It may be a small thing, but (Full Version)

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Morelyn -> It may be a small thing, but (1/29/2013 3:25:07 PM)

DW is a great game. However, it is a very ill-behaved Windows program. If I alt-Tab out of the game, it is forever trying to grab the focus back. A well-behaved Windows program sits on the taskbar, with its music turned off, until I maximize it again.

This is not days and weeks of programming we're talking about here; it is a very simple fix, a competent programmer could do it in an hour tops. Yes, it would have to be tested, but you're testing other fixes all the time anyway.

Thanks for your attention.



Kayoz -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/29/2013 4:01:11 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Morelyn

...a competent programmer could do it in an hour tops...


*twitch*

An hour? Wow, wherever you're from, your programmers are amazing!

Yes, DW does need some serious redesigning. I won't argue that - but suggesting it's a 1-hour quick fix is daft.



Morelyn -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/29/2013 5:10:59 PM)

It's a simple call to a Windows function or two. Yes, an hour is about right. I've programmed this stuff.

Something like:

if (WindowState == FormWindowState.Minimized)
Hide();

and

Show();
WindowState = FormWindowState.Normal;

to show it again. There's a bit more to it than this, but it is by no means a major project.



Haree78 -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/29/2013 9:52:01 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Morelyn

DW is a great game. However, it is a very ill-behaved Windows program. If I alt-Tab out of the game, it is forever trying to grab the focus back. A well-behaved Windows program sits on the taskbar, with its music turned off, until I maximize it again.

This is not days and weeks of programming we're talking about here; it is a very simple fix, a competent programmer could do it in an hour tops. Yes, it would have to be tested, but you're testing other fixes all the time anyway.

Thanks for your attention.



Hey dude

There's a few assumptions you are making that are probably pretty ill informed considering the maturity of Distant Worlds. You might also understand the issues using external libraries can cause or you might have considered there may be reasons why it needs to grab focus.

However I run in windowed mode with Distant Worlds and it behaves very well. I can task switch and use other apps and switch back to Distant Worlds with no issue so I'm not sure why you are getting problems.



jpwrunyan -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/29/2013 9:58:03 PM)

I thought DW was actually just trying to pass itself off as a full-screen mode game and that the ALT-TAB was a bug, not a feature. I use it all the time of course, but I got the impression that if they could get the game to be full-screen and disable ALT-TAB that's what they wanted to do. The fact that the game doesn't install itself into or save files in the proper windows OS directories tells me that the developer isn't completely knowledgable of windows behavior, much less best practices. Ironic since, as far as I know, this game won't run on a MAC. Who knows, maybe I did something weird and that is why DW is just in its own directory off the C: drive, but it shouldn't be.

Morelyn, you should just try to PM Erik and Eliot. I'm sure if it is an easy fix they will do it.



jpwrunyan -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/29/2013 10:01:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Haree78
There's a few assumptions you are making that are probably pretty ill informed considering the maturity of Distant Worlds. You might also understand the issues using external libraries can cause or you might have considered there may be reasons why it needs to grab focus.


What are they? Direct X? Not trolling. I don't know but find it interesting.

quote:


However I run in windowed mode with Distant Worlds and it behaves very well. I can task switch and use other apps and switch back to Distant Worlds with no issue so I'm not sure why you are getting problems.


I keep hearing about this Windowed mode. How do you enable it? I guess I should read the manual. I have only ever read the Galactopedia.



Kayoz -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/30/2013 12:15:38 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Morelyn

It's a simple call to a Windows function or two. Yes, an hour is about right. I've programmed this stuff.


Dunno - can't say much as I don't do C#. But a 2-line fix does seem rather optimistic - given that you know little or nothing about what 3rd party libraries he's using.

But then again, Elliot has made some bizarre decisions - such as not producing minidumps when DW crashes, which would simplify bug-reporting greatly.



Morelyn -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/30/2013 12:58:47 AM)

He's using .Net, which means the language is likely either some form of C or Visual Basic. There's no need for "external libraries," what I'm talking about are Windows API calls. Windows itself provides these functions. You can call them through .Net or you could even make calls directly to the Win32 API.

I suspect that jpwrunyan is right and that the DW programmers simply aren't that comfortable with Windows programming.

In any case, it's not that big a deal, I can still alt-tab out and go about my business. It's just the way DW is constantly trying to jump up and grab the focus that's annoying. Look at a Paradox program: alt-tab and it will obediantly minimize to the taskbar, the music will stop, and you won't be bothered by it again until you decide to maximize.



Kayoz -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/30/2013 5:10:29 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Morelyn

He's using .Net, which means the language is likely either some form of C or Visual Basic.


It's done in C#, as I thought I made quite clear in my previous post. Not VB, not C (what do you mean, "some form of"??? - What are you suggesting? Lisp?). It's C#. Which I think is quite ghastly to call "some form of C"... Have you no respect for C?



Bingeling -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/30/2013 9:17:33 AM)

Lisp rocks, but is maybe not preferred for game programming.

DW has its share of issues (performance, load times), but for me it works well in windowed mode. It may be that it does not help performance, though, but I have not checked.

Toggles for windowed mode is typically in the video options near the top. That is for games in general, and probably DW too.



Morelyn -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/30/2013 11:22:55 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kayoz


quote:

ORIGINAL: Morelyn

He's using .Net, which means the language is likely either some form of C or Visual Basic.


It's done in C#, as I thought I made quite clear in my previous post. Not VB, not C (what do you mean, "some form of"??? - What are you suggesting? Lisp?). It's C#. Which I think is quite ghastly to call "some form of C"... Have you no respect for C?


Is this tongue-in-cheek? By some form of C I meant either C++ or C#, possibly even C itself if it can be used with .Net. I have great respect for C and its variants, having programmed in all of them over the course of my career.
But of course C# evolved from C++ which in turn evolved from C so I fail to see the ghastliness.



Darkspire -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/30/2013 12:09:14 PM)

I can C I may have to get the [sm=00000613.gif]

Darkspire



Kayoz -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/30/2013 4:40:58 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Morelyn

But of course C# evolved from C++ which in turn evolved from C so I fail to see the ghastliness.


Heathen! It's closer to Java than C!



Morelyn -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/30/2013 5:19:31 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kayoz


quote:

ORIGINAL: Morelyn

But of course C# evolved from C++ which in turn evolved from C so I fail to see the ghastliness.


Heathen! It's closer to Java than C!


Yeah, probably. But I always rather liked Java (apart from the fact that it doesn't work....or at least it didn't used to, I don't know if it does these days. "Write once, test everywhere"). C# is sort of Java done right, if you ask me.

I accept heathen status.



Morelyn -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/31/2013 12:26:52 AM)

Incidentally, I'm apparently blind since I don't see where you set DW to run in windowed mode. Could someone please enlighten me?



necaradan666 -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/31/2013 2:25:27 AM)

Window mode is lame anyway, the UI doesn't seem to scale. So if you make the window small enough to do other things while playing the interface covers nearly everyhing but a thin cross of the main gameplay screen in the center



Darkspire -> RE: It may be a small thing, but (1/31/2013 3:44:12 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Morelyn

Incidentally, I'm apparently blind since I don't see where you set DW to run in windowed mode. Could someone please enlighten me?


Consider thyself enlightened grasshopper [sm=character0077.gif]

You have to edit the startup.ini file in the top level of the Distant Worlds home folder. Remove the ' from two lines, see below. Just dont ask what taking the one off hyperspeed does, think it is something to do with the distance the ships travel or somesuch. DW is like an old Moggy Minor car that keeps getting bits bolted on to make it better, hence there are defunct files here and there, like biases.txt, still as the saying goes 'If it aint broke don't fix it', DW isn't broken but it sure is wonky in some areas [:D]

'Distant Worlds startup settings

screenwidth 1024
screenheight 768
'hyperdrivespeed 1.6

Really needs a button on the secondary screen of the graphics settings under advanced options, but hey, we dont mind, there are so many other things that need a tweak up the compiler in this game this ones a minor.

Darkspire



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