A way to stop pirates? (Full Version)

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BlackAlpha -> A way to stop pirates? (4/1/2012 4:11:10 PM)

Is there a way to stop pirates or slow them down somehow?

I keep destroying all their bases as fast as possible but it seems they simply respawn as soon as I blow them up. I'm getting tired of it because I keep getting warnings about my mining stations and constructors getting attacked.

I'm playing with a huge galaxy, so covering every inch of the galaxy is impossible, but I did try the following:

1. I tried buying lots of escorts and frigates, but the AI is unable to use them effectively. The AI actually wastes away the escorts/frigates purpose by flying them from one safe planet to the next, the escorting happens during FTL travel; you know, when they cannot get attacked or react to a nearby attack. Now, this wouldn't be bad if it was like real life, where a show of force would have an effect. But here, it just means they are wasting away my money by flying around and looking pretty. So I scrapped that idea and tried something else.

2. I tried increasing the taskforce/fleet ratio, which works a little bit better because most ships are put into task forces, which means they don't end up flying through empty space nonstop. But the problem is that task forces only reinforce close to the system they are positioned in. This is a big issue in a large galaxy because most attacks happen just outside of their defending range. The problem is that you cannot overwrite their range because the AI stubbornly undoes your change. So again, most of the time, the ships end up just sitting there, wasting away my money and looking pretty.

I have now given up on attacking the pirates because it's a lot of micromanagement and it seems pointless. But I feel like I'm missing something very obvious here that allows you to stop the pirates. So, what am I missing?



Theluin -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/1/2012 4:41:49 PM)

There are several ways to do that, but my favourite (because it requires very little micromanagement and is pretty effective) is doing 2 things (The second point is optional but I highly recommend it):
1. Adding 2 fighter bays to the designs for mining stations. The fighters get automatically upgraded as you advance in tech so you don't have to scrap the station to upgrade weapons.
2. Building quite a lot of escorts and/or frigates (by a lot I mean a couple of hundred) The fighters will usually manage to destroy/force to flee pirate escorts and frigates and your escorts/frigates will take care of pirate destroyers/cruisers and the occasional stray ardilus or kaltor.



nelmsm1 -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/1/2012 7:45:01 PM)

I've the best way is to set the slider to "very few" when setting up the game.



shinobu -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/1/2012 8:11:26 PM)

Well, you could pay them... [:)]



jpwrunyan -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/2/2012 6:16:11 AM)

Two fighter bays on all your mining bases... I loled.

"sir, would you like a mining component with your fighter garrison?"



Blueberry -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/2/2012 7:37:06 AM)

Once you have explored all the systems around and within your empires' borders, you can que construction ships to build mining bases at all those fuel source locations including gas clouds. Clean up a system, keep a patrol force at the location until a constructor arrives and does its thing. The more locations you have secured with a gas mining station, the less spawning points the pirates are left with. Understandably, the option is both time consuming and a bit annoying. However, peace and quiet from having no pirates in your proximity ensures your military pays its undivided attention to those annoying neighbours.

Alternatively, you can always equip any mining stations with several shields and blasters for starters. Additional maintenance costs won't hurt that much. [:)]



jpwrunyan -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/3/2012 3:29:24 AM)

It boils down to this: playing with pirates is like play whack-a-mole. If you like playing whack-a-mole, play with pirates. If you dont, dont.
Some people state that they like pirate so that they can do evil things and still recover their reputation. I dislike such exploits. I like pirates because of the added pressure it creates to have some fleet and escorts. But I hate it when later it becomes whack-a-mole and constant attack message spam. So I ultimately turn them off.

I wish the game simply spawned pirates over a course of time instead of having some static number of pirates constant in the galaxy. Then once you destroy the base, that is one less pirate faction for at least x number of years. This would make it possible to purge them entirely if you are determined. Alas, moles it is.



tjhkkr -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/3/2012 6:04:31 PM)

I like pirates because of the challenge myself.

And I do not add fighter components, but I do arm my gas/mining stations and strengthen their shields... if you have a fair number of frigates and so on, not a lot, but the shields and weapons keep the pirates at bay long enough for the warships to come in for the kill. I have thought about adding hyper-disrupt to the stations as well so they cannot slip away after the warships arrive.



ASHBERY76 -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/3/2012 8:30:39 PM)

You either stop them by turning them off in the game settings or making the whole galaxy empire territory.Any other method and that means the pirate concept is not working.



jpwrunyan -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/4/2012 2:32:57 AM)

I also agree with ashbery76.

Pirates are not working.



BlackAlpha -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/6/2012 2:35:18 PM)

Thanks for the replies, guys. I'll try out your suggestions.

I find this whole pirate thing a bit funny because I feel like I'm, nonstop, waging a full out war against the pirates. Compared to the wars against the other races, this war is on a whole different level. It forces me to apply the full strenght of my entire armada. I'm waging this war on many different fronts. But don't see that as a weakness, I have enough resources to wage such a war tenfold. Also consider the fact that I'm raking in one victory after another, there are no defeats, only victories. And yet, whatever I do, it has no effect whatsoever, and the war is neverending. That's why this game feature feels out of place to me and I think I'll simply turn off the pirates the next game I play.



ASHBERY76 -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/6/2012 7:13:51 PM)

It only takes 4 destroyers to wipe out pirate bases.And small defence fleets guarding sectors.It is not hard.

I like the system buy maybe respamming pirates bases needs to be toned down.



tjhkkr -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/6/2012 8:36:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ASHBERY76
It only takes 4 destroyers to wipe out pirate bases.And small defence fleets guarding sectors. It is not hard.
I like the system buy maybe respamming pirates bases needs to be toned down.


I do not want it toned down, BUT maybe it could be controlled by economic factors... a struggling economy, more pirates...
Is this NOT how the Somali pirates came into existence?



KnighHawk -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/7/2012 11:59:23 PM)

If you build or place something that has long range scanners in the area where the will stop re-spawning in said area. At least they do in .7; ie a starbase or a monitoring station.




jpwrunyan -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/9/2012 3:16:18 AM)

Very few is still too many for me. Later they turn into obnoxious spam. Actually, the guy who said "just pay them" is also someone I agree with. I wouldnt mind paying them except that extorsion becomes yet more spam. If there was an option to simply pay indefinately until cancelled, i would do it. Pirate alliances work this way right? Meh, next time maybe i will try allying with them instead. This might solve all the issues I currently have (ie spam).



Jerkface -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/9/2012 2:15:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jpwrunyan

Very few is still too many for me. Later they turn into obnoxious spam. Actually, the guy who said "just pay them" is also someone I agree with. I wouldnt mind paying them except that extorsion becomes yet more spam. If there was an option to simply pay indefinately until cancelled, i would do it. Pirate alliances work this way right? Meh, next time maybe i will try allying with them instead. This might solve all the issues I currently have (ie spam).


The problem with alliances (which is the most spam-free convenient) is the pirates will attack random people and you get a reputation hit.



jpwrunyan -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/10/2012 3:08:44 AM)

Yes, but in the late game, when the spam is worst, I usually dont care about reputation. My enemies hate me, my alliances are firm. Would pirate alliances really compromise my free trade agreements? I will find out.

Anyway, if you are playing a warrior race, surely the rep hit is meaningless, dont you think?

Also, just having an alliance doesnt mean you cant break it and destroy a pirate base for a rep boost does it?

This may be gaming the system, and generally I dont like that. But as I said, the main goal is to reduce spam.



Chet Guiles -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/10/2012 5:15:54 AM)

The biggest pirate issue I have is mining station attacks. I weaponize my mining and gas mining stations with weapons up to the level of a frigate, and provide extra shields and power. It's more expensive, but short of a full out multiship attack, they can fend off pirates quite well. Manually upgrade as technology changes, then allow automatic retrofit. Don't automate design or it'll downgrade to wimp level.

The other issue is exploration ships that stumble on a nest of pirates. I always arm my exploration ships (manual design and retrofit) so that they have a good chance of fighting off two or three pirates at a time. Upgrade them as time and technology permits. They get a bit expensive and you might sacrifice some subwarp speed and turning ability for the mass of weapons and extra shields, but it's worth the peace of mind. My Conquistador Class Exploration ship has cruiser-level weapons (or better) and shields. The further you are exploring from home the more you want your exploration ships protected. The range of escorts is not as good as that of my improved explorers, so self-protection works best.

Once you have technology it's fun to add long range scanners to exploration ships -- that'll spot pirates at a safe distance to permit escape if that's desired. Usually by that time I have enough armament to attack rather than flee.

Then use your fleets to attack and destroy pirate bases once they've been found.




ASHBERY76 -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/11/2012 3:51:41 PM)

I just tested pirates with average distance in the options and you hardly see them.I usually play with them nearby.I actaully think it is too quiet now.

Are people moaning about whack-a-mole using pirates distance in the options?



jpwrunyan -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/12/2012 3:19:12 AM)

Pirate spam gets worse with time. That is my perception. They start out fine. Even set at few and distant, they become annoying later. Though at first, like you indicated, they may not even show up.

And since later in the game I always have bigger fish to fry, dealing with pirates is all the more tedious.



JSBoomer -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/12/2012 11:37:36 PM)

I just go to their home base and kill them.



jpwrunyan -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/13/2012 2:37:37 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: J Boomer

I just go to their home base and kill them.


The discussion so far has assumed that you dont know where all the bases are and/or dont enjoy waiting 5 mins for your ships to cross the galaxy just to destroy a pirate base while still getting spammed the whole time and trying to deal with more important issues.

I suppose next someone will suggest using the game editor to remove them.

In conclusion: not sure if you are serious or trolling.



Baleur -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/13/2012 3:09:54 AM)

1. Update to the latest beta patch, no really, it improves the escort AI loads.
2. Are we even supposed to be able to stop the pirates? The gameplay design around the pirates themselves is that they are supposed to be a thorn in the side of both small and large late-game empires. That's why there are options when you set up the game to turn them off or alter the distance.. I mean, is it not like asking "how to stop space monsters?". If you have them turned on, they are supposed to be there, supposed to respawn. That's why the setting is there.

Of course everything in this world can be improved, including the pirate mechanics in this game. But my point is, i don't think we're even supposed to bother so much with the pirates as to divert all available fleets nonstop to whack-a-mole their bases. Deal with them in the early and midgame when it matters, but lategame.. Who cares if i lose 1 or 2 hydrogen mining bases to the pirates? I've got an entire empire to deal with.
This game is definetly not a game for micromanagement, that should be clear from the start.

I do admit that having the pirates in game setup at anything above Low is way way too much. Same with the space creatures. But again, that's why the setting is there, so you can choose what you want.



KnighHawk -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/13/2012 11:20:14 AM)

"I suppose next someone will suggest using the game editor to remove them."
---
Haha well I left that out cause I've resorted to that once... didn't matter to my dismay they still seemed to respawn till I illuminated (via monitoring stations in that case) all the areas where they liked to spawn.




Abraxis -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/19/2012 1:30:05 AM)

a cheaper and smaller option for mining base defense is an ion weapon or two and an area weapon. Anything that comes near is rendered inoperative until the area weapon slowly melts it away.



Kull -> RE: A way to stop pirates? (4/25/2012 3:43:10 AM)

Worst thing you can do is to wipe out their bases, except when they are in the middle of your empire or you plan to expand into their system. When I spot a pirate nest on the edge of the map, I just leave it there. Once you've killed off the initial complement of ships, they don't get many more (some seem to build none). If you have a tempting target nearby, just post a frgate there and that will handle the (rare) intrusion. Build a monitoring station nearby if you need the extra security of knowing when a raider is on the way (and where it's headed). Pirates are nothing more than a rare, briefly bothersome issue in my game.

Edit: To be clear, when you kill a base it respawns. Instead leave it neutered and isolated. Eventually, most will fall into this category.



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