Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops?

Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (Full Version)

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kev_uk -> Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 7:10:17 PM)
As title says. Held off for a long time with two of Matrix Games biggest titles. I got burned out with War in the Pacific, it was too much micromanaging and limited AI, but I loved Uncommon Valor, that was a greatly niche game and for such a small theater that made it all the more playable and interesting. WitP was just too much for me, too big and having to spend over an hour on each turn? Anyway, the choice at the moment is War in the East (getting scared with another WitP monster, but really like the period and the challenge) or Command Ops (played Conquest of the Aegean and liked that concept, love the fact they have redone HTTR too), or even possibly Ageods 1936 Spanish Civil War game? So, folks, not been on here for awhile, but would like to buy myself something with a bit of depth this Christmas. Thanks.

warspite1 -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 7:13:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kev_uk As title says. Held off for a long time with two of Matrix Games biggest titles. I got burned out with War in the Pacific, it was too much micromanaging and limited AI, but I loved Uncommon Valor, that was a greatly niche game and for such a small theater that made it all the more playable and interesting. WitP was just too much for me, too big and having to spend over an hour on each turn? Anyway, the choice at the moment is War in the East (getting scared with another WitP monster, but really like the period and the challenge) or Command Ops (played Conquest of the Aegean and liked that concept, love the fact they have redone HTTR too), or even possibly Ageods 1936 Spanish Civil War game? So, folks, not been on here for awhile, but would like to buy myself something with a bit of depth this Christmas. Thanks. warspite1 WITE or Command Ops? That's easy - Matrix World In Flames

kev_uk -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 7:24:42 PM)
quote: World In Flames Umm, ok thanks for the heads up on this, but probably not. If you could choose between my Command Ops and HTTR expansion or the base game of WitE, what would you choose? Thanks for the suggestion and pointer, but maybe that in the future, or at least tell me why World in Flames would and should equal my two possible choices (as well as 1936)?.

Alchenar -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 7:25:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: warspite1 quote: ORIGINAL: kev_uk As title says. Held off for a long time with two of Matrix Games biggest titles. I got burned out with War in the Pacific, it was too much micromanaging and limited AI, but I loved Uncommon Valor, that was a greatly niche game and for such a small theater that made it all the more playable and interesting. WitP was just too much for me, too big and having to spend over an hour on each turn? Anyway, the choice at the moment is War in the East (getting scared with another WitP monster, but really like the period and the challenge) or Command Ops (played Conquest of the Aegean and liked that concept, love the fact they have redone HTTR too), or even possibly Ageods 1936 Spanish Civil War game? So, folks, not been on here for awhile, but would like to buy myself something with a bit of depth this Christmas. Thanks. warspite1 WITE or Command Ops? That's easy - Matrix World In Flames You can get the same experience as World in Flames but much cheaper if you pour salt into a cup of water until it stops dissolving and then down it in one. I'd say Command Ops. Fantastic AI makes it forever re-playable without the worry of finding PBEM opponents (there's also a demo floating around out there if you want to try it out).

warspite1 -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 7:30:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kev_uk quote: World In Flames Umm, ok thanks for the heads up on this, but probably not. If you could choose between my Command Ops and HTTR expansion or the base game of WitE, what would you choose? Thanks for the suggestion and pointer, but maybe that in the future, or at least tell me why World in Flames would and should equal my two possible choices (as well as 1936)?. warspite1 Okay fair enough - was only supposed to be a light-hearted comment. Reason I would choose MWIF is because it is the best war game ever imo but that's not what you wanted help with so apologies.

kev_uk -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 7:34:06 PM)
..looked at it; it seems another monster. Hows the AI?

Missouri_Rebel -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 7:36:42 PM)
quote: You can get the same experience as World in Flames but much cheaper if you pour salt into a cup of water until it stops dissolving and then down it in one. Wth does that even mean? I'd actually say that describes nearly all your posts; bitter and hard to swallow. Are you as big of a joy offline as you are here? Back on topic. Between the two listed, I prefer Command Ops especially the HttR expansion. Mo reb

warspite1 -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 7:37:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kev_uk ..looked at it; it seems another monster. Hows the AI? warspite1 It is a monster - but a different sort of monster, a more fun monster to WITP-AE. BTW, I found WITE only slightly less daunting that WITP-AE so if you didn't get on with the latter, the former may prove not your cup of tea either. WITE is certainly more intuitive - easier to play out of the box - but still a monster. MWIF currently has no AI and netplay has issues. But at least you have time to learn, what is a brilliant game through solitaire, before being expected to take on an opponent [:)]

kev_uk -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 7:49:37 PM)
Thanks, but maybe skip WiF until later. I have limited finances and this would be my Christmas present so to speak. I loved HttR, but that was lacking and I brought Conquest of the Aegean and that a step up, but still lacked that 'punch', a campaign I think. I really liked the supply aspect from that game, but still no campaign it seems :( WitE I am very very interested in too. But, if its anything like Pacific, gotta leave it alone; too much. But still loved the theater and the challenges it faces. I mean, trying to stem the Soviet horde, or trying to stem the Wehrmacht is a great gaming experience depending on the AI etc. Decisions!!!!!

warspite1 -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 7:53:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kev_uk Thanks, but maybe skip WiF until later. I have limited finances and this would be my Christmas present so to speak. I loved HttR, but that was lacking and I brought Conquest of the Aegean and that a step up, but still lacked that 'punch', a campaign I think. I really liked the supply aspect from that game, but still no campaign it seems :( WitE I am very very interested in too. But, if its anything like Pacific, gotta leave it alone; too much. But still loved the theater and the challenges it faces. I mean, trying to stem the Soviet horde, or trying to stem the Wehrmacht is a great gaming experience depending on the AI etc. Decisions!!!!! warspite1 Have you thought of Commander The Great War? That is a nice little game (albeit it could do with the patch being tested at the moment and due for release "soon"). Played that almost solid for the best part of a year. Great fun!

Rising-Sun -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 8:00:15 PM)
Well WitP:AE will take up alot of timing, depending on scenario. And it quite complex game, but be warned the AIs will cheat. Try to learn as much you can then find a opponent by PBEM.

kev_uk -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 8:19:30 PM)
Its more and more looking Command Ops and HttR, but still am eyeing up WitE. Mmm

Rising-Sun -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 8:22:00 PM)
Thats cool, im looking forward to get this game next week (Supreme Ruler 1936)... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KN3qdX1Y7VY

catwhoorg -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 8:35:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: warspite1 Have you thought of Commander The Great War? That is a nice little game (albeit it could do with the patch being tested at the moment and due for release "soon"). Played that almost solid for the best part of a year. Great fun! I second this nomination. Never really played much WWI stuff before, but it is a very fun little game with the AI being a decent challange

kev_uk -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/10/2013 9:03:20 PM)
quote: Commander The Great War I like the look of Supreme Commander, but folks, I had my eyes set on maybe three games and now all of these pop up! Arghh! Tell it how is...

Neilster -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 12:02:07 AM)
I'd go with Command Ops. Best AI in wargaming and as little or as much management as you like. World in Flames is definitely worth keeping in mind though; perhaps when the AI version is available. You have total control of the Axis or the Allies; all military, political and economic decisions. It teaches you a lot about aspects of WW2 that may be unfamiliar, like convoying resources to where they are needed, supply or dealing with strategic bombing. Aside from the usual fronts, there are less played ones like the war in China, which is vast. Then there are all the hypotheticals, like Operation Sealion, invading Spain and Gibraltar, a Japanese invasion of Australia, conquering Suez and fanning out into the Middle East to score all that lovely oil and potentially launch a two-pronged Barbarossa... It's based on a brilliant and proven boardgame system and has a variable amount of chrome through optional rules. Almost anything you can think of from WW2 is in it. The (converted ocean liner) "Queens" racing and zig-zagging across the Atlantic unescorted, V-weapons, atomic weapons, auxiliary convoy raiders, partisans, Chinese warlords... Cheers, Neilster Cheers, Neilster

Agathosdaimon -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 12:41:39 AM)
although the consensus is command ops and it is indeed one that will spare youtoo much micromanaging, i quite like WitE and WitE has a lot of scenarios of varying size and length. Also although WitE has alot of information, you dont need to go through it or make use of it every turn. I think WitE has a great atmosphere to it too, helped by its soundtrack also . I have command ops Battles from the Bulge and its definitely got the realistic thing to it, but perhaps i havent played it enough yet as i have been a little bored with just looking at units bogged down in attrition fighting and doing little else - perhaps it is too realistic to think that i can really effective command the units once all the firing commences

Lieste -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 2:02:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Agathosdaimon although the consensus is command ops and it is indeed one that will spare youtoo much micromanaging, i quite like WitE and WitE has a lot of scenarios of varying size and length. Also although WitE has alot of information, you dont need to go through it or make use of it every turn. I think WitE has a great atmosphere to it too, helped by its soundtrack also . I have command ops Battles from the Bulge and its definitely got the realistic thing to it, but perhaps i havent played it enough yet as i have been a little bored with just looking at units bogged down in attrition fighting and doing little else - perhaps it is too realistic to think that i can really effective command the units once all the firing commences There is an art to keeping the tempo of operations up. Attritional warfare isn't always required. A key is to keep a strong reserve and to commit it at the decisive place and time, reforming another strong reserve for commitment from those units released (or the original reserve if the first echelon still has legs). Think of the ground in 3D, and look for positions that provide domination without undue exposure, and covered approaches... make these the focus of your defence (both when formally attacking, and for the base of fire or key elements of an economy of effort). The main requirement is to anticipate requirements for 3-12 hours ahead and have the right forces converging on the right locations at the right times... and keep the supply lines viable... obviously this will never work out perfectly, but if you get it right more often (and get it wrong in smaller ways) then you'll accomplish your tasks relatively easily.

Perturabo -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 2:42:04 AM)
Command Ops has a demo. IIRC I decided to buy it only after finishing the tutorial scenario for the first time.

gradenko2k -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 4:47:06 AM)
Come on guys, why would you be recommending World in Flames when it doesn't even have single-player AI? If he was going to run the whole boardgame by himself or via PBEM, he might as well do it through VASSAL. Anyway, to answer the OP's question directly, I'd consider Command Ops to be the better game unless you really prefer the scale and/or setting of WITE.

warspite1 -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 5:21:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: gradenko_2000 Come on guys, why would you be recommending World in Flames when it doesn't even have single-player AI? If he was going to run the whole boardgame by himself or via PBEM, he might as well do it through VASSAL. warspite1 For the reasons I have already stated to the OP...

aaatoysandmore -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 5:33:53 AM)
History of the World I or II would be my outside recommendation. It's easy to play yet detailed just enough, it's grand scale, but from you choices you gave us then I'd go with Command OPS anyday over WITE. I think History of the World would give you more of what you want though if you want a campaign. And it comes with worldwide events that change from game to game. That's what I like about it over all the other suggestions is the "whatif" outcomes, I don't care to play canned scenarios or repeat wars or battles myself. Even Gettysburg scourge of war is different in sandbox mode even though the yanks stomp my butt every time at least they do it in a different way.

aaatoysandmore -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 5:40:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: gradenko_2000 Come on guys, why would you be recommending World in Flames when it doesn't even have single-player AI? If he was going to run the whole boardgame by himself or via PBEM, he might as well do it through VASSAL. Anyway, to answer the OP's question directly, I'd consider Command Ops to be the better game unless you really prefer the scale and/or setting of WITE. I'm with gradenko, as far as I'm concerned WIF doesn't even exist until they put an ai in it. It's just a boardgame converted to computer, nothing more nothing less until it has an ai (and a good one) to play against. I cannot believe they even thought about releasing it until it had one. How many copies did you sell Matrix (like they would tell me) 100? 120? lol Can't have been many as there can't be that many <think of favorite derogative here> in the world to buy a "PC" game without an ai or can there?

warspite1 -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 5:53:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore quote: ORIGINAL: gradenko_2000 Come on guys, why would you be recommending World in Flames when it doesn't even have single-player AI? If he was going to run the whole boardgame by himself or via PBEM, he might as well do it through VASSAL. Anyway, to answer the OP's question directly, I'd consider Command Ops to be the better game unless you really prefer the scale and/or setting of WITE. I'm with gradenko, as far as I'm concerned WIF doesn't even exist until they put an ai in it. It's just a boardgame converted to computer, nothing more nothing less until it has an ai (and a good one) to play against. I cannot believe they even thought about releasing it until it had one. How many copies did you sell Matrix (like they would tell me) 100? 120? lol Can't have been many as there can't be that many <think of favorite derogative here> in the world to buy a "PC" game without an ai or can there? warspite1 What a pleasant post. Okay, you do not want to purchase the game, and for the reasons you state and that are important to you. Fine, no problem with that. But why do you feel the need to insult those that do? "Favourite derogative expletive". Yes I can think of the usual ones. The fact you feel the need to call me one of those just because I chose to buy a game says quite a lot about you doesn't it aaatoysandmore?

Alchenar -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 10:54:25 AM)
Well regardless of the objective merits of the game, given that the two criteria the OP listed were: 1) Should have better AI than WitP 2) Should have a smaller scope than WitP Then recommending World in Flames is just straight up ignoring what he asked for and is unhelpful advice. Commander: The Great War is probably something the OP should look at. Other things I'd recommend: The Decisive Campaigns games (limited scope Operational level, passable AI, very accessible) and Unity of Command/Panzer Corps. I would not recommend buying any AGEOD game unless 'sit and wait 5 minutes for the turn to process' is an important part of your gameplay experience.

Titanwarrior89 -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 1:33:28 PM)
WitE....[&o]

Missouri_Rebel -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 2:34:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Alchenar Other things I'd recommend: The Decisive Campaigns games (limited scope Operational level, passable AI, very accessible) Yes. Good suggestion.

Aurelian -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 3:58:45 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: warspite1 quote: ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore quote: ORIGINAL: gradenko_2000 Come on guys, why would you be recommending World in Flames when it doesn't even have single-player AI? If he was going to run the whole boardgame by himself or via PBEM, he might as well do it through VASSAL. Anyway, to answer the OP's question directly, I'd consider Command Ops to be the better game unless you really prefer the scale and/or setting of WITE. I'm with gradenko, as far as I'm concerned WIF doesn't even exist until they put an ai in it. It's just a boardgame converted to computer, nothing more nothing less until it has an ai (and a good one) to play against. I cannot believe they even thought about releasing it until it had one. How many copies did you sell Matrix (like they would tell me) 100? 120? lol Can't have been many as there can't be that many <think of favorite derogative here> in the world to buy a "PC" game without an ai or can there? warspite1 What a pleasant post. Okay, you do not want to purchase the game, and for the reasons you state and that are important to you. Fine, no problem with that. But why do you feel the need to insult those that do? "Favourite derogative expletive". Yes I can think of the usual ones. The fact you feel the need to call me one of those just because I chose to buy a game says quite a lot about you doesn't it aaatoysandmore? I agree, It's a bad as those who insult people who don't want the hardback rules. No need for any of it.

warspite1 -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 5:52:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Alchenar Well regardless of the objective merits of the game, given that the two criteria the OP listed were: 1) Should have better AI than WitP 2) Should have a smaller scope than WitP Then recommending World in Flames is just straight up ignoring what he asked for and is unhelpful advice. Commander: The Great War is probably something the OP should look at. Other things I'd recommend: The Decisive Campaigns games (limited scope Operational level, passable AI, very accessible) and Unity of Command/Panzer Corps. I would not recommend buying any AGEOD game unless 'sit and wait 5 minutes for the turn to process' is an important part of your gameplay experience. warspite1 And as I have already explained in post 5, it was light-hearted, you know like Airplane - "What were the choices of dinner?" - "chicken or fish". "Ah yes that's right, I had lasagne" [8\|] Really nothing for anyone to get in a lather about...

warspite1 -> RE: Please help me make a descision; WitE or Command Ops? (12/11/2013 5:53:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aurelian quote: ORIGINAL: warspite1 quote: ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore quote: ORIGINAL: gradenko_2000 Come on guys, why would you be recommending World in Flames when it doesn't even have single-player AI? If he was going to run the whole boardgame by himself or via PBEM, he might as well do it through VASSAL. Anyway, to answer the OP's question directly, I'd consider Command Ops to be the better game unless you really prefer the scale and/or setting of WITE. I'm with gradenko, as far as I'm concerned WIF doesn't even exist until they put an ai in it. It's just a boardgame converted to computer, nothing more nothing less until it has an ai (and a good one) to play against. I cannot believe they even thought about releasing it until it had one. How many copies did you sell Matrix (like they would tell me) 100? 120? lol Can't have been many as there can't be that many <think of favorite derogative here> in the world to buy a "PC" game without an ai or can there? warspite1 What a pleasant post. Okay, you do not want to purchase the game, and for the reasons you state and that are important to you. Fine, no problem with that. But why do you feel the need to insult those that do? "Favourite derogative expletive". Yes I can think of the usual ones. The fact you feel the need to call me one of those just because I chose to buy a game says quite a lot about you doesn't it aaatoysandmore? I agree, It's a bad as those who insult people who don't want the hardback rules. No need for any of it. warspite1 +1 ridiculous.

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