RE: "deep" amphibious landings too easy (Full Version)

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ratprince -> RE: "deep" amphibious landings too easy (12/17/2014 3:52:53 PM)

What does that statement mean Smirf?



MisterBoats -> RE: "deep" amphibious landings too easy (12/17/2014 5:35:32 PM)

I'm encouraged by your success, Mike. I don't see much of a downside, logistically, in supplying from Brest rather than Cherbourg. I think the key is to keep a narrow front and focus on one axis of attack, rather than three or four.



marion61 -> RE: "deep" amphibious landings too easy (12/17/2014 6:33:51 PM)

I prefer to invade anywhere but Normandy. I look for an area that is easily exploitable by armored units and the bocage is not. The other thing I tend to do is spread my invasions out more, and find ports that I can easily isolate with paratroopers. If you've planned properly, you can land where ever you want within air cover range and since there aren't that many combat units that can attack you on the turn after your landing, and if your air cover has been doing it's job, there won't be many attacks on anyone beach. Just make sure those follow on forces, especially armor, are sitting out at sea waiting to move a hex and then land. Axis doesn't have enough decent divisions to have a good line everywhere when you spread them out. Just my two cents.



mariandavid -> RE: "deep" amphibious landings too easy (12/17/2014 7:57:16 PM)

I have carefully read all the comments and, in all honesty, have not changed my mind. The trouble is that although the Bay of Biscay is an obvious landing target it was never taken seriously by the planners for the most obvious of reasons - supply. Sending transports to a landing point(for example north of Bordeaux), one from which fighters could not fly without continuous gasoline supply, open to attacks from everywhere from Brest to Bayonne would - in the real world - be exceedingly risky.

I am not saying that the game should prohibit attacks outside fighter cover (though I cannot think of a major landing that was not) but that the penalty should be severe, very severe, in terms of losses inflicted through naval attrition. It might make the game more challenging also against the AI.



Panzeh -> RE: "deep" amphibious landings too easy (12/17/2014 9:07:29 PM)

I don't think we know how bad it would have been. The Allies were rather risk-averse in their amphibious operations, but that was not inevitable, in my opinion.



marion61 -> RE: "deep" amphibious landings too easy (12/17/2014 9:35:55 PM)

I didn't mean I invaded outside of air cover. That would be a disaster in the making if the axis has enough planes. I'm just saying that with the proper planning, and you have air cover, you can land from Brest to The Netherlands and be reasonably sure of success. Invasions are your most potent tool to win, and if you take a big risk like no air cover and it doesn't work, then you probably just lost the game. The WA's can't really afford to mess up too badly on an invasion or they get too far behind. The good thing about this game is that you can do what you want, ever after listening to all our opinions [;)].

And I believe they are looking into the effectiveness of naval interdiction when ships pass thru the hexes. It does seem a bit light, even when you pass thru heavily contested hexes.



Gorforlin -> RE: "deep" amphibious landings too easy (12/17/2014 9:49:40 PM)

Your talking vs AI not a person.

1. A most ports will be garrisoned and have tons of supplies. Not an easy nut to crack = Messina
2. A good German player will have whatever lvl bombers and some fighters in south center France to hit whatever your tring to land.
3. Germans only need 6 good divisions to drop a small invasion, if it does not have a port in 2 or 3 turns. Divisions require engineers and HQ's heavy artillery and rockets. Army HQ/AG HQ and OKH withen 5 hexes.
4. May 44 Germans have 20 more divisions then turn 20, 5 more panzer divisions and 9 brigades.

If you don't take that port withen 2 turns your invasion will be toast without air cover and from my game airborne
unit are not a sure thing. -35 VP's if you lose it and they are easy to lose.

AI will get better, but test your theory's vs people, much more interesting.

All good stuff. I hope to start playing allies soon, tring to master German side of things seems more of challenge.



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