RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (Full Version)

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KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/25/2012 11:14:42 PM)

T86 center (Soviet)


Not too successful turn in the center either.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/95743C686D59479AB72B60ED5ABD1796.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/25/2012 11:16:15 PM)

T86 south (Soviet)


Instead of gaining I am losing ground here.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/E533D49B9578431D875E0B57C41B251B.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/25/2012 11:17:21 PM)

T86 far south (Soviet)


I am sufficiently strong here.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/84CC842E60DD402597C55695B0958EE8.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/25/2012 11:23:52 PM)

T87 far south (German)


Unfortunately Saper abandoned idea of assaulting Astrakhan. At least for now.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/0939F185B1BC4AB9BB722749C151B541.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/25/2012 11:30:13 PM)

T87 center (Soviet)

New units - 2 inf div, 1 inf brig


No attacks in the north, 1 successful in the center, and I have to admit I am too scared to make any move near Stalingrad.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/0F6FB0321FCA40688CC715FF9CC7BF1F.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/25/2012 11:32:18 PM)

T87 far south (Soviet)


Line of swamps was regained, so I might soon be able to send some units north.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/E5ABAFC2045D45DB995A572AED472EF6.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/25/2012 11:43:02 PM)

T88 far south (German)


Not good. Saper decided to stay within striking distance to Astrakhan so I won't be able to move many troops north.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/85FA07BDBC924FA5A1910D34F78DF662.jpg[/image]



Peltonx -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/25/2012 11:50:12 PM)

Good thing is your tring to push, bad thing is its a long ways from Berlin.

I am guessing GHC morale is very high. GHC will be recieiving allot of troops in 43.

If during 43 your unable to move the lines, inflict real loses on the GHC OOB or inprove SHC and lower GHC morale your just not going to move lines enough before rivers freeze in 44 and the clock will easly run out long before you get to the 41 start lines.

The GHC OOB will climb during 43 unless your able to attack a min of 16 times. I have trending data before 1v1=2v1 and after. If its stays static during 43 its over other then playing out game.

The key is german infantry morale. If SHC is unable to get over all morale of the GHC infanrty in the 60's during 43, SHC is in real trouble.

The tempo of attack is just to low at this point to matter. My old numbers where based on a much much higher SHC per turn manpower #s.

OOB #'s would greatly help as no one has any hard #'s based 100% on the newest manpower numbers. I have allot of old trends based on much higher SHC #'s so I am doing some guessing.

But it doesn't look good as of now.



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/25/2012 11:56:02 PM)

quote:

Pelton


OOB #'s would greatly help as no one has any hard #'s based 100% on the newest manpower numbers. I have allot of old trends based on much higher SHC #'s so I am doing some guessing.



Situation is bad, but far from tragic.

T88 OOB

[image]local://upfiles/37480/3B57FFBDB18A4A069B0F3A82DDFCF64A.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/25/2012 11:57:34 PM)

T88 north (Soviet)

New units - 3 inf div, 2 inf brig


If I have opportunity to attack I take it.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/152113111E8B461682D7C284ADC43480.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/25/2012 11:59:07 PM)

T88 center (Soviet)




[image]local://upfiles/37480/8F02657F660649B8B0FD3306223038EB.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/26/2012 12:01:40 AM)

T88 whole south (Soviet)


I need to make decision and attack either along river Don or Caspian Sea. Too many units are idle.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/E00560F192FD486D860C97657DBB0533.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/26/2012 12:06:55 AM)

T89 center (Soviet)

New units - 2 inf div, 2 inf brig



Turn of inactivity. Neither of side undertaken any manoeuvres, and overall only one attack have taken place - unsuccessful Soviet assault near Tula.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/8FC7D182EEE64FEE848A3EA2FBCF1863.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/26/2012 12:21:58 AM)

T90 north (Soviet)

New units - 2 inf div, 2 inf brig, 3 mech brig


Snow has arrived (March '43)

North-west direction is abandoned and I plan to attack near Moscow and take advantage his commitment further north.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/A49C2A342FCF4EEC9663EC7CE6718F8B.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/26/2012 12:24:34 AM)

T90 center (Soviet)

Better weather, affecting mobility of my troops to lesser extend gives me more option.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/59BD4125D4BD472A8C15F978FB69E2FE.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/26/2012 12:27:45 AM)

T90 south (Soviet)


Small reorganisation and attacking was possible again.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/BDCED8F9362C46C3B3335B8E15CF3A6E.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/26/2012 12:50:13 AM)

T91 north (German)


Saper wasn't idle, he was planning, and he planned well.

Vicious and successful counter-attack was launched north of Moscow. In result he managed to encircle 13 units - 1 inf corps, 11 inf div, 1 air brig.



Apart from that Germans made one more attack - hammering of 76k strong stack near Tula.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/3C890C6891AC43A8BB69057A9DAFE375.jpg[/image]



jaw -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/26/2012 6:09:59 PM)

Maybe I just can't tell from the screen shots you've posted but where's your artillery? You should have been able to build Artillery divisions since 10/42 and Rocket Launcher divisions since 12/42 but I don't see any of them. Without artillery it's not surprising you're getting no offensive traction.



M60A3TTS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/27/2012 12:27:23 AM)

I think Kamil has had to spend his APs rebuilding the maneuver units. But your point is well taken, the presence of arty divisions or lack thereof is a fairly good barometer as to when the initiative will change hands.

Unfortuntately with no arty, that would indicate Saper may retain it into the summer.



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/27/2012 1:45:51 AM)

quote:

jaw

Maybe I just can't tell from the screen shots you've posted but where's your artillery? You should have been able to build Artillery divisions since 10/42 and Rocket Launcher divisions since 12/42 but I don't see any of them. Without artillery it's not surprising you're getting no offensive traction.



It is like M60A3TTS said, I had to rebuild my army. I didn't have AP for artillery. I plan to build some, but spawning mechanised corps will have priority once I stop building inf div.



Peltonx -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/27/2012 1:53:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

I think Kamil has had to spend his APs rebuilding the maneuver units. But your point is well taken, the presence of arty divisions or lack thereof is a fairly good barometer as to when the initiative will change hands.

Unfortuntately with no arty, that would indicate Saper may retain it into the summer.


Sapper only needs to have the threat of these little pockets. They will not cause the SHC to crumble, but will keep the manpower/AP crunch going or static.

1943 is the tipping point for the war.

If GHC is able to just keep lines static and OOB's static its over. The clock will run out long before SHC can get to 1941 start lines.

SHC must start pushing west and forseing GHC morale down by August 1943 or they will not have a chance unless GHC does something stupid.

If GHC can keep lines static until late 43 when rivers freeze its over. There will be to much ground to cover and German morale will be to high.

M60's point is very good, we see no art or little which means GHC has a major AP crunch going and SHC is unable to form Red army 2.0 in time to start driving west.



Flaviusx -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/27/2012 3:05:42 AM)

You need the guns more than the mech corps, Kamil. Right now your tactical problem is cracking the German line, not exploiting it. I'm doubting your truck situation is wonderful, too. If you have a sufficiency of tank and cavalry corps, that will do for the moment.



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/27/2012 9:05:45 AM)

quote:

Flaviusx


You need the guns more than the mech corps, Kamil. Right now your tactical problem is cracking the German line, not exploiting it. I'm doubting your truck situation is wonderful, too. If you have a sufficiency of tank and cavalry corps, that will do for the moment.



Lack of mobile units makes me extremely vulnerable to his counter-attacks, and forces me to maintain unnecessarily strong defences in quiet areas of the front.



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (10/1/2012 6:21:13 PM)

T91 north (Soviet)

New units - none


I managed to open corridor to encircled units, but next turn will be more challenging. Saper will bring infantry and panzers will construct forts, so I need to be much much stronger there than I am now.
Everything what was available in the northern and central part of front was transferred to crucial area. It left me vulnerable so I haven't conducted any attacks in the center.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/9488999F43ED4A7DAA07ACDC2120B910.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (10/1/2012 6:22:52 PM)

T91 south (Soviet)


One attack to remind my opponent, that he needs to keep strong forces here.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/6AA763AB27F84F63ACE6DBBAE464F389.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (10/1/2012 6:29:16 PM)

T92 north (German)

Unfortunately Saper made very good decision and decided to reduce the pocket (now 1 inf corps and 5 inf div) to make pocket more secure. Not good.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/F48C49063F3E44E2AE804123BC8AFDC5.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (10/1/2012 6:48:42 PM)

T92 north (Soviet)

New units - 2 inf div


Ring of encirclement was strong so I didn't settle for half measures. Preceded by 4 disruptive attacks and equal amount of bombardment waves I launched my biggest assault of this war so far - 6 inf and 3 cav corps ... somehow I did it.




[image]local://upfiles/37480/043B86DCBC264CFFB880BD725DEB33F9.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (10/1/2012 6:50:45 PM)

T92 center (Soviet)


Until mobile units that were sent north are back I can't do much here.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/28BBB303C98B490D92F9776AB23735B3.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (10/1/2012 6:51:56 PM)

T92 south (Soviet)


Anaemic attempts continues.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/BB9883F46B4E4796BB11FF10D508C6C7.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (10/1/2012 6:59:08 PM)

T93 north (German)


Saper has withdrawn to his initial positions.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/32B4B6BA4C9A410CBBD8913D5187A6AD.jpg[/image]



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