Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (Full Version)

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linrom -> Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/21/2012 9:27:33 PM)

As a new player, I have a few questions:


1. The game does not allow for submarine attacks inside port size >3? If this is the case, is there any purpose in defensive minefields and what do I do with CMs, ACMs?

2. The Japanese created baseforces which included subchasers and patrol craft in all the small outposts such as Ambon, Timor. Davao etc without any tenders. So why does the game prevent torpedo and depth charge rearming unless it is in a large port or with the presence of tenders larger then AGs?

The Japanese put depth charges even on their AKs and apparently on just about any ship!

If I am running subchasers out of Tarakan, I need to send them to Palau to rearm? I don't think so!

BTW, what's with ALL the non historical geographical names too?

I got more than 500 AKs? What do I do with them?



Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/21/2012 10:37:01 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: linrom

As a new player, I have a few questions:


1. The game does not allow for submarine attacks inside port size >3?

No. No attacks on ships docked or disbanded. Ships in TFs can be attacked.

If this is the case, is there any purpose in defensive minefields and what do I do with CMs, ACMs?

Mines work against vessels which are not submarines. USe CMs to lay mines. Use ACMs to maintain minefields. Special rules and conditions apply.

If I am running subchasers out of Tarakan, I need to send them to Palau to rearm? I don't think so!

Plan better. It's all I got.

BTW, what's with ALL the non historical geographical names too?

Examples?

I got more than 500 AKs? What do I do with them?

Park them in deep water in TFs of 100ea. E-mail your opponent and tell him where they may be found. Seriously. Is this a troll?



Reg -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/22/2012 12:07:32 AM)

That's a bit harsh Moose. He is a newbie...

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58

quote:

ORIGINAL: linrom

As a new player, I have a few questions:


1. The game does not allow for submarine attacks inside port size >3?


No. No attacks on ships docked or disbanded. Ships in TFs can be attacked.


Docked and disbanded ships are assumed to be behind torpedo nets and harbour defences. Task forces are considered underway somewhere within the 50 mile hex.

quote:


quote:


If this is the case, is there any purpose in defensive minefields and what do I do with CMs, ACMs?


Mines work against vessels which are not submarines. USe CMs to lay mines. Use ACMs to maintain minefields. Special rules and conditions apply.


Mines give your harbour defences teeth and discourage vistors. 

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Aug 06, 42
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 125 encounters mine field at Truk (112,108)
 
Allied Ships
      SS Grayling, Mine hits 1,  heavy damage
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 127 encounters mine field at Truk (112,108)
 
Allied Ships
      SS Greenling, Mine hits 1,  on fire
  
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


quote:


quote:



If I am running subchasers out of Tarakan, I need to send them to Palau to rearm? I don't think so!


Plan better. It's all I got.

quote:



BTW, what's with ALL the non historical geographical names too?


Examples?


A number of well informed people have put a lot of effort in getting this right. However errors can slip in so if you can justify any corrections they will be considered for a future update.

quote:


quote:



I got more than 500 AKs? What do I do with them?


Park them in deep water in TFs of 100ea. E-mail your opponent and tell him where they may be found. Seriously. Is this a troll?


There does seem to be a bewildering array of AKs at first but believe me when you get into the game and the attrition kicks in and your demands grow, you will be grateful....






dcpollay -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/22/2012 1:11:12 AM)

Linrom,

To expand a little bit on the other replies - Each hex including a base is 40 miles across. This includes a lot of territory outside of the bases. The "no attack" rules apply to ships either disbanded (at anchor) or docked within the base. Any ships in a task force at sea or travelling in open water within the hex are still fair game for the subs.

As for the minefields, when mines are laid they are spread out within the 40-mile hex, not just in the harbor itself. Any ships in the hex are subject to hitting the mines. Thus, they still provide "teeth" as a defensive weapon.

Hope that helps.



Reg -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/22/2012 1:19:08 AM)


Midget submarines are capable of attacking ships in port though don't expect spectacular results....




Califvol -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/22/2012 6:04:52 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58


quote:

ORIGINAL: linrom
BTW, what's with ALL the non historical geographical names too?

Examples?




I bet he sees that the WW II period names are not the same as today. Yup, they aren't and so sets the sun on various empires.



erstad -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/22/2012 6:25:45 AM)

quote:


quote:


quote:



I got more than 500 AKs? What do I do with them?


Park them in deep water in TFs of 100ea. E-mail your opponent and tell him where they may be found. Seriously. Is this a troll?


There does seem to be a bewildering array of AKs at first but believe me when you get into the game and the attrition kicks in and your demands grow, you will be grateful....


To expand a little further, you will find that you need to schlep a lot of resources to keep the industry in the home islands fed, ship supplies to far flung regions of the empire, etc. So there's lots to keep the AKs busy.



linrom -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/22/2012 6:06:43 PM)

Depth Charge

Thank you guys for replying.

However, I must say that this game appears to progress from historical accuracy to rules driven mumble jumble. Depth charges can be hoisted onto a ship.

According to Matrix, this requires port size 5.

How about loading some depth charges and even torpedoes onto a ship and delivering it to a port where it could be stockpiled. No, the designers make you think think that this is impossible for whatever reason.



Puhis -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/22/2012 7:07:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: linrom


However, I must say that this game appears to progress from historical accuracy to rules driven mumble jumble. Depth charges can be hoisted onto a ship.

According to Matrix, this requires port size 5.

How about loading some depth charges and even torpedoes onto a ship and delivering it to a port where it could be stockpiled. No, the designers make you think think that this is impossible for whatever reason.


How about just sending tender ship (AKE or AG) to port where you want to reload DCs...



linrom -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/22/2012 8:05:40 PM)

[image][IMG]http://imageshack.us/a/img854/3025/mkviidepthcharge.jpg[/IMG]
[/image]

[:-]



Alfred -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/22/2012 8:14:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: linrom

Depth Charge

Thank you guys for replying.

However, I must say that this game appears to progress from historical accuracy to rules driven mumble jumble. Depth charges can be hoisted onto a ship.

According to Matrix, this requires port size 5.

How about loading some depth charges and even torpedoes onto a ship and delivering it to a port where it could be stockpiled. No, the designers make you think think that this is impossible for whatever reason.


1. You do realise that what you propose is much more complicated than the solution provided within the game?

2. Also have you thought how all weapons are handled within ship classes and how you would reconcile your approach with the overall game parameters?

3. You could also reread the table on pages 285-288 of the manual more closely and note exactly what is said there. Then you would realise that it is possible to load depth charges at ports of level 1 size.

The devs of this game are quite smart and very experienced in military matters. Many of them have personal experience of being shot at by real world, not virtual world, enemy forces. Some of them are also involved in current American military hardware procurement programs. Do you have a comparable CV?

Alfred



Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/22/2012 10:07:37 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Reg

That's a bit harsh Moose. He is a newbie...


Reaction to the overall post.



Mac Linehan -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/22/2012 10:13:14 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred


quote:

ORIGINAL: linrom

Depth Charge

Thank you guys for replying.

However, I must say that this game appears to progress from historical accuracy to rules driven mumble jumble. Depth charges can be hoisted onto a ship.

According to Matrix, this requires port size 5.

How about loading some depth charges and even torpedoes onto a ship and delivering it to a port where it could be stockpiled. No, the designers make you think think that this is impossible for whatever reason.


1. You do realise that what you propose is much more complicated than the solution provided within the game?

2. Also have you thought how all weapons are handled within ship classes and how you would reconcile your approach with the overall game parameters?

3. You could also reread the table on pages 285-288 of the manual more closely and note exactly what is said there. Then you would realise that it is possible to load depth charges at ports of level 1 size.

The devs of this game are quite smart and very experienced in military matters. Many of them have personal experience of being shot at by real world, not virtual world, enemy forces. Some of them are also involved in current American military hardware procurement programs. Do you have a comparable CV?

Alfred


Alfred -

Succinct, accurate and to the point.

linrom -

The learning curve for AE begins at the expert level and ascends from that point; if there is another game of comparable realism, depth and complexity (not to mention sheer unit count), I am unaware of it. In my case, it took over a year of play before I began to feel that I might have some idea of what I was doing - at a basic level.

I am very pleased that another player has joined the fray - we are glad to have you with us. I respectfully submit that you will have to put significant time into game play, reading and studying AE to obtain a clearer picture of how it all fits together. Numerous times I have been humbled - by learning that a certain aspect of the game - that I thought was mastered - actually worked a bit differently when viewed from a fresh perspective.

Mac



sdevault -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/23/2012 1:06:42 AM)

Logistical issues occurred during the real war and were often more damaging than enemy action.
As Mac said. After a year of tinkering with the game, and learning the basics, you will have a fresh prospective of the game mechanics. Some things may not work the way we want them to. This is not an arcade game in which identical supply or repair functionality occurs at each base regardless of circumstance. Game mechanics work in order to provide us with the most realistic game experience possible.




Itdepends -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/23/2012 2:16:04 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred
Do you have a comparable CV?
Alfred


I'll see your Yorktown and raise you an Essex [:D]



ilovestrategy -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/23/2012 11:56:20 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: linrom

[image][IMG]http://imageshack.us/a/img854/3025/mkviidepthcharge.jpg[/IMG]
[/image]

[:-]



Were those things dangerous to move around? They look like they are nervous.



Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/23/2012 6:13:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ilovestrategy


quote:

ORIGINAL: linrom

[image][IMG]http://imageshack.us/a/img854/3025/mkviidepthcharge.jpg[/IMG]
[/image]

[:-]



Were those things dangerous to move around? They look like they are nervous.


Not very dangerous when not fused. The fuse is normally screwed into the round hole in the center of the end plate. This photo seems to show the protection plate swung aside and the fuse hole emply. The crew is loading the Dc into a gun launcher aimed port/starboard. Can't tell which side of the ship this photo shows. Without a fuse a DC is no more dangerous than a gun shell, and probably less.



crsutton -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/23/2012 7:49:58 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: linrom

As a new player, I have a few questions:


1. The game does not allow for submarine attacks inside port size >3? If this is the case, is there any purpose in defensive minefields and what do I do with CMs, ACMs?

2. The Japanese created baseforces which included subchasers and patrol craft in all the small outposts such as Ambon, Timor. Davao etc without any tenders. So why does the game prevent torpedo and depth charge rearming unless it is in a large port or with the presence of tenders larger then AGs?

The Japanese put depth charges even on their AKs and apparently on just about any ship!

If I am running subchasers out of Tarakan, I need to send them to Palau to rearm? I don't think so!

BTW, what's with ALL the non historical geographical names too?

I got more than 500 AKs? What do I do with them?



And, I never heard of an AK ever killing or damaging a sub. They might have loaded up a lot of ships with DC but the question is did they have any effect? Sometimes things have been passed over for simplicity sake.



ilovestrategy -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/23/2012 9:40:15 PM)

Thanks Bullwinkle!



Bearcat2 -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/24/2012 1:23:51 AM)

Flower class corvette- port side launcher



Jorge_Stanbury -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/25/2012 8:47:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: linrom

If I am running subchasers out of Tarakan, I need to send them to Palau to rearm? I don't think so!

I got more than 500 AKs? What do I do with them?


You should convert some of those AKs to AG; one for each forward base you want to use for rearming/ repairing PB, SC




Dili -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/30/2012 5:06:50 AM)

quote:

I never heard of an AK ever killing or damaging a sub.


RAINBOW (Lt Cdr L P Moore+), 10th October 1940, Central Mediterranean, Gulf of Otranto area – in collision with Italian merchantman ‘Antonietta Costa’.


[:'(][;)]




DivePac88 -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/30/2012 5:45:37 AM)

Hi linrom, I was just wondering if there is anything that you do actually like about AE? [:'(]



Sakai007 -> RE: Mine warfare, Japanese Depth Charge rearm (12/30/2012 6:03:18 AM)

Speaking of the learning curve, I have a single game I've been playing for the better part of a year and a half. I am now in June '44 as the Allies and have only really been doing 'well' for the last year of game time or so. A healthy dose of 'Sir Robin' will give the player time to learn the little things before stuff really gets hot in late 42, early 43. I lost so much in the way of bases in the process that I never thought I would come back and thought about restarting. Now I am fighting for Rangoon and have just taken Eniwetok as a stepping stone to Saipan. What an amazing game we have, I honestly feel lucky to know it exists and enjoy it!!!



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