Destroying Aircraft on ground and Jap Surprise (Full Version)

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HerzKaraya -> Destroying Aircraft on ground and Jap Surprise (8/3/2013 12:20:29 AM)

Hello, I'm slowly considering to get back into playing and modding this excellent game - unfortunately I'm having a big issue with 2 things.

First, I have made several test scenarios and I have run them several times. I am not able to destroy a single aircraft on ground while attacking and leaving it's airbase and runway at 100% damage. Target airbases host airgroups either flying, or training at 0%, or training at 100% or with 30 damaged airplanes just sitting there. I have tried this with a fresh, clean, vanilla install, then again with the latest official patch and then again with the latest unofficial patch.
Lot's of aircombat (losses are lower after each patch), losses to Flak, Ops losses, ruined airbases...not a single airplane destroyed on ground. What am I missing?

Second, I have done the same thing again but with Japanese December surprise on. Again, not a single aircraft destroyed on ground! And combat results stayed mostly the same, with the exception of airstikes hitting an airbase with CAP set to 0% - where losses where really high on the defending side.

Now the questions are - can aircraft be destroyed on ground? Can they only be damaged? Are ground kills computed as air-to-air kills maybe?
And regarding first turn surprise, does it only work on December 7th or on any date the given scenario starts? Even June 22nd 1941? Are the surprise effects reduced if CAP is set or will it be a less effective CAP? Will radar or spotters forfeit the defenders penalty?

Thanks for your help and ongoing support



witpqs -> RE: Destroying Aircraft on ground and Jap Surprise (8/3/2013 12:45:01 AM)

Hi Bubi,

Suggest you start a new thread in the main or war room sub-forums as tech support is for bugs and such.

I really can't say why you are seeing no ground kills in the test you ran, because it sure happens plenty in playing the game. If you post more details about the test then somebody might be able to spot something.

First turn surprise does result in way waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay less effective CAP for the Allies. Although obviously having no CAP at all is even worse than having a CAP with surprise on.

There are lots of random factors included in results so it's hard to say exactly what a given turn will yield.



inqistor -> RE: Destroying Aircraft on ground and Jap Surprise (8/3/2013 8:08:45 AM)

Have you changed bombloads?

60kg bomb have significantly lower chance to destroy plane, than 250kg bomb. I am guessing something like 15kg would not destroy plane at all. Airfield damages seems to be more dependent on number of hits, not bomb size.

Have you checked report for other side? Without FOW number of destroyed planes is always much higher.


There is problem, that there are no planes on map, when you will not set home base, but you write, that there were air battles, so this is not such case.

I think surprise only works for 7th December, not other dates.



HerzKaraya -> RE: Destroying Aircraft on ground and Jap Surprise (8/3/2013 1:12:22 PM)

Thanks for the replies, I started the thread here because I thought it was a bug - but itīs not.

My testbed was made with new aircraft types, so I modified the Guadalcanal scenario, loaded Lunga with Allied planes and Rabaul with Japanese and set them to bomb each other. And I got plenty of planes destroyed on ground. So something was wrong with my testbed - NOT the game.

So I tinkered back and forth, played with heavier bombs, different bombs, etc... and finally found the solution.... aircraft WITHOUT an engine specified as a device can fly, shoot each other down, bomb, but.... CANNOT be destroyed on ground!!! Surprise!

The only thing missing is the December 7th factor... it does not seem to do much of a difference on June 22nd.

Thanks again guys!



sandman455 -> RE: Destroying Aircraft on ground and Jap Surprise (8/3/2013 3:42:04 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bubi Hartmann

So I tinkered back and forth, played with heavier bombs, different bombs, etc... and finally found the solution.... aircraft WITHOUT an engine specified as a device can fly, shoot each other down, bomb, but.... CANNOT be destroyed on ground!!! Surprise!



Ingenious - I'll have Japan holding their own in 1944-45 now! [:D]

BTW - I think all of us who have modded our scenarios have done pretty much the same thing. I just restarted 6 months of play because of a static device that shouldn't have been in a few LCU's TOE. I'd be pretty bummed out if only I didn't get so much joy out of tinkering with the database. It is usually more fun than playing the game.



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