About unit design of artillery, AT or MG, do I add squad? (Full Version)

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Hoffmann -> About unit design of artillery, AT or MG, do I add squad? (11/20/2011 2:58:01 PM)

Hello All,
Since it's my first post here, I shortly introduce myself, i'm half German, half French guy living in Europe. I played and play with all version of TOAW (I, II and III) and many other matrix game or other wargame editor. I'm not really a scenario designer, just I corrected some when I thought that some unit weren't rightly equipped, off course in my humble opinion.
So, about the topic I wish to ask tips about, it's really simple but I wasn't able to find answer in past topics. Should we add the infantry component of guns and mg in the unit?
I give some example, with very classical German KStN :
KStN 1114c (nov 43) : the MG and mortar gruppe have 4 HMG42 and 2 mortar 81mm but beside this, there is some soldier : 7 in each MG gruppe and 9 in the mortar one, and they have all rifle or SMG weapon. It's also 7+7+9 = 25 soldier and if u look at the basic defensive power of MG and mortar it's near zero meaning the infantry is not counted. So is adding 3 infantry squad correct?
KStN 1122 (oct 37) : AT gun gruppe have 3 AT Gun but beside this it have 10 soldier with rifle, 6 with pistole and 3 NCO with MP and one LMG. Adding the LMG is obvious, but what about the 19 soldier?
KStN 615 FG (mar 44) : Nebelwerfer gruppe have 3 Nbw but beside this 18 soldier and 3 NCO for the gun and 6 soldier for munitions, so 27 man with rifle and MP. Should I ask 3 squad?
Also what I mean is that all towed equipment have really low defensive power, but in real situation, if they are directly attacked, the soldier should, at least a few, defend their own gun?

So what do u think about this 3 possibility :
1/ just put the gun without counting the infantry
2/ adding the infantry squad
3/ creating entry in the database like this, ie, "Escort Infantry" with only defensive capacity and low fighting ones
Thanks for ur comment and tips
Bye

D. Hoffmann




Oberst_Klink -> RE: About unit design of artillery, AT or MG, do I add squad? (11/20/2011 3:10:30 PM)

Mon camarade Allemagne-France,

Depending on the size of your artillery units, attach a security squad, platoon, company using light infantry squads according to the KStN.

Have a look at the forum thread -> http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2843599&mpage=1&key=�
or visit the Gefechtsstand! :)

Klink, Oberst



Hoffmann -> RE: About unit design of artillery, AT or MG, do I add squad? (11/20/2011 3:54:26 PM)

Dear Kamerad,

I thank u for the answer, danke schön und merci! Also, I looked at this post already and it's a very good things u and Jagdtiger653 did. I created my own database and unit coz I like to search over many documentation (by the way, i have many doc n book regarding military history, result of 15 years of collection, so if someone need info, plz feel free to ask). My first motivation of modding database is that i was tired of adding plenty of MMG in so many panzergrenadier unit coz they have 2 per squad, hehe! Then i thought that the generic MMG didn't reflect the value of MG42 in soft killing capacity, etc...

I agree with ur proposal to add light squad, I think it's the most logical solution. Just I wonder about the behavior of these added squad in the fighting engine of TOAW3 and how I should design these kind of squad compared to the other corresponding infantry ones? lesser AT/AP, maybe I should put special capacity? active or passive defender? etc... Also I don't know exactly how the engine work and I dont wish to unbalance the game.

About the documentation I have here, maybe I should create a thread with a list?

Thank u. Bye

D. Hoffmann



1_Lzard -> RE: About unit design of artillery, AT or MG, do I add squad? (11/22/2011 1:20:58 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hoffmann
Dear Kamerad,
About the documentation I have here, maybe I should create a thread with a list?
D. Hoffmann


Might be a plan! If you do, perhaps you could load it to http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2231803 which is where most things like this are placed.



Hoffmann -> RE: About unit design of artillery, AT or MG, do I add squad? (11/22/2011 7:05:22 PM)

Hi 1_Lzard,
OK, I will check what is in this thread already and if there is some limitation in size, topic, etc... Also, I have a lot of KStN and Nafziger doc, but they could be easily found in internet in the csgc edu site, and many KStN can be found sorted by Christophe Awender site which is always in progress coz he certainly translate them from the German source which can be found (but in big pack and not sorted) in sturmpanzer site. I have as well some rarity, pics and handwriting military manual of 1900's from my family. Unfortunately a part were lost coz one of my greatfather was shot by the soviet.
Thanks u
Bye

D. Hoffmann



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