shooting at concealed hexes (Full Version)

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Wolfleader -> shooting at concealed hexes (12/6/2002 10:32:31 AM)

Is there anyway to shoot at a hex that is within firing range of your unit's weapon but is concealed by smoke? I've tried using force fire (the 'z' button I believe)with a flampanzerIII to clear a hex 2 hexes away from the vehicle with the flamethrower (well within the max range of the flampanzers flamethrower) but couldn't because the hex in front of my tank was covered by heavy smoke.



Hades -> (12/6/2002 10:41:10 AM)

Smoke is a wall. Evil Wonderful smoke.



Wolfleader -> (12/6/2002 10:43:59 AM)

Hmmm...looks like I'm stuck with using mortars and massed arty bombardment for clearing out areas where I think enemy inf may be lurking then. :(



Hades -> (12/6/2002 10:46:13 AM)

Yup. But after you pin down whateve is on the other side you can flambe them with your flamer.



Gary Tatro -> Re: shooting at concealed hexes (12/6/2002 10:50:52 AM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Wolfleader
[B]Is there anyway to shoot at a hex that is within firing range of your unit's weapon but is concealed by smoke? I've tried using force fire (the 'z' button I believe)with a flampanzerIII to clear a hex 2 hexes away from the vehicle with the flamethrower (well within the max range of the flampanzers flamethrower) but couldn't because the hex in front of my tank was covered by heavy smoke. [/B][/QUOTE]

Well there is a way. Caution evil secret coming up. You can not actually shoot at the hex but you can clear the hex or suppress light afv's and infantry in the hex.
What you need to do is target the hex next to it with a unit that has HEAT ammo or a unit that has High Explosive(HE) ammo that has a explosion factor greater than 40. Weapons like the Brumbar, Sig150mm, the Brits have this horible tank the has a 290mm HE shell. Ugh. What this does is it create a blast radius greater than the hex it was fired at. This will suppress units one hex away. After a couple of shots from a Brumbar you should have the other units suppressed enough to drive right in next to them and blast away. You also can damage infantry and destroy light AFV's. Trust me it works. Take it from someone who had it used against them. :)



stevemk1a -> Splash damage ! (12/6/2002 11:45:24 AM)

One of the great weapons for spreading around the hurt is the Sturmtiger ... it's 38cm mortar will generate a copious amount of damage to any hex around its impact crater. This will cause casualties to any foolishly bunched soft targets (like allied personel). I would like to thank Viking2 for demonstrating the effectiveness of this tactic to me! :D It's just a shame my men had to die for me to learn it !!, who was it who said "it takes 10,000 men to train a General :eek: ?



Wolfleader -> (12/7/2002 5:13:24 AM)

I suppose I could just try this myself but I might as well ask;

If I were to forcefire the Sturmtiger's main gun on an adjacent hex will the blast damage the sturmtiger?

A great big Danke for all the help BTW. :)



Svennemir -> (12/8/2002 1:26:58 AM)

[QUOTE]If I were to forcefire the Sturmtiger's main gun on an adjacent hex will the blast damage the sturmtiger? [/QUOTE]

No. Units are immune to their own Splash damage. But be careful: your other units must be at least two hexes away from impact hex if they're not to take suppression and probably casualties.

Now I'd just like to add that if you're a realism freak you may want to stay away from the Sturmtiger. There were only a very few of them built, and they had a rate-of-fire much worse than in SPWAW. Also, they couldn't hit water if submerged. (at least not if the water were moving)

They were used to bust fortifications.



Capt. Pixel -> Splash damage (12/8/2002 4:50:35 AM)

I've found that the large caliber (100mm+ HE) tend do as much damage, if not more, to infantry in the hexes adjacent to the target. I started using SPGs and assault guns in this manner (deliberately firing indirect at the adjacent hex), and have had very good results. Better so than firing directly at the target. :cool:



Svennemir -> (12/8/2002 5:13:53 AM)

[QUOTE]I've found that the large caliber (100mm+ HE) tend do as much damage, if not more, to infantry in the hexes adjacent to the target. I started using SPGs and assault guns in this manner (deliberately firing indirect at the adjacent hex), and have had very good results. Better so than firing directly at the target. [/QUOTE]

Not anymore. Since the splash damage fix in 7.1/H2H this occurs no longer. The best way to kill now is to shoot directly. For large calibre shells though, the difference is small and results can vary.

In earlier versions, splash damage was not applied to directly targetted units. Therefore it was sometimes better to use "attack hex" (Z) than aiming.

If anyone wants to know more about splash damage I can find an old thread about it.



Svennemir -> (12/8/2002 5:15:35 AM)

Oh yes, for clarification: splash damage is applied withIN the targetted hex as well as surrounding ones.



fontenoy -> Too close for comfort? (12/8/2002 2:09:43 PM)

I used a Sturmtiger to suppress Russian infantry.Firing at one particular unit,I was pleased to see that I had inflicted 2 or 3 casualties in adjacent hexes.
I was amazed when an adjacent T-34 also blew up!
Has this happened to anyone else?
Or is it just one of those quirks sometimes encounterd in computer games?
Regards,
Fontenoy.



Irinami -> (12/8/2002 10:25:31 PM)

Nope, that's normal. There was another thread with info on this.

The AI doesn't seem to understand this, either. I remember in my WWII long campaign, the last battle the Poles put up (they did pretty well, too), I had over 10 Polish infantry hounded into one hex. Do you know what happened when I had a PzIV fire an HE at one unit in there?

Well, they almost all lost men, and all but one fled into the same next hex. XD

If you co-ocupy a hex with an enemy unit, the AI will happily blast away with machineguns, flamethrowers, anything... annihilating their own unit in the process.



Wolfleader -> Re: Too close for comfort? (12/9/2002 4:44:09 AM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by fontenoy
[B]I was amazed when an adjacent T-34 also blew up!
[/B][/QUOTE]

I had heard stories about tanks being flipped over by the sheer strenght of the blast whenever a very high caliber shell (such as a SturmTiger, 28cm rocket or naval gun) exploded very close by. I would think that the T-34 blowing up in the game would be more a simulation of the tank being hurled by the blast.



Ezikel -> Re: Re: shooting at concealed hexes (12/9/2002 6:06:49 PM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Gary Tatro
[B]The Brits have this horible tank the has a 290mm HE shell. Ugh.[/B][/QUOTE]

Hehe, the AVCE Churchill i think, best damned engenier tank in the game. I personnaly like the entry in the encyclopedia "The german army were given standing orders to destroy these tanks on sight" (or some such)

Ive personnally gone to taking them along to beach landings and charging them around, chasing or blowing up all the infantry, very effective at emptying bunkers too. Im carefull of course to make sure i get past the mines first, but after that it usually throw caution to the wind :-P Bags 'o' fun



fontenoy -> (12/10/2002 4:30:37 AM)

Thank you for the input gentlemen!
Regards,
Fontenoy.:D



AbsntMndedProf -> (1/4/2003 9:01:19 AM)

I've had the flame rocket from the Wurfrahmen 40 take out two and three tanks in the hex it hits and adjacent hexes. The problem being that the rockets tend to hit here, there, and everywhere, as opposed to hitting near the target hex.

Eric Maietta



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