Worth picking up? (Full Version)

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gravyface_ -> Worth picking up? (12/28/2014 1:00:58 AM)

Played Commander: Europe at War and Strategic Command 2 within the same genre, but wondering if this is worth picking up in comparison of those two games, both of which have their strengths and weaknesses.




gwgardner -> RE: Worth picking up? (12/28/2014 3:37:58 AM)

I've played both Strategic Command 2 and ToF, and like the latter better. If you go into the forum settings and look back in the AARs thread for ToF a couple of years or more, you can find several of my old AARs describing how much I love ToF.

In my opinion it's the best operational level WW2 wargame available right now covering the whole of the war in Europe.

It has some flaws, but they are correctable with some simple mods. Even without modding however, it's a great game.



gravyface_ -> RE: Worth picking up? (12/29/2014 2:24:57 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: gwgardner

I've played both Strategic Command 2 and ToF, and like the latter better. If you go into the forum settings and look back in the AARs thread for ToF a couple of years or more, you can find several of my old AARs describing how much I love ToF.

In my opinion it's the best operational level WW2 wargame available right now covering the whole of the war in Europe.

It has some flaws, but they are correctable with some simple mods. Even without modding however, it's a great game.


Interesting. What makes it stand out over SC2?



Rasputitsa -> RE: Worth picking up? (12/29/2014 1:40:44 PM)

I have enjoyed ToF a lot, I have never played SC2, so cannot comment.

ToF has the right scale to play the whole European Theatre, with enough detail to be interesting, but not so much that you drown in detail, or need forever to play. Much of ToF is abstracted, especially the Naval aspects, there is a lot you can do if you want, but many things are left to the game system.

The games plays at the level of Corps and Division, so you don't need to wade through hundreds of units each turn, but units can be split and/or merged, so that you can work down to units the size of a battlegroup/regiment. Which is pretty good for a game covering the Atlantic to the Urals and Norway to the Sahara.

ToF is capable of producing quite historic results, but is not in a timeline straight-jacket, so the unexpected can happen, it depends on your attitude, as to whether this makes a fantasy game, or adds to the challenge. What would happen if you invaded Spain, or Sweden (impossible, or intriguing ???).

There are some problems and bugs in the game, much of which is in scenario design, some scenarios are better than others. That's the down-side, the up-side is that there are fixes for most of the problems, which can be applied with small adjustments, or mods, in the game files.

You may not want to fiddle with the game, but at least it is possible, because with many other games you may not like some of the design decisions, but you are stuck with them, in ToF they can be easily modified.

One example is that, at times, a nation may suffer a drastic fall in PP level for no apparent reason (Production Points being the currency of the game), the F12 function opens a game box where you can reset the PP level for the nation in play. Annoying, unnecessary, unacceptable, maybe, but an easy fix is available.

Developer Support seems to have faded, so what you see is probably as far as the game will go.

The short answer is that ToF can be very good, but you might have to work on it to get the best result, the forum contains the discussion on mods, pleased to help if you need more detail. [:)]



gwgardner -> RE: Worth picking up? (12/29/2014 2:38:21 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: gravyface_



Interesting. What makes it stand out over SC2?


First let me say I enjoyed SC2. I like TOF better for many reasons:

1) overall, I've always wanted the look and feel of the greatest boardgame I ever played, which was the old table-top War in Europe by SSI (1970s?). ToF comes closest to that with an AI.

2) uses hexes instead of the diamonds - SC2's diamonds are an abomination

3) More traditional combat/movement factors on counters with ToF

4) supply rules in ToF are intuitive and sensible; with SC2 I was sometimes scratching my head to figure it out.

5) somewhat lower level scale, with divisions and corps, as opposed to the amorphous units in SC2.

5) I love the way air power works in ToF, especially when using my very own reduced cost mini-mod. In TOF, with one mouse click the player can get an overall visual apparaisal of the power of one side's air power vs the the other, making rebasing sensible and easy. Air power can be the determining factor strategically in some instances, as it was historically.

6) blitzkrieg can me modeled well in ToF

7) I've played Barbarossa in ToF probably 10-15 times, and there are so many ways to vary it offensively and defensively.

and so on



gravyface_ -> RE: Worth picking up? (12/30/2014 11:30:16 AM)

Took the plunge; $10 on Steam. Spent more on bad drive-thru dinners [:D]

Noticed that Rasp and yourself have been busy with the constant files; have you guys put together a definitive list of changes that you now play with? Has anyone tried to contact the devs and see if they could comment/document the constants files?



Rasputitsa -> RE: Worth picking up? (12/30/2014 2:20:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: gravyface_

Took the plunge; $10 on Steam. Spent more on bad drive-thru dinners [:D]

Noticed that Rasp and yourself have been busy with the constant files; have you guys put together a definitive list of changes that you now play with? Has anyone tried to contact the devs and see if they could comment/document the constants files?


The devs have not responded to comments and requests on game issues recently.

I have been attempting to put together a pack of info sheets on consts.ini and GUI changes, but these have been a personal quest to improve the game in play against the AI, initially I did not intend to create a mod, so the choices are not necessarily what others may need. I am happy to share and discuss any features that you may find useful.

This AAR shows how my game looks :

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3655595

The GUI changes are to match this choice of map and unit icons, again a personal choice, which may not suit others, but there are features which make the game easier to play, such as reducing the size of the info boxes and transparent combat info boxes, so that you can see more of the map and follow the action better.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3006547

Set forum - Display topics from last: All Topics, some of this stuff goes waaaay back.

All of this is achieved with simple editing of data and values in the game files, but can deliver big improvements. [:)]



gravyface_ -> RE: Worth picking up? (12/30/2014 2:25:43 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Rasputitsa


quote:

ORIGINAL: gravyface_

Took the plunge; $10 on Steam. Spent more on bad drive-thru dinners [:D]

Noticed that Rasp and yourself have been busy with the constant files; have you guys put together a definitive list of changes that you now play with? Has anyone tried to contact the devs and see if they could comment/document the constants files?


The devs have not responded to comments and requests on game issues recently.

I have been attempting to put together a pack of info sheets on consts.ini and GUI changes, but these have been a personal quest to improve the game in play against the AI, initially I did not intend to create a mod, so the choices are not necessarily what others may need. I am happy to share and discuss any features that you may find useful.

This AAR shows how my game looks :

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3655595

The GUI changes are to match this choice of map and unit icons, again a personal choice, which may not suit others, but there are features which make the game easier to play, such as reducing the size of the info boxes and transparent combat info boxes, so that you can see more of the map and follow the action better.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3006547

Set forum - Display topics from last: All Topics, some of this stuff goes waaaay back.

All of this is achieved with simple editing of data and values in the game files, but can deliver big improvements. [:)]


Please do put that together (and maybe we can have it stickied). I'm more than comfortable modifying files and values (I was a programmer in a past life), so am looking forward to seeing what else we can uncover to improve the gameplay.



Tomokatu -> RE: Worth picking up? (1/1/2015 4:42:00 AM)

I have had some experience in writing IT technical manuals and operating instructions.
If I can help with organising and proofing the documentation please contact me and ask. I have samples of House Rules from RtV if you'd like to assess my work.



Rasputitsa -> RE: Worth picking up? (1/2/2015 8:01:48 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tomokatu

I have had some experience in writing IT technical manuals and operating instructions.
If I can help with organising and proofing the documentation please contact me and ask. I have samples of House Rules from RtV if you'd like to assess my work.


PM sent.[:)]



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