Isolating Axis spearheads (Full Version)

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Hoooper -> Isolating Axis spearheads (11/9/2011 2:15:17 AM)

It seems to me that the main tactical dilemma facing the Soviets during the early war is whether to isolate the Wehrmacht's spearheads or move what you can eastwards to reform your line. My experience so far is that the more aggressive option only works if you're in a position to trade blows with the Germans; otherwise your counter attacking forces (usually armour and cavalry) will be cut off themselves, and the Panzers that you isolated, having suffered nothing more than a minor inconvenience, press on towards your factories. I wonder what other players' experiences have been.



bwheatley -> RE: Isolating Axis spearheads (11/9/2011 2:49:46 PM)

That is pretty much it. If you cut off a german unit 9 times out of 10 whatever you commit to that is dead. Just be prepared to not be upset when you get those units killed.



FredSanford3 -> RE: Isolating Axis spearheads (11/9/2011 10:04:29 PM)

OTOH, throwing the panzers out of supply, even with just a ZOC isolation that is broken the next turn, makes them miss at least one logistics cycle.  This results in fewer MP's, higher attrition, higher fatigue, unrepaired damaged vehicles and I think possible morale loss.  I almost never decline an opportunity to cut off spearheads.  If you can do it repeatedly, it will rapidly erode the panzer force.  Yeah, those units involved are usually lost, but in terms of one early rifle division's ability to have a strategic impact, this is pretty much the most bang for the buck you'll get out of your soon-to-be-dead early units anyhow.

Anything to get in the panzer's way and be a PITA in general is a good thing for the Russians.  Just don't overcommit.



heliodorus04 -> RE: Isolating Axis spearheads (11/9/2011 10:28:06 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Franklin Nimitz

OTOH, throwing the panzers out of supply, even with just a ZOC isolation that is broken the next turn, makes them miss at least one logistics cycle.  This results in fewer MP's, higher attrition, higher fatigue, unrepaired damaged vehicles and I think possible morale loss.  I almost never decline an opportunity to cut off spearheads.  If you can do it repeatedly, it will rapidly erode the panzer force.  Yeah, those units involved are usually lost, but in terms of one early rifle division's ability to have a strategic impact, this is pretty much the most bang for the buck you'll get out of your soon-to-be-dead early units anyhow.

Anything to get in the panzer's way and be a PITA in general is a good thing for the Russians.  Just don't overcommit.


Just to cover this from an Axis perspective, I have found that it is a huge benefit to the Germans to ensure panzer divisions do not get cut off. As Nimitz points out, when you miss your start-of-turn logistics/replacement/refit step, you lose an entire turn's worth of recovery. As I've focused on not letting this happen (unless a truly worthy prize requires, like crossing the Dnepr), my pace of operations more than makes up for the occasional extra hexes that I cannot reach.



Hoooper -> RE: Isolating Axis spearheads (11/10/2011 4:02:49 PM)

Ah, I didn't know that - serves me right for never playing the Germans. So, as you might expect, it's a judgment call. I tend to look at the fuel indicator on the mobile unit, in the belief that a red division will be more affected by isolation than a green one. Is that actually true, though?



heliodorus04 -> RE: Isolating Axis spearheads (11/10/2011 4:55:18 PM)

I would never read the fuel or supply status indicator on an enemy unit and read useful information from it.  It's simply a gas guage, and in tells you nothing about their expected performance (or movement allowance). 



Hoooper -> RE: Isolating Axis spearheads (11/10/2011 8:00:15 PM)

Bummer



mmarquo -> RE: Isolating Axis spearheads (11/11/2011 1:12:11 AM)

Especially when the Axis player is chaining HQ supply...the indicator means nothing for the upcoming move.



Peltonx -> RE: Isolating Axis spearheads (11/11/2011 4:02:36 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Franklin Nimitz

OTOH, throwing the panzers out of supply, even with just a ZOC isolation that is broken the next turn, makes them miss at least one logistics cycle.  This results in fewer MP's, higher attrition, higher fatigue, unrepaired damaged vehicles and I think possible morale loss.  I almost never decline an opportunity to cut off spearheads.  If you can do it repeatedly, it will rapidly erode the panzer force.  Yeah, those units involved are usually lost, but in terms of one early rifle division's ability to have a strategic impact, this is pretty much the most bang for the buck you'll get out of your soon-to-be-dead early units anyhow.

Anything to get in the panzer's way and be a PITA in general is a good thing for the Russians.  Just don't overcommit.


If you just cut of an HQ that got a build up that turn your in for a nasty surpise the next 2 turns after they got back in normal supply, ask Flaviusx. Its like a big supply dump waiting to get used the following 2 turns.

I chian HQ's so when a spearhead gets cut off, its a good thing in the long run.



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