Action/Stack Penalty? Question Pls (Full Version)

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rmp090946 -> Action/Stack Penalty? Question Pls (12/4/2013 5:46:37 PM)

What should I be aware/concerned with regarding numbers of units within a particular stack; and, the negative effect upon combat outcome. I've searched the forum, but did not find and the manual doesn't seem to elaborate although referring to a change in ATG gold that better controls abuses of stacking units in battle.

However, if I've missed a source...just point me in the right direction.

I'm a bit confused about what's important for me to consider within a unit(s) to maximize their combat effectiveness in battle.

Thanks in advance for any input.

Bob


PS: I had also purchased DC:CB with ATG and noticed that DC:CB refers to "stack penalties" in their manual. Does ATG have similar limitations?



Jeffrey H. -> RE: Action/Stack Penalty? Question Pls (12/4/2013 6:34:07 PM)

I think it's something like 200 stack points per hex before damage penalties begin to take effect. Not sure on that. I don't realy pay close attention to this when I play, but I often lose so there ya go.




GrumpyMel -> RE: Action/Stack Penalty? Question Pls (12/4/2013 6:55:05 PM)

Hey Bob,

So in ATG, each SFT you have takes up a certain amount space. The total amount of SFT's you have going into a combat in a hex is added up and compared against a set maximum which is defined by the scenario creator. You can easly see this in the game window when you are picking units to participate in the combat. It'll say something like "75/100". The 2nd number "100" tells you the maximum stacking limit for combat before you start suffering a penalty. The 1st number "75" tells you the number of stacking points you currently have selected to go into that combat. As long as the 1st number is equal to or lower then the 2nd (the defined stacking limit) all your units in that combat are fighting at optimal efficiency. If you exceed that number your units start getting a progressively worse combat penalty as they don't have enough room to manuver an fight. In practical terms, depending upon how powerfull the units you are adding are, it takes going over by quite alot before you are doing more harm then good by adding units in terms of winning the battle but it usualy means you are going to be taking more casualties to get that victory then you would with no stacking penalty. Think of it like a shock attack.

Now it doesn't matter how many units those SFT's are divided into going into the combat...just how many total SFT's. However, attacking from more then one hexside (e.g. concentric attacks) gives you both a flanking bonus for the attack AND increases the maximum stacking limit you can have in an attack before you start suffering a penalty as it widens your attack frontage. The more hexes you attack from the better. That's why concentric attacks are so desirable. In the vanilla game, the default stacking limit for attacking from a single hexside is 100 which represents 100 rifleman SFT's.

I hope that helps you out.











rmp090946 -> RE: Action/Stack Penalty? Question Pls (12/4/2013 7:22:09 PM)

GrumpyMel: Thanks for the info!

Just so I'm clear: "SFT" refers to Stack Formation Type? And, the "Hex value" of "80" (adding say 40 rifle + 40 engineer = 80) which total also is in the upper right of the screen with the "Hex" location data?

If I understand (per my example), 80 is less than 100 so I'm OK; but, if I was to exceed 100 it diminishes that stacks effectiveness with addition losses, correct?

And, if I also understand, there are instances when there are "command decisions" to have 100+ to execute a specific objective (knowing there will be above normal losses), correct?

I really appreciate your response, and please correct me if I've misinterpreted your explanation.

Regards,

Bob



ernieschwitz -> RE: Action/Stack Penalty? Question Pls (12/4/2013 7:44:12 PM)

SFT = Sub formation type. But other than that iŽd say you are spot on. :)



rmp090946 -> RE: Action/Stack Penalty? Question Pls (12/4/2013 7:52:37 PM)

Ok, thanks again for your help!



GrumpyMel -> RE: Action/Stack Penalty? Question Pls (12/4/2013 8:53:57 PM)

Yup, what erniescwitz says.

Note, if we start to get deep into the practical tactics of ATG .....there can actualy be times where "overstacking" an attack ends up reducing your casualties simply because killing the enemies troops more quickly gives them less opportunity to fire at your guys. It actualy can be quite a bit of a black art once you get experienced with the game system [;)]



rmp090946 -> RE: Action/Stack Penalty? Question Pls (12/4/2013 11:30:09 PM)

GrumpyMel, ErnieSchwitz:

Armour issue: When I include even 1 tank the "STK" box we've been discussing shows "1499". Any more than 1 tank still shows "1499". How does this relate (if it does) to the "STK" max of 100?

Thanks,

Bob



Twotribes -> RE: Action/Stack Penalty? Question Pls (12/4/2013 11:50:31 PM)

Tanks don't count that much unless you are in some special scenario, I would say your chart is bugged. Most tanks count as 10 to 20 as I recall.



rmp090946 -> RE: Action/Stack Penalty? Question Pls (12/5/2013 12:31:05 AM)

Twotribes: Yes, just reloaded (it's a random scenario) and the STK box now indicates what appears to be normal numbers, i.e.: 112, 104, 98 for those formations I made with tanks.

Must have been just an interim display issue. Seems to be corrected now after I exited game and restarted.

Thanks for the reply, Bob



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