How many fuel cells? (Full Version)

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Jake Hamilton -> How many fuel cells? (7/23/2012 5:53:20 PM)

I’m playing a “quick start” game in “Return of the Shakturi - 1.5.0.0.” All the conditions are random except for the list of games with preset conditions. The one I’m in is: “Sovereign Territories - Regional Ruler.” As the game develops, I find other colonies developing along the rim. As often happens in DW, some jerk doesn’t like me and declares war. The problem now is that the game is being played in a very large galaxy. As colonies develop we grow closer together, but it’s still a long leap getting to the enemy Empire.
I figure having more fuel cells would help a lot. I’m building up my fleets to send to war, so here’s what I’m doing. First, I’m researching storage from enhanced to advanced, which gives me the “ultra dense fuel cell.” Then I’m going to the ship design screen. The default design, with all the basics, has the Escort with one standard fuel cell–80 capacity. The Capital ship has six with a capacity of 480. So how many do I put on each of my military ships? I don’t have a clue. It seems like I will have to guess. Much thanks. Jake.



BTJ -> RE: How many fuel cells? (7/23/2012 6:26:32 PM)

I do not really know the answer to your question, as I am still learning this game while having literally no time to play it. [:)]

But you should update your game to version 1.5.0.8 (latest official update) or even the 1.5.0.10 beta patch posted in the main forum.

Regards,

Buford



Jake Hamilton -> RE: How many fuel cells? (7/23/2012 11:12:05 PM)

Hello Buford, I've been that route, and it wasn't pretty. I'm happy with what I've got, so I'll stick with that. Thanks. Jake



tjhkkr -> RE: How many fuel cells? (7/24/2012 6:00:18 AM)

I would let the automation decide for you... you see the down side is when you start having a fuel crunch, it is harder to refuel lots of ships with big storage tanks...
Think of it as hungry mouth to feed.
There are two exceptions in my fleets... my escorts have larger tanks than the automation recommends so they can escort over long distances; and my scouts have bigger tanks.

I am sure othe guys have other ideas.



Bleek -> RE: How many fuel cells? (7/24/2012 1:11:22 PM)

I have two builds for frigates, destroyers and cruisers.

I suffix the names with LR for Long Range (so I can easily reference them) and these versions of the above have twice the fuel capacity, sometimes more.

I typically group the LR frigates in their own group and use them for deep strikes.

As tjhkkr says, if you opt to increase fuel tank sizes 'empire-wide' on all ships, during a war fuel shortages and refueling issues will stall your fleets big time!



Panpiper -> RE: How many fuel cells? (8/18/2012 11:05:35 PM)

quote:

As tjhkkr says, if you opt to increase fuel tank sizes 'empire-wide' on all ships, during a war fuel shortages and refueling issues will stall your fleets big time!


This is completely false. Having bigger fuel tanks on your ships will not cause you to burn fuel 'faster'. It will give you the 'option' of burning the fuel however. Whether or not you need to is up to you, but it is nice to have the choice.

In an identical war with identical ships and identical manoeuvres and therefore burning the SAME amount of fuel, the fleet with the smaller tanks will have fuel shortages and stoppages SOONER than the fleet with the larger tanks.

I find in practice I restrain the fuel tankage in my early designs because hull space is at a great premium. As my tech increases my potential ship size however, I increase my fuel tanks to hold as much fuel as the ship has size. With tanks that size, I can have a fleet fly a long distance from central in my empire to hit a recently discovered pirate base at the edge of my explored space, have a couple more in the general area turn up while it is enroute, have the fleet kill all the pirate bases and then get back to a refuel spot with fuel to spare. Note that my warfighting fleets are exclusively maximum sized capital ships.

Note however that I do deliberately create a surplus of gas mining facilities each with three extractors and 40 cargo holds. A 20 ship fleet with empty 500 space fuel tanks could completely top off at such a station that is only at half capacity.



w1p -> RE: How many fuel cells? (8/19/2012 4:54:02 PM)

Panpiper, don't forget that there is a cap on how much fuel your bases can store, once they reach the max they stop mining and it sits idle. If your fleets fuel storage is greater than your base fuel storage, or more importantly your bases fuel storage NEAR the front line, then when it comes to refueling your ships you may find that you can't refuel them all at once at a convenient place.

Also, with more fuel tanks they will be able to be in the field longer, which at the start of a war can make a huge difference, but it will take longer to refuel as you either have to a) travel further afield for fuel or b) await stations gaining the fuel. I've had it before where most of my fuel reserves were on the wrong side of my empire in the early game, and I ended up having to suffer a few systems getting demolished whilst my fleet travelled to a fuel station with no fuel then back again. I've learned since then!

Late game I tend to set up quite a few resupply ships near the front line as I have about 4-5 fuel tanks on my destroyers that are the mainstay of my fleet, normally group my fleets in 12's and 16's and two or three fleets (36-48 ships) all refueling at the same time will strip a couple of gas mining stations with 20 cargo bays full of caslon/hydrogen.

This is one of the reasons I love DW so much. No matter how long you've been playing, you can play a game and something goes wrong and it makes you think "oh, I never thought of that!". Just goes to show that the game is so incredibly complex, yet it's well designed that sometimes these things go completely unoticed!



SBD -> RE: How many fuel cells? (8/20/2012 5:43:33 AM)

quote:

Note however that I do deliberately create a surplus of gas mining facilities each with three extractors and 40 cargo holds. A 20 ship fleet with empty 500 space fuel tanks could completely top off at such a station that is only at half capacity.


Excellent idea. My home planet is chronically short of fuel.



Jeeves -> RE: How many fuel cells? (8/20/2012 4:16:14 PM)

Under construction tech page research energy to fuel converters, near the bottom, a 1920k tech at cheapest rate. They work like a charm. I put three on my home world spaceport and one on all other spaceports. I put one on every gas mine too.

Lonnie Courtney Clay



Fishers of Men -> RE: How many fuel cells? (8/20/2012 4:27:53 PM)

Here is something else to consider, Jake. I make sure that all ships in my battle fleets have the same size fuel tanks. That way, all ships will stay together and no indidvidual ship will run low on fuel and have to drop out or cause the others to make a fuel stop before they need to. The fleet can attack and defend as one unit, which is more effective.

I also create my military ships with hydrogen reactors and my civilian ship with caslon reactors. This lessens the chance that each fuel source will be over used and depleted.

FoM



Panpiper -> RE: How many fuel cells? (8/20/2012 4:48:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fishers of Men
I make sure that all ships in my battle fleets have the same size fuel tanks.


Yes, an important point.


quote:


I also create my military ships with hydrogen reactors and my civilian ship with caslon reactors. This lessens the chance that each fuel source will be over used and depleted.


And that is a freakishly good idea. I am going to steal that idea immediately. ;-)



endoric_MatrixForum -> RE: How many fuel cells? (8/20/2012 11:40:49 PM)

i try to have my warships with a MIN of 500 range on a huge 14x14 galaxy with 1400 stars.

so your tech will require fewer as your fuel storage ability goes up.



SBD -> RE: How many fuel cells? (8/21/2012 7:35:50 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeeves

Under construction tech page research energy to fuel converters, near the bottom, a 1920k tech at cheapest rate. They work like a charm. I put three on my home world spaceport and one on all other spaceports. I put one on every gas mine too.

Lonnie Courtney Clay



Thanks; will do that.



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