Opinions on WOTY Steam Release (Full Version)

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ckfinite -> Opinions on WOTY Steam Release (9/26/2014 4:26:00 PM)

I've been rather active on Steam around the release of the game, and something that's came up a lot is that the price seems unreasonable to a lot of people there. It's something that's came up some here, but I'd like to raise the point again, as I don't think that the game will sell anywhere near as well as it should with the current price structure. The problem isn't one of quality - personally, I think that I got far more than $80 worth from the game - but rather one of marketing. I don't think that someone who hasn't been following the game for some time is willing to pay $80 for something that they aren't sure about, and this has been supported by the reactions on Steam.

IMO, the "right" price would be $40. For the Steam consumer, this implies that the game is high quality (Skyrim is $40, and that's one of the best selling games there), but is low enough that the expectations aren't unreasonably high. To justify a $60 price to a Steam consumer (never mind a $80 one), the game needs to be completely perfect, something that can't reasonably be delivered. From the business standpoint, I also think that sales would far more than double as well, so you almost certainly wouldn't lose money on this.



thewood1 -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/26/2014 4:38:42 PM)

Pricing is always an issue on Steam. I am not a big believer in complex wargames going up there until near end of life. Although Il2 went up there at over $90, but its a simulation.

I also am concerned that if the price is too low, you'll get a bunch of people who buy it, are not committed to learning it, and want a refund. We have seen that even here at Matrix's forums.



Sardaukar -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/26/2014 4:41:55 PM)

Indeed.

Command is a simulation too, not really a game, I'd say. It is niche product and requires certain type of player. It is definitely not even meant to be mainstream product. Mainstream player who would buy it would get bewildered/annoyed/frustrated very quickly and that'd give Command bad reputation. $80 price tag will ensure that only those who want it buy it.



mikmykWS -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/26/2014 5:01:13 PM)

We'll let you know how it goes!

Renamed the string as the title made it look too much like an announcement from us.

thanks



navwarcol -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/26/2014 5:37:04 PM)

I agree with the above sentiment. Pricing "high" will ensure that a lot of people interested in an arcade game do not buy it.



Casinn -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/26/2014 6:37:04 PM)

You can always drop a price later, raising it is a bit problematic. :)



Schnaufer -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/28/2014 10:13:36 AM)

Price on Steam is too high. They do not get a printed manual.
I bought it here, did not enjoy, but that's my fault.

Have a good day



tommo8993 -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/28/2014 12:08:56 PM)

I agree its way too high half of the discussions on steam are about the price, I know its a "premium" wargame but steam is not a premium store.

Is it not better to sell 2 copies at £30 than one at £60?



chrisol -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/28/2014 2:40:31 PM)

I'm struggling to see how anyone would pay $300 million for this - not even got 3-d graphics. I guess it does have multi-monitor support.

Chris

(ref here: Buying Aegis )



[image]local://upfiles/27809/35BA3571A2CF48E4B5DD64C0F6419E02.jpg[/image]



VFA41_Lion -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/28/2014 5:59:21 PM)

Reading the discussions in the steam forum makes me glad the price is keeping some of these children away D:



hellfish6 -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/28/2014 6:03:13 PM)

Anytime I talk to someone about Command, the conversation goes "I'd love to play it, but I won't spend that much on a game..."

I'm happy I paid what I did, but it's hard to convince those guys on the fence - especially without a demo.

Maybe in a few month's we'll see a midweek madness and Xmas sale on Steam, where the game is 75% off or something.



mikmykWS -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/28/2014 6:30:32 PM)

Our sales there have been great[:)] So doesn't appear to be an issue.

Mike



chemkid -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/28/2014 6:30:36 PM)

.



hellfish6 -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/28/2014 6:40:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mikmyk

Our sales there have been great[:)] So doesn't appear to be an issue.

Mike


I'm very happy to hear that!

Hopefully a lot of new scenarios to play will be coming in...



Rosseau -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/28/2014 7:04:56 PM)

People at Steam are paying $60 right now for TW Rome 2 EE edition - from a company (CA) that screwed them on the game the first time. As I've mentioned on the Steam forum myself, the hundreds of free user scenarios and thousands of images that can be downloaded make the $60 sale a must-do if you liked Harpoon but hated the terrible design and interface.

I also downloaded the free Global Blue game, but it's just not CMANO. That kind of quality will never be free.



rwenstrup -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/28/2014 7:36:00 PM)

Steam wants to get greater exposure into the war game niche...and war game producers want to get the greater exposure Steam provides. Seems like there is the need to market war games to wargamers on Steam...they will pay the price for a top notch game. A marketing niche needs to be defined, promoted and supported...then the pricing issue will go away. To price to the existing Steam base for shooters would be a mistake...just saying...

...used to do this stuff...



imadot -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/29/2014 1:30:31 AM)

Well right now its $60 bucks on Steam....[;)]




Marder -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/29/2014 7:26:25 AM)

Thanks for the steam-release.
Do i have to download the database addons and descriptions or they are part of patch 1.05?



TupeT -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/29/2014 4:37:35 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marder2075

Thanks for the steam-release.
Do i have to download the database addons and descriptions or they are part of patch 1.05?



Yes, you need to download the pictures and descriptions separately.

And first post for me :) long time lurker, bought the Steam version and that seems to be the best game purchase for me in a while.



rsallen64 -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/29/2014 4:58:41 PM)

I bought it on steam because of the price, and because many of my games are on steam as well (To End All Wars, Civil War II, etc.). I've wanted this game for quite some time, but couldn't afford it. I think the steam option will open it up to people like me. As for the people who were expecting a beer and pretzels type game, they obviously didn't actually look at it before buying, so I say too bad. I knew what I was getting into, and am very happy with what I got.[:D]

My only concern is that I would like to register it on Matrix, for access to the members only forum, etc., but Steam does not give me a key to enable me to do that.



pdanders -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/30/2014 2:20:48 PM)

I'm not surprised sales on Steam are great; I buy almost all my games via Steam and seeing this game released there at a bit lower price pushed me over the edge and I certainly don't regret it. The game is great, and I think many people here are exaggerating how "complicated" it is. Sure the simulation aspect is very sophisticated, but the UI is very good and the game is IMO easier to pick up than Harpoon even though it's quite a bit more complex and full featured. Games like Hearts of Iron and Europa Universalis sell very well and they are IMO much more difficult to get into than CMANO with much more vexing interfaces.

A lot of pricing is emotional. Even though $60 and $80 don't seem that different they are IMO perceived very differently by the average game consumer. $60 is a standard price for a top tier newly released game, and seeing CMANO at that price doesn't "feel" overly expensive or out of place. However the $80 price really jumps out at you because almost no games are priced that high (although if you count DLC many games go for more, but again most people don't think that way) and people have an emotional response that the price is unreasonable.

I think you guys were very smart to go in at $60 on Steam, I honestly don't think you would have any more sales at lower price points until you reach the $40 dollar range (which is the next "jump" that game consumers will perceive as a meaningful price difference)

I'm really glad to see Matrix experimenting at least a little bit with some different pricing and distribution ideas. I honestly don't think many of these games are as "niche" as people think they are and I think sales of CMANO will bear that out.




TupeT -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/30/2014 6:09:32 PM)

Couldn't agree more with pdanders. One reason I was put off from buying Command Ops: Bulge when it came out really was the pricing. Same thing with CMANO. 60$ really is a lot less than 80$ mentally. Around 50 euros used to be the norm for new games years ago, and I payed few euros over 50 for this in Steam. 70-80 euros, on the other hand, would be way too much.

I'm happy as well that Matrix is trying new strategies when it comes to distribution and pricing.



magi -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/30/2014 7:22:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mikmyk

Our sales there have been great[:)] So doesn't appear to be an issue.

Mike


the game is not priced to high...... the database is worth two-three times the price of the game....
the game is simply not for the mean group of computers gamers... it takes a certain level of time and intellectual dedication to play CMANO...... unfortunately most people are intellectually lazy..... this is the same reason, generally people are so poorly informed on any given issue.... its unfortunate but just the way it is.......



magi -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (9/30/2014 7:30:20 PM)

you know.... reading these posts.... this is great news for you Matrix guys..... good for you.....



solops -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (10/1/2014 1:58:07 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: magi

the game is not priced to high...... the database is worth two-three times the price of the game....
the game is simply not for the mean group of computers gamers... it takes a certain level of time and intellectual dedication to play CMANO...... unfortunately most people are intellectually lazy..... this is the same reason, generally people are so poorly informed on any given issue.... its unfortunate but just the way it is.......



+1



VilleYrjola -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (10/1/2014 2:25:27 PM)

I honestly think that Steam forums should be shut down for this game and many others. They draw a lot of people who have absolutely nothing to add to the community and all they do is whine and troll. A link to this forum should suffice. I hope from the bottom of my heart that the devs don't pay any attention to that landfill and keep doing things the way they are doing them now. For example Kerbal Space Program's dev cycle has slowed after each update. It was not like that before Steam release. After weeks of groaning and moaning on the Steam forums developers decided to drop some hugely anticipated features in favor of smaller ones that would've been done down the line eventually. The reason for this was (or it seemed to be) hordes of people who didn't know what they were getting into and started demanding mundane things so loudly that features that the game so desperately needed are still yet to be delivered.

People who actually have something useful to say will find their way here and open up on the issues they find pressing. Steam trolls won't bother and stay quite happily where they are.

Sorry for the possible typos, writing with iPad isn't the easiest thing out there.



Feltan -> RE: WOTY Steam Release (10/1/2014 3:38:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rosmarus

I honestly think that Steam forums should be shut down for this game and many others. They draw a lot of people who have absolutely nothing to add to the community and all they do is whine and troll. A link to this forum should suffice. I hope from the bottom of my heart that the devs don't pay any attention to that landfill and keep doing things the way they are doing them now. For example Kerbal Space Program's dev cycle has slowed after each update. It was not like that before Steam release. After weeks of groaning and moaning on the Steam forums developers decided to drop some hugely anticipated features in favor of smaller ones that would've been done down the line eventually. The reason for this was (or it seemed to be) hordes of people who didn't know what they were getting into and started demanding mundane things so loudly that features that the game so desperately needed are still yet to be delivered.

People who actually have something useful to say will find their way here and open up on the issues they find pressing. Steam trolls won't bother and stay quite happily where they are.

Sorry for the possible typos, writing with iPad isn't the easiest thing out there.


In my opinion, your post is spot on correct.

We will see, and are seeing, a decided up-tick in visitors to these forums. I suspect many if not most are new buyers via Steam, and that is a very good thing for the product.

However, it is not without a potential downside as you point out. While a healthy percentage of new players will completely understand this game, there is inevitably going to be a small but vocal minority that won't be satisfied until CMANO looks like a game of boats and planes set in a My Little Pony environment. And once they get want they want, or not, that's the last you'll see of them.

I am optimistic that the "Steam Trolls" as you call them won't last on these forums; equally optimistic that the obtuse requests will end up in the bit bucket where they belong.

Regards,
Feltan



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