First of Many questions LRCAP (Full Version)

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OG_Gleep -> First of Many questions LRCAP (12/27/2002 5:44:14 AM)

Hi, Just got the game for christmas. I have spent the entire morning and better part of the afternoon, reading the Forums, and various fan sites. I get some of the concepts but not all. I played Coral Sea, and had no idea what was going on, which was what prompted all of the reading.

Anyhow, one of the lingering questions is about CAP/LRCAP (All i saw was LRCAP, however I have noticed that some people use both in the forums. Why?). When setting up LRCAP mission, lets say of PM, how many hexes will the LRCAP cover? Will it just intercept planes coming over PM?

If I want to have fighters cover my task force, what hex do I tell them to guard? If the TF moves, will the fighters move with it?

Same question, only I want fighters to cover transports. Where do I have to tell the CAP to fly?


==============================

Also supplies. Can somoene explain what I am supposed to do in the Coral Sea mission as the US? I want to learn the mechanics of supply, but don't know what I am supposed to do. All this reading, I get the general concept, but not the actual execution of it.

PS. I did searches on both subject but couldn't find the answer to either. I know these are basic questions and have probably been asked before but I couldn't find them.



Fred98 -> (12/27/2002 6:19:49 AM)

If you set fighters to provide LRCAP, they will provide CAP over the target and also over the fighters home base.

You set the target of LRCAP from the squadron’s own screen jut like setting a target for bombers.

LRCAP can fly over a land base or over a Task Force (TF)

The range of LRCAP = the range of the fighters.

If you set LRCAP over a TF, you will see that TF number appear in the squadron screen.

The squadron will continue to provide LRCAP over that TF whilst it remains in range of the fighters providing the CAP.



HawaiiFive-O -> (12/27/2002 6:28:35 AM)

As far as why you would use regular CAP vs. LRCAP, here's some points to consider.

CAP allows your fighters to be dual role, they can fly Escort for your bombers and fly CAP over your carriers at the percentage you designate. So if you have CAP set to 60%, then 40% of the fighters will be available for Escort duty. LRCAP is automatically 100%, so no fighters will be available for escort duty.

Also, flying LRCAP is very tiring for your pilots, after just a couple of days their fatigue will be in the 30s and 40s, and they'll be due for a rest.

LRCAP is also inefficient, with the latest patch. I'm finding that of a group of 36 F4F-4s set to LRCAP, typically only 8 show up as part of the defending CAP during a strike.

But LRCAP allows you to provide fighter cover without sticking your CVs in with your invasion fleet, so it definitely has it's uses.



Fred98 -> (12/27/2002 11:52:07 AM)

In the squadron orders screen, there is no such order as CAP.

There is however an order for LRCAP.

Therefore I cannot distinguish between CAP and LRCAP for giving orders.



OG_Gleep -> (12/27/2002 12:11:26 PM)

Ahh thanks guys, that makes so much more sense.

Joe: Its not an order. Towards the bottum of the sceen you will see CAP and under it a number and two arrows.

That number designates a certain percentage of the squadren to stay around the base/CV and perform defensive CAP. If the CV happens to be apart of a TF, it will defend the TF. The rest of the squadron will be available for missions, such as LRCAP.

LRCAP is an order to go defend something OTHER than the base/CV.

Correct me if I am wrong guys.



HawaiiFive-O -> (12/27/2002 12:11:40 PM)

CAP is what a percentage of your planes is doing when not flying their "main" mission.

The available Group Missions for Fighters are "Sweep", "Escort", "Training", "Long Range CAP", and "Stand Down"

Underneath those orders, below the Target selection, is the slider for CAP level.

The Group mission defines what is the main mission for the squadron, CAP level defines how many of the planes stay back for defense.

So if you set the Group Mission as "Escort" and the CAP level as 60%, then 60% of your planes are flying escort, and 40% will fly Escort.

LRCAP is automatically 100%. If you try to take it down from 100%, the Group Mission will switch from LRCAP to something else.

The same rule applies for Fighter/Bombers, but they have different Group Missions to choose from.

I believe this is how it works, someone please correct me if I'm wrong.



HawaiiFive-O -> (12/27/2002 12:13:24 PM)

Oops, I wasn't trying to correct you, OG_Gleep. Our posts concur, we were just typing them at the same time.

Sorry!



Fred98 -> (12/27/2002 12:52:29 PM)

How about naval search?

My light bombers often find enemy shipping but rarely attack.

I assume that if I set the slider to 60% it means 60% search and if they find shipping the remaining 40% will bomb the ships.

But what then is the use of float planes such as PBYs? They don’t carry bombs.

If their search is level 100% and PBYs find a ship, how can I get my bombers to attack?



HawaiiFive-O -> (12/27/2002 1:10:51 PM)

I believe how it works is this:

60% Search means 60% of the planes/air crews are flying Search that day. The other 40% are on R&R, they will not "pounce" on the detected ships.

Not running your crews at 100% is crucial to keeping them fresh. Once their fatigue gets too high their morale will plummet. It can take a long time for morale to be restored after this. Be proactive and rotate your air crews on occasion.

I'm sure most players have a personal preference, but I like to run 20-30% Search for bombers, and 50% Search for the dedicated search planes, to keep them from burning out.

As far as a plane attacking a found ship while flying a Naval Search mission, I believe them attacking is based on the planes Experience level (minimum of 70?), morale, and the "hardness" of the target, i.e. if there's plenty of flak/CAP they are unlikely to attack.

I've had very, very few Naval Search planes actually drop any bombs.



OG_Gleep -> (12/27/2002 1:18:48 PM)

LOL!! I was reading your post, and constantly looking back up at mine and thinking "Isn't that what I just said?". Have only had that happen to me once before!



OG_Gleep -> (12/27/2002 1:20:57 PM)

Really stupid question:

Can someone explain to me what SBD's and TBD's are? Seriously this is like another language.



HawaiiFive-O -> (12/27/2002 1:24:39 PM)

SBD = Dive Bomber.

TBD = Torpedo Bomber.



OG_Gleep -> (12/27/2002 1:52:03 PM)

Why is the D at the end?



gus -> Check out this link ... (12/27/2002 3:01:31 PM)

Hi OG_Gleep

The following site has much of the info you need;

http://www.hazegray.org/faq/designat.htm#t1-2-1

SBD == Scout Bomber Dive capable i.e. The Dauntless was used in the Scout or Bomber role. As a bomber she was also dive bomb capable (i.e she had air brakes) her primary role as well as level bomber

TBD == Torpedo Bomber Dive, i.e. the Avenger's primary role was as a torpedo bomber but could be used could be used as a level bomber or dive bomber as well.

Cheers

Gus



Fred98 -> (12/27/2002 3:38:25 PM)

There are a few of us whau are used to fighting wargames in the infantry context.

Learning naval terms is like learning chinese.



CapAndGown -> (12/27/2002 9:42:46 PM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by HawaiiFive-O
[B]

I'm sure most players have a personal preference, but I like to run 20-30% Search for bombers, and 50% Search for the dedicated search planes, to keep them from burning out.
[/B][/QUOTE]

The Idea here is that naval search planes find the targets and the bombers attack them. They do not both need to be searching. And as for having your planes flying 50% search to keep them fresh, this is unneeded and even harmful. I have run PBY's, Mavis's, and Emily's at 100% search for months on end and not lost any due to operational losses.



phred -> US Navy Plane designations (12/27/2002 10:18:20 PM)

The navy used the designation to tell everybody who built it, ie SBD - Scout Bomber, Douglas
TBD - Torpedo Bomber, Douglas
TBF - Torpedo Bomber, Grumman
etc.



HawaiiFive-O -> (12/28/2002 1:16:43 AM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by cap_and_gown
[B]The Idea here is that naval search planes find the targets and the bombers attack them. They do not both need to be searching. [/B][/QUOTE]

I was unclear in my post. I wasn't implying that all of your bombers should constantly be running 20-30% Naval Search. Just that when you DO use them for Naval Search, keep the searching percentage low so if you do find something interesting your air crews and planes are ready to fight.


[QUOTE]Originally posted by cap_and_gown
[B]And as for having your planes flying 50% search to keep them fresh, this is unneeded and even harmful. I have run PBY's, Mavis's, and Emily's at 100% search for months on end and not lost any due to operational losses. [/B][/QUOTE]

Interesting, I've had a different experience. When viewing Aircraft Losses, I note quite a few PBY's replacements that have been used, presumably to replace losses. Since Experience is modelled in excruciating detail in every other aspect, I was under the assumption that Experienced searchers have a better chance to spot the enemy. If my Search squadrons are getting tired out and are losing planes, necessitating replacement (green) pilots, this would hamper my search efforts, I believe.

I could be totally wrong on this. But when I ratcheted back, the number of PBY's in the stockpile continues to grow and I have used less replacements. And it hasn't seemed to hamper my search efforts.

Like I said, it's a preference.



jive1 -> (12/28/2002 5:05:39 AM)

Many games seem very daunting when you first start.
(I'm trying to learn EU1 at the moment - o boy! - why am I getting so many revolting peasants!)

One tries to take in every rule but in the end I think you just get a feel for the game. Try Spooky's site for some good FAQ's including a quick reference sheet I never got round to finishing.
Play the AI a couple of times then dive into a short 4 week pbem.

http://uncommon-valor.chez.tiscali.fr



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