Soooo..... (Full Version)

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veji1 -> Soooo..... (2/24/2012 1:23:45 PM)

Hi Guys, anything you could give us to keep us from forgetting to even check this board once in a while ? I hope the project is still going forward and wish you guys luck... That said some feedback wouldn't hurt.



Gil R. -> RE: Soooo..... (2/27/2012 7:25:13 AM)

Thanks for asking. No real feedback of substance: testing continues, though Eric has to do some pressing things for the "Conflict of Heroes" release before he can produce the next patch. That other game is the main cause of BAB's delay, since even though I'm marginally involved our programming and graphics resources have almost entirely gone into that. For those of you who don't know, "Conflict of Heroes" is an outstanding and quite popular WWII boardgame, and one which promises to be a bigger seller than BAB -- or our previous games, for that matter -- so there wasn't much of a debate in terms of what to prioritize. But with COH work truly winding down, BAB will soon be on the front-burner. We thank everyone for your patience!



wodin -> RE: Soooo..... (3/10/2012 11:44:03 PM)

Gil thats good news. Not normally into the Civil War but I liked the combat engine in your previous civil war games.



ajarnlance -> RE: Soooo..... (4/18/2012 9:12:46 AM)

Any chance that the Forge of Freedom and Crown of Glory strategic games will be updated?? These are two of my all-time favourite games. While I love the tactical nature of wargames I prefer it when they take place in the wider context of a strategic game. A pity to read that so much work has gone into another WWII game (that market is already overcrowded) while two excellent periods of history (Napoleionic and American Civil War) are largely neglected. I guess it is the sad fact that the younger generation (read customer) doesn't care much about history anymore. I recently had a conversation with a colleague who didn't even know who Napoleon was... sighs... western civilisation is in decline (NOT the game studio but the actual civilisation). One person shooters are all the rage now... teenagers with the attention spans of gnats dominate the market... sorry, just venting.



Bamilus -> RE: Soooo..... (5/7/2012 2:52:16 AM)

So is this game a spiritual successor to FoF or is it using a totally different approach?



Vyshka -> RE: Soooo..... (5/8/2012 5:15:17 AM)

My understanding is this basically takes the tactical battle system from Crown of Glory / Forge of Freedom and applies it to specific scenarios instead of generic battles.



Bamilus -> RE: Soooo..... (5/8/2012 9:04:10 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Vyshka

My understanding is this basically takes the tactical battle system from Crown of Glory / Forge of Freedom and applies it to specific scenarios instead of generic battles.


So there won't be a grand campaign?



Gil R. -> RE: Soooo..... (5/8/2012 11:37:54 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ajarnlance

Any chance that the Forge of Freedom and Crown of Glory strategic games will be updated?? These are two of my all-time favourite games. While I love the tactical nature of wargames I prefer it when they take place in the wider context of a strategic game. A pity to read that so much work has gone into another WWII game (that market is already overcrowded) while two excellent periods of history (Napoleionic and American Civil War) are largely neglected. I guess it is the sad fact that the younger generation (read customer) doesn't care much about history anymore. I recently had a conversation with a colleague who didn't even know who Napoleon was... sighs... western civilisation is in decline (NOT the game studio but the actual civilisation). One person shooters are all the rage now... teenagers with the attention spans of gnats dominate the market... sorry, just venting.



Not sure I have a good (i.e., welcome) answer to this... FOF is a game we would like one day to update, but it's unclear whether that would be lucrative enough. We did an expansion of COG and that proved not to be the wisest decision. The decision to develop computer-COH was a no-brainer, as it's one of our favorite boardgames, and its large fan base and various other factors made it quite appealing from both a personal and business perspective. Games like COG and FOF that combine two levels are far, far more complex to program than those at one level, so to produce such games requires great confidence that there will be a reward, and these days the general market for games seems to prefer something less complex.

Of course, if COH sells so well that we all become millionaires then we can develop games on whatever we want to do. Perhaps even that War of Jenkins' Ear game I occasionally dream about...



Gil R. -> RE: Soooo..... (5/8/2012 11:41:29 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bamilus

So is this game a spiritual successor to FoF or is it using a totally different approach?


An imprecise question, but I think the answer, not to be glib, is "both." Much will be familiar to FOF players, but there are also fundamental differences. (The one that's most noticeable is that you don't choose targets, but rather you move your units into position and the game determines which enemy units post the most immediate threat and should be fired upon -- after all, in the Civil War regiments fired at the closest enemies. Some players might find this lack of control jarring, but it works quite well, and when I play-test I never find myself thinking that I wish I could have chosen each unit's target.)



Capt Cliff -> RE: Soooo..... (5/26/2012 9:27:14 PM)

Sooo ... this is a battle only game? Or is it an update of FoF, meaning a grand strategy game with production and politics.



RedArgo -> RE: Soooo..... (5/27/2012 2:58:47 AM)

I believe it is individual battles only.



Bamilus -> RE: Soooo..... (5/31/2012 12:12:49 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: RedArgo

I believe it is individual battles only.


If this is true then that really stinks [:(]



Yogi the Great -> RE: Soooo..... (5/31/2012 2:35:49 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bamilus


quote:

ORIGINAL: RedArgo

I believe it is individual battles only.


If this is true then that really stinks [:(]


I don't see why. Gamers have purchased individual battle games for many years and many more to come. BAB will give a more historical feel to actual battles and include several sceanrios and battles. If the series continues you will be able to fight most all major battles of the war.

While built on the Tactical system in FOF, it is upgraded, has new features and is an improvement over the FOF system.



Bamilus -> RE: Soooo..... (5/31/2012 6:29:41 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yogi the Great

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bamilus


quote:

ORIGINAL: RedArgo

I believe it is individual battles only.


If this is true then that really stinks [:(]


I don't see why. Gamers have purchased individual battle games for many years and many more to come. BAB will give a more historical feel to actual battles and include several sceanrios and battles. If the series continues you will be able to fight most all major battles of the war.

While built on the Tactical system in FOF, it is upgraded, has new features and is an improvement over the FOF system.


I'm quite aware of that fact. I was speaking (obviously) strictly from my standpoint. My tastes don't include individual battles; I am solely a fan of larger "grand" strategy games.



Yogi the Great -> RE: Soooo..... (6/2/2012 3:24:11 PM)

Hmmm, obviously you don't seem to grasp the term obviously. [;)]

But now that we are all aware of the same facts - Grand Strategy games are among my favorites as well so I certainly understand anyone having a preference for them. Of course I also understand that many do like to fight historical battles.



Bamilus -> RE: Soooo..... (6/2/2012 9:44:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yogi the Great

Hmmm, obviously you don't seem to grasp the term obviously. [;)]

But now that we are all aware of the same facts - Grand Strategy games are among my favorites as well so I certainly understand anyone having a preference for them. Of course I also understand that many do like to fight historical battles.


What are you even talking about? lol



Anthropoid -> RE: Soooo..... (8/14/2012 7:54:45 PM)

Hey guys, just popping in to say hello and hope all your projects are going well! [:D]



Gil R. -> RE: Soooo..... (9/8/2012 2:07:29 AM)

Anthropoid et al.,
Seems like a good time to say that another big build that gets the game closer to completion is being released to the testers this weekend. So BAB is very much on the front burner again. No chance it can come out in 2012, though, because of production schedules and other factors, but after a long lull we're at least making good progress once again. Stay tuned...



Wardyr -> RE: Soooo..... (9/15/2012 11:37:22 AM)

Gil, love the quote. It is beyond mean, but I still love it.



Gil R. -> RE: Soooo..... (9/23/2012 5:53:53 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wardyr

Gil, love the quote. It is beyond mean, but I still love it.



Thanks. Do you recognize the movie (and possibly book) it's adapted from?

I'm pleased to report that Eric has produced a new full build of BAB for the testers, which takes care of a lot of issues. After a long delay to give proper attention to "Conflict of Heroes," we're back in full development mode. Which means I need to start producing more scenarios, as the next big thing.



gchristie -> RE: Soooo..... (10/8/2012 8:02:55 PM)

Thank you for Smoking.



Wardyr -> RE: Soooo..... (10/12/2012 5:49:24 AM)

Yup it is Thank you for smoking in which the quote is, "Michael Jordan plays ball, Charles Manson Kills people. I talk. Everyone has a talent."
Also the book title is the same as the movie.



Blind Sniper -> RE: Soooo..... (1/27/2013 12:18:08 AM)

News?



takati97realm -> RE: Soooo..... (2/2/2013 4:31:44 AM)

quote:

FOF is a game we would like one day to update, but it's unclear whether that would be lucrative enough.


What if it was "tweaked"...Forge of Freedom, even to date, has one of the better tactical "games" compared to other civil war game competition. What if Forge of Freedom had a campaign map around the province scale of Ageod's ACW: blue and gray? For a grand campaign game, I think you guys hit it right with the brigade size for the troops. Although the regiment size would be super cool, that would probably hurt broader appeal to the public, for a grand campaign. The cannons always seemed too out of place though with the brigade size...But what if cannons were further abstracted...Instead of placing Army/Corps/Division Commanders with units, what if they were each their own unit but also represented artillery? Put more emphasis on artillery being a unit dis-organizer than a unit killer? Army/Corps/Division could each have different attack ranges representing different levels/ranges of support? What if supply wagons had a more limited/noninfinite replenishment? Personally, I think just changing the strategic map scale would do wonders...



Gil R. -> RE: Soooo..... (2/7/2013 10:47:33 PM)

Doing it that way is an interesting suggestion. It wouldn't hurt to put that in the FOF "Wish List" thread, though we're a long ways from considering that or another ACW game that isn't BAB (which, assuming it's successful, we'd be releasing for the next few years).

My own preference would be to do a sort of zoomed-in FOF that has individual theaters (VA/MD/PA would be the most obvious) but zooms into the BAB regimental-level engine for battles.

Sadly, it's easy to come up with ideas for what WCS should do, but we only have time for a fraction of our ideas and those suggested to us.

P.S. While I have everyone's attention, since many will have clicked on this thread expecting a BAB update, I figured I should add that there has been recent progress in preparing the final maps, which are vital to testing (as well as finishing the game, obviously). So the game is still in production. Once we have the final maps in the game there will be more to say, not to mention some screenshots.



Gil R. -> RE: Soooo..... (2/7/2013 10:49:16 PM)

Speaking of screenshots, I just remembered this thread:
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2471819
I sure had fun with that one.



RyanCrierie -> RE: Soooo..... (2/20/2013 5:21:25 AM)

quote:

We did an expansion of COG and that proved not to be the wisest decision.


Sad to hear about that.



Bamilus -> RE: Soooo..... (4/1/2013 3:00:37 AM)

Any updates?....



veji1 -> RE: Soooo..... (4/3/2013 6:40:19 PM)

Not a good sign I must say. To be honest I had forgotten about this possible game.. And to be even more honest, with AACW2 from Ageod coming, this game will probably be a pass. As a married with kids and long hours type of man I have only so much time for games. I hope this game, if ever produced, will be so awesome I will have to change my mind, but to be honest with such a slow paced development, I have my doubts. Nevertheless good luck.



Bamilus -> RE: Soooo..... (4/7/2013 10:13:35 PM)

Agreed. It's been three years and we barely have anything on this game.



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