RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (Full Version)

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bo -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/29/2014 4:21:45 AM)

List of optional rules I used in my new game start. Anything you do not understand either because I did not explain it properly or you find it difficult to understand I will put it into pictures for you, as many as it takes.

Bo

Bill

[image]local://upfiles/31758/D7ADA70A985A45C09CA2A08721E3EDC9.jpg[/image]



76mm -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/29/2014 5:22:31 AM)

thanks, I will try to post a couple of screenshots with questions, but I'm having problems with my usual picture-hosting site.

Two questions:
1) page 38 of the rule book says that I can have a transport move to a port, pick up troops, and then continue moving. Every time I try to do this with a naval action, my ship cannot move back out of the port. And I've not been able to load troops onto a transport at sea. In general the diagrams on page 38 are not particularly helpful for clueless noobs like me, because while they show what you can do, it does not show how to do them.

2) do the quick set up scenarios allow you to choose your own optional rules? I think not, so I've been avoiding them and starting new games with most of the optional rules turned on (other than oil, a few others).

i expect i'm missing some obvious things; while I've read through the rules a couple of times now, I tended to skim the naval rules because I was focusing on Barbarrossa, so now I've got to go back and read those parts.




are -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/29/2014 11:39:01 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: 76mm
1) page 38 of the rule book says that I can have a transport move to a port, pick up troops, and then continue moving. Every time I try to do this with a naval action, my ship cannot move back out of the port. And I've not been able to load troops onto a transport at sea. In general the diagrams on page 38 are not particularly helpful for clueless noobs like me, because while they show what you can do, it does not show how to do them.


Try holding CTRL in as you move, doing so tells the program that you are not done moving yet. Also useful for guiding land units over specific hexes or moving ships through sea zone infested with enemy units.



76mm -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/29/2014 1:46:03 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: are
Also useful for guiding land units over specific hexes


hmmm, does this allow you to temporarily over-stack? That would be useful.



Centuur -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/29/2014 2:55:55 PM)

You can make the chances of a naval battle happening larger, by not moving the entire fleet into a sea area. Keep some cruisers in port so you can move them in the next impulse to the sea area, so you can search again. I don't know if you have been doing this, but if you want to optimize the chance to get a battle with the enemy, that's the way to do it.




bo -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/29/2014 4:09:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: are


quote:

ORIGINAL: 76mm
1) page 38 of the rule book says that I can have a transport move to a port, pick up troops, and then continue moving. Every time I try to do this with a naval action, my ship cannot move back out of the port. And I've not been able to load troops onto a transport at sea. In general the diagrams on page 38 are not particularly helpful for clueless noobs like me, because while they show what you can do, it does not show how to do them.


Try holding CTRL in as you move, doing so tells the program that you are not done moving yet. Also useful for guiding land units over specific hexes or moving ships through sea zone infested with enemy units.

Hi centuur I tried what you said to do with control held down moving into a port but I am also having trouble with that as my transport becomes disorganized. What am I doing wrong.

Bo



Centuur -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/29/2014 5:55:26 PM)

Take the stack in hand. CTRL left click on the port. Load the units unto the TRS. Than make sure you don't drop off any units in the port (since you will get that question. Any unit selected will stay in port and get disorganised). Should work. If not, I would like to have a saved game so I can see what's happening.

One remark though: make sure you have enough MP and Range available to all units in the stack to do this (otherwise, the whole stack stops moving in the port...).



bo -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/29/2014 6:48:51 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

Take the stack in hand. CTRL left click on the port. Load the units unto the TRS. Than make sure you don't drop off any units in the port (since you will get that question. Any unit selected will stay in port and get disorganised). Should work. If not, I would like to have a saved game so I can see what's happening.

One remark though: make sure you have enough MP and Range available to all units in the stack to do this (otherwise, the whole stack stops moving in the port...).


Dumb and dumber thats me [:(]

I was using a transport with 3 movement points ouch!

I switched to a transport with 5 movement points and I was able to move the transport to Lae holding down the control button and picked up the 7/3 unit in Lae and transported it to a sea box in the Bismark Sea, but when I tried to move the unit into Rabaul instead of the Bismark sea it said I did not have enough movement points left to do that which probably makes sense.

Bo



76mm -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/29/2014 8:16:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur
You can make the chances of a naval battle happening larger, by not moving the entire fleet into a sea area. Keep some cruisers in port so you can move them in the next impulse to the sea area, so you can search again. I don't know if you have been doing this, but if you want to optimize the chance to get a battle with the enemy, that's the way to do it.



quote:

You can make the chances of a naval battle happening larger, by not moving the entire fleet into a sea area. Keep some cruisers in port so you can move them in the next impulse to the sea area, so you can search again. I don't know if you have been doing this, but if you want to optimize the chance to get a battle with the enemy, that's the way to do it.

I've not been doing this; so the ships only search the first time they move into a sea area? sorry for the dumb questions but the whole naval move/combat thing is a bit un-intuitive for me.

Although on my last impulse I was happy to finally be able to load 3 carrier planes onto carriers, move them into the relevant 4 box, and do a search, only to find nothing. If three loaded carriers in the 4 box can't find something, I guess searches are a wildcard at best?



bo -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/29/2014 11:45:44 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: 76mm


quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur
You can make the chances of a naval battle happening larger, by not moving the entire fleet into a sea area. Keep some cruisers in port so you can move them in the next impulse to the sea area, so you can search again. I don't know if you have been doing this, but if you want to optimize the chance to get a battle with the enemy, that's the way to do it.



quote:

You can make the chances of a naval battle happening larger, by not moving the entire fleet into a sea area. Keep some cruisers in port so you can move them in the next impulse to the sea area, so you can search again. I don't know if you have been doing this, but if you want to optimize the chance to get a battle with the enemy, that's the way to do it.

I've not been doing this; so the ships only search the first time they move into a sea area? sorry for the dumb questions but the whole naval move/combat thing is a bit un-intuitive for me.

Although on my last impulse I was happy to finally be able to load 3 carrier planes onto carriers, move them into the relevant 4 box, and do a search, only to find nothing. If three loaded carriers in the 4 box can't find something, I guess searches are a wildcard at best?


The Coral sea is 1,8000,000 square miles in size so in reallity it might be pretty hard to find enemy naval fleets in such a vast area, the 4 box is a great box to be in remember if the weather is clear the searching side has to roll a 4 or less to find the enemy fleet, if your in sea box 3, a 3 or less if there is rain or a storm could be 2 or less.

Centuurs idea is excelllent about keeping some ships in reserve and sending them in on the next impulse and then the next impulse and so on , hoping each additional search will find something. A slight problem with that though is you better hope the first search fails or you could lose a lot of ships with a weakened force [:(]

Bo



Courtenay -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/30/2014 2:28:15 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: 76mm


quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur
You can make the chances of a naval battle happening larger, by not moving the entire fleet into a sea area. Keep some cruisers in port so you can move them in the next impulse to the sea area, so you can search again. I don't know if you have been doing this, but if you want to optimize the chance to get a battle with the enemy, that's the way to do it.



quote:

You can make the chances of a naval battle happening larger, by not moving the entire fleet into a sea area. Keep some cruisers in port so you can move them in the next impulse to the sea area, so you can search again. I don't know if you have been doing this, but if you want to optimize the chance to get a battle with the enemy, that's the way to do it.

I've not been doing this; so the ships only search the first time they move into a sea area? sorry for the dumb questions but the whole naval move/combat thing is a bit un-intuitive for me.

Although on my last impulse I was happy to finally be able to load 3 carrier planes onto carriers, move them into the relevant 4 box, and do a search, only to find nothing. If three loaded carriers in the 4 box can't find something, I guess searches are a wildcard at best?

quote:

quote:ORIGINAL: Centuur You can make the chances of a naval battle happening larger, by not moving the entire fleet into a sea area. Keep some cruisers in port so you can move them in the next impulse to the sea area, so you can search again. I don't know if you have been doing this, but if you want to optimize the chance to get a battle with the enemy, that's the way to do it. quote:You can make the chances of a naval battle happening larger, by not moving the entire fleet into a sea area. Keep some cruisers in port so you can move them in the next impulse to the sea area, so you can search again. I don't know if you have been doing this, but if you want to optimize the chance to get a battle with the enemy, that's the way to do it. I've not been doing this; so the ships only search the first time they move into a sea area? sorry for the dumb questions but the whole naval move/combat thing is a bit un-intuitive for me. Although on my last impulse I was happy to finally be able to load 3 carrier planes onto carriers, move them into the relevant 4 box, and do a search, only to find nothing. If three loaded carriers in the 4 box can't find something, I guess searches are a wildcard at best?


Something does not make sense here. You may search with units that are already in a sea area, if you did not call a land or a pass action. You just have to have an undisrupted unit to search with. (Which disrupts the unit.) Adding new units does not change the odds.

Yes, searches are a wildcard at best. If there are no CPs in an area, and if you are not using variable carrier searching, then you will never get more than a 50% chance of finding the enemy. Of course, your enemy also has a chance of finding you, so if both sides have carriers in the 4 box, then there is 75% chance of battle each impulse.




76mm -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/30/2014 3:13:17 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Courtenay
if you are not using variable carrier searching,


Sorry, but what is "variable carrier searching"? Couldn't find it in the rules.



warspite1 -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/30/2014 7:02:08 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: 76mm


quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur
You can make the chances of a naval battle happening larger, by not moving the entire fleet into a sea area. Keep some cruisers in port so you can move them in the next impulse to the sea area, so you can search again. I don't know if you have been doing this, but if you want to optimize the chance to get a battle with the enemy, that's the way to do it.



quote:

You can make the chances of a naval battle happening larger, by not moving the entire fleet into a sea area. Keep some cruisers in port so you can move them in the next impulse to the sea area, so you can search again. I don't know if you have been doing this, but if you want to optimize the chance to get a battle with the enemy, that's the way to do it.

I've not been doing this; so the ships only search the first time they move into a sea area? sorry for the dumb questions but the whole naval move/combat thing is a bit un-intuitive for me.

Although on my last impulse I was happy to finally be able to load 3 carrier planes onto carriers, move them into the relevant 4 box, and do a search, only to find nothing. If three loaded carriers in the 4 box can't find something, I guess searches are a wildcard at best?
warspite1

Much of the game is unintuitive - it always surprises me when people suggest WIF is intuitive. But hang in there - I guarantee the learning process IS worth it because there is such a rich game to un-lock if you put in the time. And keep asking questions to avoid frustration. I have to say I have learned a lot here too as to date I have just concentrated on "vanilla" movement of units on TRS.



Orm -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/30/2014 1:35:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: 76mm


quote:

ORIGINAL: Courtenay
if you are not using variable carrier searching,


Sorry, but what is "variable carrier searching"? Couldn't find it in the rules.

That is because the optional name have changed for MWIF. I cut in the rule below.

Cut from RAC: 11.5.5 Searching
.....
SiF option 27: (CV search) Instead of increasing the search number in a section of a sea-box by 1, in Fine,
Snow or Rain modify it according to the longest range among the carrier planes on undamaged committed CVs in
that section:
• if the longest range is 1-3 no modifier;
• if the longest range is 4-6, increase the search number by 1;
• if the longest range is 7+, increase the search number by 2.



76mm -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/31/2014 3:19:47 AM)

I think I read somewhere carrier planes cannot fly during the Naval Air phase from land--is that correct?

If so, what's the reason for that, surely carrier planes could take off from land?



warspite1 -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/31/2014 5:30:04 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: 76mm

I think I read somewhere carrier planes cannot fly during the Naval Air phase from land--is that correct?

If so, what's the reason for that, surely carrier planes could take off from land?
warspite1

I'm sure I read its to stop abuse of the carrier planes option. There are so many aircraft and players were using carrier planes in ways not designed and which upset play balance.



76mm -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/31/2014 3:50:35 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1
I'm sure I read its to stop abuse of the carrier planes option. There are so many aircraft and players were using carrier planes in ways not designed and which upset play balance.


I'm sure the veteran players can give examples, but its not obvious (to me) how this could be abused--aren't carrier planes less capable than their land-based counterparts? I would think players would be glad if their opponent built too many carrier-based planes?



are -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/31/2014 7:15:01 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: 76mm
I'm sure the veteran players can give examples, but its not obvious (to me) how this could be abused--aren't carrier planes less capable than their land-based counterparts? I would think players would be glad if their opponent built too many carrier-based planes?

I'm not a veteran player, and I agree, it's not obvious at all, but consider the following:
- A carrier cost a few BP, so if it was possible to use a cvplane without a cv it would in effect be considerably cheaper.
- On the defense a cvplane flying as a fighter has such a low chance of being shot down with it's pilot that it basically is only the price of the cvplane that matters.
- Most bombers has such low air-to-air ratings that even a crappy cvplane acting as a fighter does matter.
- CW has 4 carrier-based Gladiators in the forcepool at a cost of 1 BP each, they have 3 air-to-air factors. There are 11 other cv-planes with a cost of 1 in the starting CW force pool. The French also has some cv-planes. The Western Allies could rule the skies over France early 1940 with low-factor planes if they put their mind to it if it wasn't for the fact that CV-planes without CVs are worthless. Poor Germany.



Courtenay -> RE: Guadalcanal Scenario (1/31/2014 7:23:42 PM)

The real abuse with carrier planes was using them as anti-sub planes into the zero box. Any airplane in the zero box is much, much better than no airplane, and the short range and low factors of early CVPs really aren't a handicap.



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