Supply woes (Full Version)

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CyrusSpitama -> Supply woes (11/15/2013 9:18:37 PM)

I feel I am getting a decent handle on most of the game mechanics. Supply still escapes me quite often. For example: My current push into China is seeing the front line troops starve and all the nearby bases are in red ! . Not a good situation to be in as it causes me to wait days for these front line troops to be fed to continue their advances.

The area that is starving (mostly) is the area around Nanyang as I am closing in on Loyang and Chengchow. I have sent numerous convoys to Wuchang/Hankow but these supplies seem to vanish into the nether and none of the local bases received hardly a bump in supplies.

Wasn't there a Supply 101 primer somewhere.... done by Alfred I think?



moore4807 -> RE: Supply woes (11/15/2013 9:37:19 PM)

Damian's primer.

It won't answer every question you have, but the basics and practice will have you saying "Ahhh THAT's what he meant" many times over as you play!

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2933397



CyrusSpitama -> RE: Supply woes (11/15/2013 9:38:35 PM)

Thanks moore. I hadn't noticed that doc before. Will give it a read.



crsutton -> RE: Supply woes (11/17/2013 4:36:04 AM)

Be careful about setting your bases to draw more supplies than the default number. In other words only turn extra draw on at one or two bases at at time and then turn it off when you have enough supply there. I found out the hard way that if you set a lot of bases to pull extra supply it just fouls the system up. Otherwise good roads free from enemy soldiers are the most important thing. Just like in the real deal.



zuluhour -> RE: Supply woes (11/17/2013 12:11:17 PM)

Well why didn't you pipe up before.

Back in classical WITP, Feinder provided the following information. No AE developer has ever indicated that this data deson't still fully apply to AE.

There are several variables which modify unadjusted assault values. Two of the key ones are how much supply the unit has on hand organically and the fort level of the unit.

Unit Supply

a unit with 100% supply has its unadjusted assault value multiplied by 1
a unit with 75% supply is multiplied by 0.8
a unit with 50% supply is multiplied by 0.6
a unit with 25% supply is multiplied by 0.4
a unit with zero supply is multiplied by 0.25

Fortification Level

fort level 0 = 1x unadjusted assault value
fort level 1 = 1.1x
fort level 2 = 1.25x
fort level 3 = 1.5x
fort level 4 = 1.75x
fort level 5 = 2x
fort level 6 = 2.25x
fort level 7 = 2.5x
fort level 8 = 2.75x
fort level 9 = 3x

The divide by 30 rule only gives you an idea of the enemy's unadjusted assault value. I'm not so certain that you have to match that estimate, which is before modifiers and the effect of the fire phase in combat, with a close estimate of your own adjusted assault value.

Alfred



zuluhour -> RE: Supply woes (11/17/2013 12:13:03 PM)

CR is spot on with supply draw through bases. As allies I only keep one "rout" manipulated with the exception of Burma where I may have two.



CyrusSpitama -> RE: Supply woes (11/17/2013 8:21:54 PM)

Perhaps the base minimum supply amounts are my issue...

Normally I put a lot of small bases(even larger bases that wont be used) in areas troops are moving through to hold between 1-2k supply. This of course translates to 3-6k in supply demand because of the way the setting works.

Are even these small minimum amounts messing up the directions the supply is flowing?

What do I do with the numerous bases that I wish to keep 10K supply (or more) present in? These types of bases usually have AF based there and I need the extra supply always available so as not to affect air operations, correct? For key frontline bases, I try to make sure certain bases have ample supplies present to allow for troop/air replacements/upgrades. I am truly baffled how to keep those bases running if I am supposed to be removing the supply minimum setting.

Another good example: on the HI, I keep most bases at 4-5k minimum (translated to 12k supply of course) to allow for these bases to repair R&D factories. At bigger key bases that I launch from with supply convoys, I keep a 10k minimum setting ( or more, which translates to 30k or more supply at base) in order to ensure supply convoys have easy access to supplies to load. This practice, when translated into bigger theatres, might be causing some of my supply issues then?


One thing I know for sure, concepts like the invasion of India are beyond me until I get a firmer grasp on the way supply flows to my troops and bases (front line especially).

P.S. I am more than willing to offer my tracker/game files to anyone wishing to critique my distribution of the supply settings for my bases.



Numdydar -> RE: Supply woes (11/18/2013 2:07:17 AM)

Bases will always attempt to draw supplies based on the demad for supply at the base. The game is pretty good about how this gets distributed. The best way to keep the supplies you need is to make sure you are dumping a lot of supplies in the ports around the regions you need the supply at. Sometimes this could be a LOT of supplies. More than you think you need lol.

I once took a massive supply TF 150K+ of supplies to Shanghi and within two days the supply there was down to about 20K [X(]. So it may be you think you are putting enough supplies into an area, but you need a lot more than that.

The reason it is not a good idea to stockpile/increase supply needs for a base (with certain exceptions of course) is that it interfers with the natural flow of supplies. So if your supply pull goes from base A to B to C and you stockpile at B, the C will need to draw directly from A which will reduce the amount of supply C gets because it cannot get any from B any more. The same mechnic will happen if you increase the supply needs at B. If B is getting 5K supplies/turn and only needs 3K, then 2K are available to go to C. If you say B needs to always have 20K of supplies on hand, then it will take 10 turns before C starts recieving any supplies from B again. This is because B will stockpile the extra 2K until B has 20K+ supplies. At this point C will once again get supplies from B.

Of course your activity and the enemy's activity at B may affect B's supplies to the point where B never has the 20K+ of supplies you tell B it needs. In that case C will have to get its supplies from A for quite a while or you will need to send ships directly to C if a port or airlift supplies from A to C directly.

So if you really need to have a base stockpile, just be aware that you will need to do extra things to make sure the other bases that may be pulling supplies from there are getting the supplies they need to. This is why the best method is to just dump as much supplies as you can into an area and the game will make sure the supplies get to where they are needed. If are constantly running into shortages in certain areas, then you are not shipping in enough supplies.



Quixote -> RE: Supply woes (11/18/2013 2:29:46 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: CyrusSpitama

Perhaps the base minimum supply amounts are my issue...

Normally I put a lot of small bases(even larger bases that wont be used) in areas troops are moving through to hold between 1-2k supply. This of course translates to 3-6k in supply demand because of the way the setting works.

Are even these small minimum amounts messing up the directions the supply is flowing?

What do I do with the numerous bases that I wish to keep 10K supply (or more) present in? These types of bases usually have AF based there and I need the extra supply always available so as not to affect air operations, correct? For key frontline bases, I try to make sure certain bases have ample supplies present to allow for troop/air replacements/upgrades. I am truly baffled how to keep those bases running if I am supposed to be removing the supply minimum setting.

Another good example: on the HI, I keep most bases at 4-5k minimum (translated to 12k supply of course) to allow for these bases to repair R&D factories. At bigger key bases that I launch from with supply convoys, I keep a 10k minimum setting ( or more, which translates to 30k or more supply at base) in order to ensure supply convoys have easy access to supplies to load. This practice, when translated into bigger theatres, might be causing some of my supply issues then?


One thing I know for sure, concepts like the invasion of India are beyond me until I get a firmer grasp on the way supply flows to my troops and bases (front line especially).

P.S. I am more than willing to offer my tracker/game files to anyone wishing to critique my distribution of the supply settings for my bases.


If you want a critique (I'll be gentle[:)]), I probably have time to give you one. I'll PM you with my email address and you can send me a turn if you feel comfortable doing so.



CyrusSpitama -> RE: Supply woes (11/18/2013 7:35:38 PM)

Started a new game with all my currently *handled* goals with the new goal of focusing on figuring out the darned supply mechanic :P

Besides, I had to change my game setup in order to play vs. my opponent so why not dive into a new game? More practice for the starting months of Japan cannot hurt me [:'(]



HexHead -> RE: Supply woes (11/18/2013 10:27:17 PM)

never mind (tried to delete)



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