Can elements withdraw from a map? (Full Version)

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TDeacon -> Can elements withdraw from a map? (1/16/2014 11:01:01 PM)

The last game in this series I purchased was Close Combat Wacht am Rhein. In WaR, it appears to be impossible to withdraw from a map once a battle has begun, unlike in earlier games such as Close Combat III (Russian Front). Thus, in WaR, you are forced to fight until defeated, or until the overall time limit expires. IMHO, this is a major issue which detracts from campaign realism, in that it makes it difficult to conduct a delaying action.

Do recent games in the CC series still exhibit this issue?

Thanks in advance,
MH



Tejszd -> RE: Can elements withdraw from a map? (1/17/2014 1:04:36 AM)

Yes, all versions of CC after CC3/COI do not have a retreat button. To do a delaying action you have 2 options;
1 - play hide and seek till time runs
2 - hold the VL's letting your men die (this only works if you play with morale on and you have more than 3 VL's or luck as when morale breaks you lose 1 to 3 VL's)



TDeacon -> RE: Can elements withdraw from a map? (1/17/2014 2:16:56 AM)

Too bad; a critical flaw for any campaign system, IMHO. I would be disinclined to buy any more of these unless they fix this.

BTW, in CCIII, I don't recall a "retreat button". Rather one was able to move individual units off the map (which elicited a warning each time). When the last had exited, the battle ended.

MH



CGGrognard -> RE: Can elements withdraw from a map? (1/17/2014 9:48:56 PM)

Isn't a Truce option available? If not consider using Force Morale as a setting.



Tejszd -> RE: Can elements withdraw from a map? (1/18/2014 1:40:00 AM)

Yes you can ask for a truce, so that is another way for a battle to end, but the AI may not accept the offer.

In between battles you control battle groups thus you can leave a map/retreat then.



SteveMcClaire -> RE: Can elements withdraw from a map? (1/20/2014 2:34:24 PM)

It is a different mechanic for a different game. In Close Combat 3 and earlier there was no strategic layer. The only way to withdraw from a battle was to move your teams off the edge of the map during the fighting. In Close Combat 4 and later the strategic layer was introduced, and you control the large-scale movement of your troops (including retreating off a map) at that level. The decision on whether to fight or not is still present, it has just been shifted to a different part of the game.

Yes, this can cause you to have to fight a battle you'd rather run away from, but the battle can still be ended on truce, time limit, or heavy losses (via a force morale failure.) If your intent was to withdraw, consider this a chance for your rear guard to hold the enemy off long enough for the rest of the battle group to break contact. If they fail, the battle group cannot get away clean and is forced to make a disorganized retreat or even breaks up and disbands.

Steve



CGGrognard -> RE: Can elements withdraw from a map? (1/21/2014 1:58:38 PM)

The strategic layer is a good addition to this series, so The hope is that it will continue on with The Bloody First.
With the introduction of the strategic map, there is now an opportunity to hamper enemy movement with artillery and air strikes. There been a number of campaigns in PitF where my battle groups movement had been cancelled by these strikes. This works well in single player mode, but I'm not certain how well it carries over in head to head battles.
The strategic map provides the player an opportunity to rest battle groups which IMHO adds more to the idea of realism in the game.

One last note: at least in single player, some soldiers will flee the battlefield if their morale drops too low and they don't have leadership nearby. So whether it's the strategic map, force morale, or by truce, these are ways in which a battle group can avoid total annihilation in the game.



Pvt_Grunt -> RE: Can elements withdraw from a map? (1/23/2014 6:56:20 AM)

The answer is to never, ever, flee.



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