STAVKA & disappearing Engineer Units? (Full Version)

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marty_01 -> STAVKA & disappearing Engineer Units? (11/2/2011 3:44:00 PM)

New PBEM 41-45GC using 1.05.37. I've been trying to build RR Construction Brigade Support units in the STAVKA HQ. They appear as (u) units in the STAVKA HQ inventory on the turn I "buy" them. However, they seem to disappear somewhere before the start of the next turn. I tried the same thing on turns 2 and 3 (I think I tried on turn 1 as well, but I can't recall if there is a restriction on building support units in Soviet HQs on turn 1).

Game settings are HQ's locked, so they can't be migrating to other HQ's.

I just completed my turn 4 and again "bought" a couple RR-Construction Brigades. I've also bought a plain Jane construction battalion, a sapper battalion and sapper regiment just to see if whatever is occurring with the disappearing RR-Construction Brigades is happening to other engineer units as well. I'll post here again as soon as I get Turn 5 from my opponent.

Side Note: Thus far, I seem to only experience this issue with the STAVKA HQ. I created RR Construction Brigades in other Red Army HQs and haven't had this disappearing support unit issue.



ComradeP -> RE: STAVKA & disappearing Engineer Units? (11/2/2011 4:28:35 PM)

You're sure they're actually disappearing? As in: when you check the commander's report screen, they're not shown as being assigned to some HQ? It could be that construction units are dodging the HQ locked setting, we've had problems with construction units moving all over the place in the past.



marty_01 -> RE: STAVKA & disappearing Engineer Units? (11/2/2011 5:27:12 PM)

I have no idea if they are, or aren’t reappearing somewhere else. I’ll try to cross check the event logs vs. unit numbers created in the STAVKA HQ assignment screen.

I’ve never noticed this particular issue before. In fact in a solitaire game I am currently playing – me vs. myself – I haven’t noticed any particular problem with STAVKA building RR-Construction Brigades. The differences between the games is that the solitaire game was started using 1.05.32. The second differance is that in the PBEM we are playing with the HQ Locked option selected. Conversely in my “me vs. myself” game I didn’t select the HQ locked option at the start of the game. Perhaps these are unrelated (i.e. starting with 1.05.32 and Unlocked vs. Locked Options) – but they do represent potential contrasts in respective input parameters between the two games.



Joel Billings -> RE: STAVKA & disappearing Engineer Units? (11/2/2011 5:33:09 PM)

I'm not sure that locked freezes the construction units that are actually being moved around by the AI to the various HQ's based on the generic automatic need for these in each HQ listed in the manual. Best way is to look for these units in the CR screen as stated and see where they have migrated to.



Richard III -> RE: STAVKA & disappearing Engineer Units? (11/2/2011 6:08:07 PM)

That`s still happening in my game with 1.35.32 started with locked HQ`s. The Bots stop working about T4-6 and end up in the german Corps./Army HQ`s.


quote:

ORIGINAL: ComradeP

You're sure they're actually disappearing? As in: when you check the commander's report screen, they're not shown as being assigned to some HQ? It could be that construction units are dodging the HQ locked setting, we've had problems with construction units moving all over the place in the past.




ComradeP -> RE: STAVKA & disappearing Engineer Units? (11/2/2011 7:07:07 PM)

Note that, as detailed in the manual, the various HQ types generally have a certain engineer/construction support units "need" that's hard-coded, so even with support levels set to 0, they will try to get engineer/construction support units.

However, if HQ's are locked, the support units shouldn't be moving around, not even the engineer/construction units.

I'm not sure if there's some sort of die roll for whether a construction unit tries to repair a nearby rail line or not. I've noticed that construction units don't necessarily do so, particularly if they're assigned to a HQ with combat units directly assigned to it, as they might try to help with fort construction in that case.



Q-Ball -> RE: STAVKA & disappearing Engineer Units? (11/2/2011 9:53:31 PM)

You also won't see them as a Support Unit on the STAVKA unit screen, if that unit is off repairing a rail line somewhere on the map. You won't until it returns to the HQ

On the German side, you won't see most OKH Construction units turn after turn for this reason, but they are on the map repairing. You will see them in the unit screen.

I bet those units didn't disappear



marty_01 -> RE: STAVKA & disappearing Engineer Units? (11/3/2011 1:33:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ComradeP

You're sure they're actually disappearing? As in: when you check the commander's report screen, they're not shown as being assigned to some HQ? It could be that construction units are dodging the HQ locked setting, we've had problems with construction units moving all over the place in the past.


This is probably all the result of user error on mine and my opponents part. I was looking at the event logs more carefully and my German opponent was playing the last four turns with 1.05.32 while I was playing with 1.05.37. Shyte.

But I still dug into my turn files and it looks like the Engineer units were wondering away from STAVKA during whatever phase such things occur. By a stroke of luck, I just happened to have an intermediate turn file saved for turn 2 of this GC. I was able to figure out exactly what support units I had created\bought for the STAVKA HQ on turn 2. I compared this to STAVKA support unit attachments at the start of my turn 3. As it Turns out I had actually "purchased" four Construction Battalions for STAVKA HQ on Turn 2 -- not RR-Construction Brigades as I had thought. The 101st, 102nd, 103rd and 104th Construction Battalions. Inspite of HQ lock being on, all four construction battalions had apparently migrated to other HQs somewhere between Turn 2 and Turn 3. I tracked all four battalions down via the commander's report and verified by clicking on the HQ itself to make sure the support unit was actually showing up in as one of the HQs attached units. All four battalions were residing in other Army and Corps level HQs.



randallw -> RE: STAVKA & disappearing Engineer Units? (11/3/2011 7:29:23 PM)

My perception of the rules is that engineer and construction units are not controlled by the regular lock/unlocked rules.

Each HQ type has a minimum amount of engineer/construction units it tries to maintain, and will steal them from HQs that have too many.  Stavka may have no minimum requirements, so those units are heading off to a lower level HQ that is grubbing for them.



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