Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (Full Version)

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Erik Rutins -> Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (1/23/2014 5:57:43 PM)

In the view of focusing our efforts to develop and expand the Close Combat
franchise we are rolling out a few changes to Close Combat: Cross of Iron.
We are looking at the future, with one more release soon to be announced
under the current engine and the big brand new Close Combat multi-platform
engine currently in development.

In order to keep focus on the future of Close Combat, we have made the
decision to stop the multiplayer campaign support for Cross of Iron.
This decision was made after carefully evaluating traffic and matches being
played and finding that the multiplayer campaign was generally dormant. You
will still be able to play by starting you own sessions, but third party
multiplayer services that were previously included will now be unavailable.
The new version of Cross of Iron now in the store and available shortly as
an official update removes these elements.

Rest assured normal support for Cross of Iron and all other Close Combat
games will continue and we are working full time to make the best Close
Combat series going forward.



mooxe -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (1/23/2014 9:07:34 PM)

This means MMCC3 will be removed?

and BHQ?

Will the update do anything else other than remove that/those functions?



Tejszd -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (1/24/2014 1:11:12 AM)

Good questions MOOXE!

Definitely want to know/make sure that the built in H2H functionality is NOT removed/replaced with the forum match making in the latest CC.



Platoon_Michael -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (1/24/2014 3:06:11 AM)

Had you taken the time to upgrade MMCCIII to be able to use the Strategic Map and multiple BG's in with WaR,tLD and LSA you wouldn't have had this issue with nobody playing online.

BHQ....A Joke
ModSwap...Nobody uses it.(That's probably getting Dumped too)
/D switch...a means to alienate and or confuse online play.
PiFT Dedicated Room......History will tell ,but from my experience. No one's there very much.






SteveMcClaire -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (1/24/2014 11:59:59 PM)

It is impossible for us to upgrade or fix MMCCIII because we do not have (and never had) the source code for it. In addition Microsoft no longer supports the Java VM required for MMCCIII and it will eventually stop working. Unfortunately there is no way to continue to support the utility in a reasonable manner.

Steve



Platoon_Michael -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (1/25/2014 3:03:24 AM)

I understood that years ago when you told me that once before.

I just don't understand why no one feels a newer program isn't needed.
Especially one that could support multiple BG's.



Stwa -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (1/30/2014 8:53:24 PM)

Hello Matrix (Erik, Steve);

I am glad to hear the news on the CC series of games. You may not know, but I found CCMT one of the most enjoyable games ever. I was able to use many of the addon features that Matrix provided to users as extra value for this game. For instance, MODSWAP, which I found a very reliable way to add modifications to this game. As of today, I have dozens of plugins, covering small tweaks, complete mods, and map packs. Also, CC2 Redux and CC5 on CCMT were beneficial in creating a nifty WW2 experience using CCMT.

I found the AI credible, so long as the map sizes did not get too large.

And finally, the map editor, provided by Mafi (perhaps Matrix too), was the perfect add-on for CCMT.

But I have to concur with Erik, that going forward, it is probably beneficial for CC and Matrix to closely examine the CC add-ons of the past. Specifically those that revolve around enhancing Multiplayer gaming. Streamlining future editions of CC would be very welcome by moi. But don't forget the codeline too. As a developer myself (business programs), nothing is more exciting that getting your hands on a piece of code that is filled with seldom-used, unwanted features, and ripping them out of the program, making the codeline much smaller while retaining the used functionality.



Platoon_Michael -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (1/31/2014 12:08:03 AM)

Ahh yea,
You kinda dropped the ball on that post.

I cant really say that anything is going to produce a spike in online play judging by the amount of viewers seen on Game Ranger.

Having said that a Free Deploy Editor that could do Ops as well as Custom battles for the re-releases would be a worthy cause.
Battles and Small Ops are most likely what Most people are going to play these days.
Adjusting the Deploy Zone,Air Strikes,Barrages on multiple maps for a Custom Op. would be a HUGE advancement for online playing.


It appears however that matrix has no inclination to make ANY Tools for the re-releases based on ahh well there isn't any new tools.
Yes their willing to send Mafi anything he needs to create such a thing,but come on
One Guy?
Even I know that's not gonna last/work.







Stwa -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (1/31/2014 9:27:14 AM)

Ya, you are probably right. I haven't posted in a while and I am already rusty, so I will try again. [:D]

Dear Matrix types,

I really enjoyed CCMT and the Add-ons that came with the game and those I found on your xtra content website. I got a lot of mileage and fun out of CCMT.

I would like to strongly advocate that you rip multiplayer gaming from future CC games, and I would engourage you to do the same with any patches that you intend on releasing for any current CC title. That would mean some expense to Matrix, but you will feel much better in the morning.





johnsilver -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/1/2014 9:29:18 AM)

quote:

I cant really say that anything is going to produce a spike in online play judging by the amount of viewers seen on Game Ranger.


I can't say anything to the amount of players on GameRanger at any given time, but it more than likely applies to how many play this old engine anymore.

Most have moved on from when it was 1st released, some dozen years ago. Yes.. There was a time when 40+ were available at any given time, even when CC3 was a couple of years old. MOH took some away, CM did also. It got old and the users began to leave.

It seems to have happened with developers, mod makers also. Noticed that one (Pzjager) seemed to have left when his developed for AI mods were not what the H2H crowd wanted. Just what gathered from going over several topics after started playing one of his campaigns, but a shame for someone who developed such fine mods to be attacked like that for their work.

Anyway.. I doubt will ever see more than a small handful (at most) in any gameroom for CC. These games are just to old with the core players (us) probably half not even playing H2H anymore.



mooxe -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/1/2014 2:30:07 PM)

John, pzjager was not some innocent member. He participated as much as anyone else in the personal attacks (on multiple accounts), egged on other members and spammed many many threads. I think the differences started from some political and anti Islam posts. Those views turned into anger against other members then ultimately into trying to remove himself and the mods he created from the site. He was never banned, he left on his own.



johnsilver -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/1/2014 11:02:02 PM)

I didn't realize that Mooxe. just saw on some of the Stalingrad mod topics where some were complaining where his campaign was not suitably balanced vs H2H, rather than vs the AI and he posted numerous times that all of his Stalingrad campaigns were developed vs the AI and he had some plugins for H2H, but none of it really mattered.

Did seem to notice later on that multi account issue you mentioned, as well as where he stalked off.. I didn't know what to make of it, granted. Have known of other mod makers in other games who have gotten upset in other games and done the same thing, so wasn't positive it was just fed up.

As for firing away with another.s religious beliefs? Yes.. a no-no..

Losing mod makers like that is what brings about the demise of communities that are in need of those types. I think you understand that and have probably been in the CC community active the entire time CC has been around while I took a few years off. Nomada was another.. Yes.. I understand him some from the older days and some of why he left, but the same reason to why he left and not all to another game.



Stwa -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/2/2014 6:56:27 AM)

A rarely discussed topic, becuase it simply requires so many words for proper discussion, it just doesn't seem worth the time or energy anymore. Rather than goosing the fighting capabilities of the soldiers in an attempt to satisfy the system's singular method for determining victory, I kept the soldiers homogenous, and recognizable, and simply altered the victory conditions instead.

It is best applied in single player, but is bound to disapoint in multiplayer. It would be hard to get multiplayers to go along with it. "Hi, I have a great scenario here. You are the defender, I am the attacker, but I have 2 times as many guys, and I have tanks and you don't, and I win if I wipe out your entire force, and you win if you shoot at least one of my soldiers."

I just never enjoyed the balanced force games that were normally used for multiplayer games, and that is why I just never liked to spend time pursuing multiplayer. For me, CCMT was a great fit, because I could design battles with inbalanced forces that were much more fun.



Tejszd -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/2/2014 4:29:10 PM)

So we now know the next COI update will remove things; BHQ, MMCCIII and ? Anything else ?

Does it add or fix anything?



Stwa -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/2/2014 6:40:39 PM)

It is just a guess on my part, but me thinks had there been anything else, Erik would have mentioned it.

I am also guessing that you don't even play this title. Either do I for that matter.

So, why are we posting in this thread. [:D]



johnsilver -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/2/2014 9:22:01 PM)

quote:

So, why are we posting in this thread.


Good question. Seems some rude brute [:-] Came in and hijacked the thread for some odd reason? [X(]



Stwa -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/3/2014 3:53:56 AM)

Perhaps,

But to hijack a thread, requires that the thread was going somewhere in the first place. Beyond Erik's initial announcement, surely you agree that might be debateable.

Rude Brutes? Where? In this thread? Ok, maybe you've got the eye patch and the glass eye?




Tejszd -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/27/2014 2:14:19 AM)

Posted: 25 JAN 2014 "Close Combat - Cross of Iron v3.61 Update"
http://www.matrixgames.com/products/335/downloads/

Is this the update that removes things?

Are there any other changes from v3.60 as there was no announcement post that I saw?



Stwa -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/27/2014 2:45:23 AM)

Hey Tejszd.

Just don't throw away update 3.60.

Then if you don't want v 3.61 you can re-install and patch back to v 3.60.



SteveMcClaire -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/28/2014 2:16:12 AM)

The update contains a fix for the indecisive AT gun issue.

Steve



Tejszd -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/28/2014 4:35:10 AM)

Thanks Steve! That will definitely make some happy as there were a number complaint posts here and at Close Combat Series about that...



Stwa -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (2/28/2014 7:29:01 AM)

OMG,

I completely forgot about the "Indecisive AT Gun Issue". [:D] [;)]



Tejszd -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (3/2/2014 2:04:12 AM)

Will Matrix update the original game download with BHQ and MMCC3 removed? Be nice to save the space and on a fresh install not have to install them only to remove them when the latest patch is applied.



SteveMcClaire -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (3/2/2014 2:33:25 PM)

I believe that is the plan, yes.

Steve



Digs -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (3/2/2014 7:30:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tejszd

Will Matrix update the original game download with BHQ and MMCC3 removed? Be nice to save the space and on a fresh install not have to install them only to remove them when the latest patch is applied.


You don't have to install Battle HQ, when the installer opens the setup for BHQ just select cancel and the installation of the game will complete just fine.



Stwa -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (3/3/2014 4:12:01 AM)

Good Point!

Me thinks that works for the patches too. [:D]


[image]local://upfiles/17700/88F35B1E6F6C418793310E3613724F07.jpg[/image]



US Brake -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (7/1/2014 6:28:27 AM)

Cross of Iron is a great game and since it replaced CC3 it is the best version of all the Close Combat games for h2h play. I have played more online games of CC3 and COI against human opponents than anyone alive. The classic 1v1 single day battle was the core of what h2h CC3 games was all about in the MSN Game zone. Plenty of online gamers got into playing multi-day ops and the Grand Campaigns as well. We had a great h2h community for a few years playing Reg, RR, WF, Nam, PJ2 etc. We made our own custom battles, Ops, and Grand Campaigns. And the real hardcore fans made the classic mods that are now neglected.
When the MSN game zone closed we fell apart and never got the magic back. Cross of Iron is a better h2h game because it uses small maps and 1-16 units in one battle group. In CoI the game style and scenario design allow players to enjoy many h2h experiences that fit normal players lifestyles. Some players may want to play a single battle with 4 different opponents each night. Some players may want to complete a 10 day op with a friend in one afternoon. And of course playing the Grand Campaign was popular but rare to complete since it took so long, but some did finish a few.
Mooxe and myself were instrumental in getting Game Ranger to support Cross of Iron which has helped to keep h2h games alive since. In 2011 there a good number of COI games going each night. When the 2011 patch came out and messed up the Anti-Tank guns it killed the game. We reported the problem immediately but no one at Matrix responded. You should have at least recalled that patch until it was fixed. Instead you made everyone play without anti-tank guns for 3 years until the new patch came out this year. That is gross neglect on your company and a shame. That was a slap in the face to all of us who was supporting and playing this game in 2011.
Erik this new message you write about dropping your support for Cross of Iron.
“In order to keep focus on the future of Close Combat, we have made the
decision to stop the multiplayer campaign support for Cross of Iron”
Matrix support of Cross of Iron never started. How is it you can now decide to stop support for any part of the game? Matrix should start supporting Cross of Iron multiplayer by getting MMCC3 to work or improve the options of the game. and every other aspect of the game.
“This decision was made after carefully evaluating traffic and matches being
played and finding that the multiplayer campaign was generally dormant. You
will still be able to play by starting you own sessions, but third party
multiplayer services that were previously included will now be unavailable”

Why can't Matrix fix MMCC3 or add more options make us a working Grand Campaign Editor?
When will you guys apologize to us for giving us a bad patch in 2011 and not fixing it until 2014?
When will you start listening to the few players who really care about and play this game?


.[image]http://www.closecombatseries.net/CCS/modules/Forums/files/fury1_144.jpg[/image]



SteveMcClaire -> RE: Feature change for Close Combat: Cross of Iron (7/2/2014 8:27:01 PM)

The history of MMCCIII and its technical issues have been beaten to death in several threads. Here is the short version, to answer your question about fixing/updating MMCCIII:

MMCCIII is a third party utility written in Java and requiring an old version of the Microsoft Java VM. The Microsoft Java VM is no longer supported by Microsoft and has issues running on most remotely up-to-date versions of Windows.

The server side of MMCCIII requires significant babysitting to keep it up and running.

We do not have (and never had) the source code for MMCCIII and thus cannot fix it or update it.

Thanks,

Steve



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