, the game froze. It happened every single time, until I went back and just let it run. This was the Clash of the Titans scenario as well. I've got a P4 1.8G, 80Gig HD, 64M Video card (not sure which one, will check tonight).

Toro -> (10/29/2002 1:19:54 AM)
I've had one, just this past weekend. Heck of a battle. Had to be hundreds and hundreds of a/c flying that turn (one hex had 120 CAP alone). Running: XP, 1.7 ghz P4, 384 RAM. I'll update this later tonight with video card info.

XPav -> (10/29/2002 1:38:50 AM)
I have not yet experienced one lockup in UV. Athlon 1600, 512MB RAM, 40 gig HD (less than 1 gig free), Gf4 Ti4200 video card.

mogami -> Lock Up's (10/29/2002 3:03:07 AM)
Greetings, On my old system I never had a carrier battle lock up but I once in a while had game lock up or drop to desk top after playing many hours (and alt-tabing back and forth zipping and un zipping PBEM files and remaining on line while making turns.) Now I usally have the game lockup once or twice a day but I am running on a differant machine. (I think the voodoo video card is the problem, since the CPU is a 800mhtz versus the 400 I used to play on (but I had a better video card.) Also I used to use win 98 this machine has win ME. All that said I have not ever!!!! had a lock up while the turn was being processed only when I was making my orders. While watching replays of turns I have locked up game on the voodoo machine by clicking done during combat (I never do this during the air attack part of carrier battles though only during land combat or the air to air.) The old machine never had a problem (I think it was a Diamond (something) video card.)Hope this helps

erict -> (10/29/2002 5:40:05 AM)
XP Pro SP1 & Uncommon Valor patched to 1.4 I've experienced lockups only during carrier engagements. I've also experienced this on two different computers with XP Pro. It always happens during carrier battles with animation on or off. I save very often...so the only way I can get around this lockup is if I avoid "THE" carrier battle. Kind of annoying.... Same lockups during similar situation on different systems using XP Pro: AMD XP 1700+ ASUS A7V266E 512mb RAM GF3 Ti200 (using latest WMD drivers 30.87) Audigy 120GB HD & PII 350 old ABIT mobo 256mb RAM old Matrox card SB X-gamer 20 gb HD Both DirectX 8.1 One thing I've noticed. The lockup always occurs when the JAPs are counterattacking during the same turn. Usually I cream the JAP carriers, and when the Jap strike wave comes in, it locks up before the battle report (remember this is with or without battle animation). I also noticed that the direction the attack wave is coming in from is completely wrong (you'd expect it to come from their carriers). Instead of coming from the direction of the Jap carriers it comes from a group of ships that don't have any carriers...... Always with BIG engagements, 4 US vs. 3 or 4 Jap carriers.

popejoy1 -> (10/29/2002 6:59:12 AM)
Hi! I had this problem with a lock-up when two large CV groups swapped airstrikes. I sent a save game to Matrix, and they were able to duplicate the problem, so I'd say it was a bug not necessarily related to my configuration. I'm hoping they're going to fix it in the next release. Hope this helps... :) Paul

bilbow -> no lockups (10/29/2002 7:33:55 AM)
In hundreds of hours of play, both vs the AI and PBEM I have never had a lock-up or a crash to desktop. I wish I could say that about most other games! I have v1.4, the system is a P4 1.8ghz with 256M memory, XP Home with SP1 and an Nvidia GF2 MX400 with 64 MB

erict -> (10/29/2002 8:54:57 AM)
I can play for 12 hours straight no problem, but if there is a huge carrier battle it will crash. Never fails to crash. Otherwise this game is very stable on my system.

Feinder -> (10/29/2002 10:34:18 AM)
I've never had a lock-up CPU : Athlon 1800XP Ram : 512meg DDR Video-card : 128meg Gf4ti 4400 Sound-card : Basic (SoundBlaster Pro or whatever) OS : Windows 2000 Other : DirectX 8.1 -F-

erict -> (10/29/2002 1:22:31 PM)
OK all yo geezers that say you've never had a lockup. Have you ever had a major carrier engagement??? 4 or more US vs. 3 or more Jap carriers??

Luskan -> No lockups (10/29/2002 2:05:59 PM)
New PC p4 1.4, Nvidia GF2 MX400 with 64 MB, 256mb RAM, Old pc, p3 800mghz, Riva tnt2 riva with 32mb, 128mb ram, both on windows 2000.

Feinder -> (10/29/2002 9:14:47 PM)
"OK all yo geezers that say you've never had a lockup. Have you ever had a major carrier engagement??? 4 or more US vs. 3 or more Jap carriers??" Well erict, I really wouldn't be replying to this thread unless I had (been engaged in a major carrier battle, specifically 4 on 4). :^) I don't really expect to have problems with any game on my box, and I like it that way. For what it's worth, if I had to make a wild-**-guess about why folks might get lock-ups, the most likely culprit is going to be memory leaks, and thus a shortage of RAM. Not to say that 256meg or more shouldn't* be enough (or whatever it says on the box). But MOST software is riddled with subtle memory leaks. I'm not criticizing Matrix, 2by3 or anyone. It doesn't matter how good a developer you are, these buggers bite everyone. A memory leak is where you have several processes going on at once in the program, and you no longer need some of the processes, but you don't actually terminate the process(es); or maybe you terminate it later than you should. What happens is that these extra processes are chewing up your available memory, and dragging the important ones that are actually doing things that you need. For example (and I'm just "for exampling" here!) Carrier battle goes like this: Spotting. Lauch. Intercept. Air-to-Air. Damage. Air-to-Surface. Damage. Couterstrike etc... Let's say for simplicity that each of those events is separate program. When everything is happy, all of the programs play well together, and you can play out a large carrier battle just fine. But now lets say you forget to actually TERMINATE the spotting rountine. You've set the flag that the TF has been spotted, and you move on to calling the program that rolls against your leadership to see if you launch. But even tho you have the RESULT from the spotting program, you don't actually terminate the thing, so it still remains in memory, acting as a drag on resources. This is the memory leak. You've "leaking memory" because you don't actually have available all that could have, because you're dragging those unecessary resources. The worst case of a memory leak is where you run out memory (because you're at capacity with the processes that you need -and- those that you don't). At this point (depending on how things are coded), you try to hit some extra space on your hard-drive (called the cache), to relieve the burden on the RAM. When you run out of RAM and cache, you're out of luck. "Unpredictable Results May Occur", in other words, you're screwed. Sorry for the long explanation. But simple answer is ALOT of programs (in fact, MOST) programs are riddled with memory leaks, minor as they may be. I know it sounds rather cliche' to blame lock-ups on them, but the fact is, that's the simplest explanation. However, the simplest isn't necessarily the easiest to fix. Folks with more RAM are going to be less affected by memory leaks, because they have a larger well to draw from in the first place. (* shrug *) Then again. I could be way wrong. -F-

cyberwop -> reboot (10/30/2002 12:19:10 AM)
I'll lock up on the first turn I play each day if I don't reboot before I launch the program. Sometimes it will lock up one time even after a fresh boot, but never more than once. Then I can play for hours no problem. I got 1.2 ath., 512 ram [133], Ge3 128mb ti, 40 gig 7200rpm HD [defraged, windows mem locked to 512 mb], win 98 se. Check your system resources, see how much you have free. If you bleed out memory up will lock. I keep 94 to 98% free. Good luck

erict -> (10/30/2002 3:51:21 AM)
4 US vs. 3- or 4 Jap carriers Carrier battle goes like this: Spotting. Lauch. Intercept. Air-to-Air. Damage. Air-to-Surface. Damage. Couterstrike Spotting. Lauch. Intercept. <<<<------------ At this phase during the Japanese counterattack it always locks up. Before the battle report pops up. =( Air-to-Air. Damage. Air-to-Surface. Damage.

XPav -> (10/30/2002 4:34:01 AM)
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Feinder [B] A memory leak is where you have several processes going on at once in the program, and you no longer need some of the processes, but you don't actually terminate the process(es); or maybe you terminate it later than you should. What happens is that these extra processes are chewing up your available memory, and dragging the important ones that are actually doing things that you need. [/QUOTE] Um. Err. Sorry, no. I hate to be a mean bastard here, but that's not the primary cause of memory leaks by any stretch. Primary cause of memory leaks: Writing programs in C, and mismatching malloc() and free(). You can do it in C++ too, and mismatch new and delete, with the additional bonus that your destructors don't get called. [URL=http://searchwin2000.techtarget.com/sDefinition/0,,sid1_gci213633,00.html]Here's a decent definition[/URL] [QUOTE] Then again. I could be way wrong. [/QUOTE] :D Memory leaks are common in many applications, yes. No doubts there. However, they are very frequently misunderstood and blamed for every single slow down that happens.

Feinder -> (10/30/2002 5:28:09 AM)
I don't think you're a mean bastard. I'm quite sure that we're both very knowledgable about this sort of thing. I was simply trying to put a (broad) defination of a memory leak into a frame that (most) everyone can understand. Regards, -F-

Ross Moorhouse -> (10/30/2002 9:25:41 AM)
The test team have been looking into this and none of them or myslfl have had a lock during Carrier battles.

Sabre21 -> (10/30/2002 9:26:31 AM)
Hey Feinder "OK all yo geezers that say you've never had a lockup...." I resemble that remark:) Besides that though, no I have never had a lock up and I have had huge carrier battles with hundreds of aircraft involved not to mention land based. My largest was where as the Jap I was making my first major push down towards Luganville after securing PM. I had 8-9 carriers in all with several other task forces and was attacked by a very aggresive AI that sent 4 US carriers and a couple hundred land based air. I thought I had cleaned out that darn pesky airfield, darn Allies scraped together everything that had a set of wings it seemed. What a huge series of air and sea battles that ensued..it was great. I have a p4 1.7 Ghz with 512 Mb ram and use an ati 9000 pro with 128 Mb. Sabre21

Feinder -> (10/31/2002 5:28:24 AM)
Sabre... "Old Geezers". I was quoting erict. At 31, I'm not sure if I resemble it or not, but sometimes it sure feels that way! Actually, wouldn't this thread normally be in the Tech Support/Solutions forum or something? -F-

Ross Moorhouse -> (11/1/2002 8:20:33 PM)
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Feinder [B]Sabre... "Old Geezers". I was quoting erict. At 31, I'm not sure if I resemble it or not, but sometimes it sure feels that way! Actually, wouldn't this thread normally be in the Tech Support/Solutions forum or something? -F- [/B][/QUOTE] Thats correct but I have allowed it to be here for the time being.

mogami -> Todays carrier battle (11/3/2002 3:19:44 AM)
Greetings, I am I admit running ver 1.48 but whatever problem exists in other versions did not effect this battle. 5xIJN CV versus 4xUSN CV AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 06/21/42 Air attack on TF, near Port Moresby at 10,40 Allied aircraft B-17E Fortress x 20 no losses Japanese Ships DD Nenohi AP Kinryu Maru AP Cuba Maru Attacking Level Bombers: 3 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet 3 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet 3 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet 1 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet 4 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet 3 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet 3 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Air attack on TF at 14,42 Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 65 Allied aircraft SBD Dauntless x 36 TBD Devastator x 15 Japanese aircraft losses A6M2 Zero x 1 destroyed A6M2 Zero x 6 damaged Allied aircraft losses SBD Dauntless x 14 destroyed SBD Dauntless x 24 damaged TBD Devastator x 18 destroyed TBD Devastator x 2 damaged PO2 A.Oyama of EII-1 Daitai is credited with kill number 4 LCDR J. Taylor of VT-5 bails out and is CAPTURED Japanese Ships CV Zuikaku CVL Shoho, Torpedo hits 1 DD Wakaba CV Shokaku -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Air attack on TF at 14,42 Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 58 Allied aircraft F4F-4 Wildcat x 26 SBD Dauntless x 70 TBD Devastator x 15 Japanese aircraft losses A6M2 Zero x 4 destroyed A6M2 Zero x 10 damaged Allied aircraft losses F4F-4 Wildcat x 8 destroyed F4F-4 Wildcat x 5 damaged SBD Dauntless x 18 destroyed SBD Dauntless x 13 damaged TBD Devastator x 4 destroyed TBD Devastator x 3 damaged PO2 A.Oyama of EII-1 Daitai is credited with kill number 5 LCDR R. Dixon of VS-2 is KILLED Japanese Ships CVL Shoho, Bomb hits 1, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage CV Zuikaku, Bomb hits 4, on fire DD Nagatsuki DD Suzukaze CA Furutaka CV Shokaku, Torpedo hits 1 CA Aoba -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Air attack on TF at 14,42 Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 60 Allied aircraft TBD Devastator x 15 Japanese aircraft losses A6M2 Zero x 1 destroyed A6M2 Zero x 4 damaged Allied aircraft losses TBD Devastator x 15 destroyed TBD Devastator x 2 damaged WO N.Oda of EII-1 Daitai is credited with kill number 4 LCDR J. Waldron of VT-8 is KILLED Japanese Ships CV Kaga -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Air attack on TF at 14,42 Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 52 Allied aircraft F4F-4 Wildcat x 3 SBD Dauntless x 34 TBD Devastator x 15 Japanese aircraft losses A6M2 Zero x 1 destroyed A6M2 Zero x 1 damaged Allied aircraft losses F4F-4 Wildcat x 1 destroyed SBD Dauntless x 8 destroyed SBD Dauntless x 19 damaged TBD Devastator x 4 destroyed TBD Devastator x 10 damaged CPO F.Sugiyama of AII-1 Daitai is credited with kill number 2 LT K. Notomi of EIII-1 Daitai is KILLED Japanese Ships CV Kaga, Bomb hits 4, Torpedo hits 1, on fire CV Soryu -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Air attack on TF, near Port Moresby at 10,40 Allied aircraft B-17E Fortress x 3 Allied aircraft losses B-17E Fortress x 1 destroyed B-17E Fortress x 2 damaged MAJ N.Daniels of 30th BS bails out WOUNDED and is RESCUED Japanese Ships AP Kyushu Maru Attacking Level Bombers: 2 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Air attack on TF at 12,45 Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 31 D3A Val x 64 B5N Kate x 45 Allied aircraft F4F-3 Wildcat x 23 F4F-4 Wildcat x 75 Japanese aircraft losses A6M2 Zero x 12 destroyed A6M2 Zero x 1 damaged D3A Val x 27 destroyed D3A Val x 18 damaged B5N Kate x 31 destroyed B5N Kate x 28 damaged Allied aircraft losses F4F-3 Wildcat x 1 destroyed F4F-3 Wildcat x 2 damaged F4F-4 Wildcat x 5 destroyed F4F-4 Wildcat x 8 damaged LTJG L. Knox of VF-42 is credited with kill number 2 LT I. Kitajima of AII-3 Daitai is KILLED Allied Ships CV Enterprise, Bomb hits 6, Torpedo hits 1, on fire CV Hornet, Bomb hits 1, Torpedo hits 3, on fire CA Salt Lake City CL Nashville -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Air attack on TF at 12,45 Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 9 D3A Val x 22 B5N Kate x 23 Allied aircraft F4F-3 Wildcat x 11 F4F-4 Wildcat x 34 Japanese aircraft losses A6M2 Zero x 4 destroyed D3A Val x 8 destroyed D3A Val x 4 damaged B5N Kate x 8 destroyed B5N Kate x 20 damaged Allied aircraft losses F4F-4 Wildcat x 6 destroyed F4F-4 Wildcat x 1 damaged PO2 V.Sakai of EII-1 Daitai is credited with kill number 2 Allied Ships CV Hornet, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage DD Cummings CV Enterprise, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage CA Portland -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Air attack on TF at 12,45 Japanese aircraft B5N Kate x 24 Allied aircraft F4F-3 Wildcat x 22 F4F-4 Wildcat x 66 Japanese aircraft losses B5N Kate x 17 destroyed B5N Kate x 9 damaged Allied aircraft losses F4F-4 Wildcat x 1 damaged LTJG P.Wagner of VF-3 is credited with kill number 3 LT T. Ichihara of EI-3 Daitai is KILLED Allied Ships CV Yorktown CV Lexington DD Dale -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Air attack on TF at 12,45 Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 7 B5N Kate x 10 Allied aircraft F4F-3 Wildcat x 22 F4F-4 Wildcat x 66 Japanese aircraft losses A6M2 Zero x 6 destroyed B5N Kate x 8 destroyed B5N Kate x 4 damaged Allied aircraft losses F4F-4 Wildcat x 2 destroyed F4F-4 Wildcat x 8 damaged LTJG P.Wagner of VF-3 is credited with kill number 4 LT M. Nakamoto of EIII-3 Daitai is KILLED Allied Ships CV Yorktown CV Lexington -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Air attack on TF, near Port Moresby at 10,40 Allied aircraft Hudson x 12 B-25D Mitchell x 29 B-26B Marauder x 12 Allied aircraft losses Hudson x 1 damaged B-26B Marauder x 1 damaged Japanese Ships MSW Fumi Maru #2 DD Nenohi AP Kinryu Maru AP Gosei Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire AP Hakonesan Maru AP Cuba Maru AP Hakuyo Maru AP Hokuhi Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage AP Heito Maru DD Hatsukaze DD Kazegumo Japanese ground losses: Men lost 136 Guns lost 1 Attacking Level Bombers: 1 x Hudson at 5000 feet 4 x B-26B Marauder at 6000 feet 4 x Hudson at 5000 feet 4 x B-25D Mitchell at 3000 feet 3 x B-25D Mitchell at 4000 feet 4 x B-26B Marauder at 6000 feet 4 x B-25D Mitchell at 4000 feet 1 x B-26B Marauder at 6000 feet 4 x Hudson at 5000 feet 4 x B-25D Mitchell at 3000 feet 3 x B-26B Marauder at 6000 feet 4 x B-25D Mitchell at 4000 feet 1 x B-25D Mitchell at 3000 feet 4 x B-25D Mitchell at 3000 feet 1 x B-25D Mitchell at 3000 feet 3 x Hudson at 5000 feet 4 x B-25D Mitchell at 4000 feet -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Air attack on TF, near Port Moresby at 10,40 Allied aircraft B-17E Fortress x 16 no losses Japanese Ships AP Hakozaki Maru DD Kazegumo DD Hatsukaze AP Hakonesan Maru AP Kinryu Maru Attacking Level Bombers: 4 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet 3 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet 3 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet 3 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet 3 x B-17E Fortress at 6000 feet -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Day Time Surface Combat, near Port Moresby at 10,40 Japanese Ships DD Kazegumo, Shell hits 28, and is sunk DD Hatsukaze, Shell hits 38, and is sunk DD Nenohi, Shell hits 19, and is sunk MSW Fumi Maru #2, Shell hits 5, and is sunk AP Brazil Maru AP Cuba Maru AP Gosei Maru, Shell hits 3, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage AP Hakonesan Maru AP Hakozaki Maru AP Hakuyo Maru AP Heito Maru AP Hinko Maru AP Hokuhi Maru, and is sunk AP Kinryu Maru, Shell hits 1 AP Yamafuku Maru Allied Ships CA Northampton, Shell hits 1 CA Minneapolis, Shell hits 2 CA Australia, Shell hits 1 CL Hobart, Shell hits 2 DD Grayson, Shell hits 2, on fire DD Mustin DD Walke DD Smith, Shell hits 1, on fire DD Dewey DD MacDonough, Shell hits 2 DD Worden DD Alwin Japanese ground losses: Men lost 87 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Day Time Surface Combat, near Port Moresby at 10,40 Japanese Ships DD Umikaze, Shell hits 3, on fire DD Kamikaze APD 2, Shell hits 1, on fire MSW W20, Shell hits 1, on fire AP Akibasan Maru AP China Maru AP Kenshin Maru AP Kyushu Maru AP Otori Maru AP Taimei Maru Allied Ships CA Northampton CA Minneapolis CA Australia CL Hobart DD Grayson, Shell hits 1, on fire DD Mustin DD Walke, Shell hits 1 DD Smith, on fire DD Dewey DD MacDonough DD Worden DD Alwin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ground combat at Port Moresby Japanese Deliberate attack Attacking force 7539 troops, 78 guns, 0 vehicles Defending force 8932 troops, 68 guns, 0 vehicles Japanese assault odds: 0 to 1 (fort level 2) Japanese ground losses: Men lost 58 Allied ground losses: Men lost 27 So hopefully whatever problems there were will go away after the public release of next patch

jive1 -> (11/5/2002 3:17:49 PM)
I have yet to get a lock up - but I notice that the reports get slower and slower during large surface battles. I am eventually forced to end the animations.

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