RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (Full Version)

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whoofe -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/23/2015 3:49:18 PM)

i did mention that in post #4 :p



Mickrocks201 -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 1:29:02 AM)

I just stopped caring about the VPs - since the new release 1.00.11b you get less VP for cities, and the Axis AI is staring to do a better job garrisoning cities with strong German units, which means, in 43 you have to attack them with "OTHERS" to reduce and capture places like Salerno, Naples, Taranto and even now Messina. I like that the AI is not rolling over so much. I guess I could invest these cities and plug them with Navel HQs, etc.... but I needed the ports stat and can't waste too much time before bad weather.

Then when I start moving Brit Corps back to England in early 44 I lose transports all over the place even though I got the Axis pushed up in the Gothic line north of Livorno. I ship em out thru Naples (total hex control), but take 10-17 "OTHER" VP losses (a bit excessive in my book). I don't understand the VP system in terms of how it good metric for success. I just want to get to Berlin as fast as possible. I figure if I can take Berlin with any sort of positive score that is fine. I can understand preservation of forces, but the current system makes you not want to attack at all unless you got great odds, which doesn't make for many break thru/exploits in Norther Europe where you have to move before 6 months of bad weather stall you. Plus, just when you think you got great odds it turns out you don't for a myriad of factors (failed checks, defensive reserves, etc.) So it it is just "oh well" when you try to do the right thing and still lose 15-20 VPs for losses.



NotOneStepBack -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 2:41:57 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mickrocks

I just stopped caring about the VPs - since the new release 1.00.11b you get less VP for cities, and the Axis AI is staring to do a better job garrisoning cities with strong German units, which means, in 43 you have to attack them with "OTHERS" to reduce and capture places like Salerno, Naples, Taranto and even now Messina. I like that the AI is not rolling over so much. I guess I could invest these cities and plug them with Navel HQs, etc.... but I needed the ports stat and can't waste too much time before bad weather.

Then when I start moving Brit Corps back to England in early 44 I lose transports all over the place even though I got the Axis pushed up in the Gothic line north of Livorno. I ship em out thru Naples (total hex control), but take 10-17 "OTHER" VP losses (a bit excessive in my book). I don't understand the VP system in terms of how it good metric for success. I just want to get to Berlin as fast as possible. I figure if I can take Berlin with any sort of positive score that is fine. I can understand preservation of forces, but the current system makes you not want to attack at all unless you got great odds, which doesn't make for many break thru/exploits in Norther Europe where you have to move before 6 months of bad weather stall you. Plus, just when you think you got great odds it turns out you don't for a myriad of factors (failed checks, defensive reserves, etc.) So it it is just "oh well" when you try to do the right thing and still lose 15-20 VPs for losses.



This is exactly right. For the Allied player it is Berlin or bust in the current VP system. And Berlin is highly unlikely when the player can pull anything from the East at will.



marion61 -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 2:47:47 AM)

[/quote]


This is exactly right. For the Allied player it is Berlin or bust in the current VP system. And Berlin is highly unlikely when the player can pull anything from the East at will.
[/quote]

+1 I concur whole heartedly. Or you could instill some penalty for withdrawing units from the east. If it cost a vp to take units out of the east front box that would make you think twice about pulling units to the west



Jakerson -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 11:01:23 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mickrocks
Then when I start moving Brit Corps back to England in early 44 I lose transports all over the place even though I got the Axis pushed up in the Gothic line north of Livorno. I ship em out thru Naples (total hex control), but take 10-17 "OTHER" VP losses (a bit excessive in my book). I don't understand the VP system in terms of how it good metric for success.


This is why you need to put plane squadrons doing naval only missions if you dont even those hexes that dont have axis interdiction turn to contested hexes. Where axis line is going do not matter in this.

After I put proper planes in naval missions and avoided hexes that are contested I havent lost a transport.



LiquidSky -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 1:27:11 PM)



You'd think that Gibraltar would have some sort of patrol out to help your poor transports though..you know, being so close and all.



Mickrocks201 -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 2:11:45 PM)

In my case, I had the bulk of the coastal AF in southern Sardinia I figure that was a good centralized location where I could have my air groups and keep them close to the air hq. So, I need to leave a force in Africa and Sicily too? A lot of attention to detail for something that is pretty abstract (naval movement transport losses).

It would be nice if you got a report instead of just hearing that transport 9 was sunk , something detailing exactly what happen showing attracting and defending forces and losses. I always wondered why I would take no so many OTHER VP losses when I wsnt attacking. There is nothing to connect the fact that transport 9 cost me 8 VP. It wasn't until I started reading this thread that it finally dawned on me. Once again....oh well!



Smirfy -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 2:51:20 PM)


Yup lot of micromanagement for an abstract feature. In my game I had numbers everywhere except one bit and guess were my transports auto went through. Got to the stage were you have to manually move them :(



Numdydar -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 2:53:32 PM)

Well for anyone coming from playing WitP manually moving TR TFs is not an issue [:D]



HMSWarspite -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 2:56:29 PM)

Smirfy, they have ready said they are looking at transport losses. Enemy spaces aren't the only place they get a chance to kill you. Any very long move will kill them occasionally. I lose one every now and then but not my major source of lost points. Took my eye off V weapons while I invaded France and lost 13 points in a turn. Will take a couple of turns to beat that in to shape! And exclusively my fault



marion61 -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 3:05:22 PM)

If you've seen Gibraltar, you would know there's no way an airstrip could be made on that rock, and the Spanish own everything around it, and Spain at the time was leaning towards Germany.



RedLancer -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 3:12:03 PM)

The Gibraltar airfield was built in WW2 and was home to 200 Group RAF / AHQ Gibraltar.



marion61 -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 4:33:02 PM)

You probably are right, but when I went thru Gibraltar several times in my life, and I don't see where they could put an airfield on that rock. I'll have to look it up, and it's not that I doubt you, I just like to be sure I'm wrong lol.



Smirfy -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 5:52:48 PM)

There is an airfield on Gibralter, General Sikorski's plane (Liberator) famously crashed on take off killing him. Also Sunderland flyboats were based in the harbour.



marion61 -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 6:22:25 PM)

See! I learn something new everyday!



Baelfiin -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/25/2015 8:32:53 PM)

Do not underestimate the power of the Light Side . . . . . .

[image]local://upfiles/20920/6932E4D95CE14E4AB28B38A3DD3287B6.jpg[/image]



Mickrocks201 -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/26/2015 1:59:52 PM)

Actually there is a road that runs right thru the airfield on Gibraltar they have to stop traffic when planes land and take off. I think I know this from watching discovery channel. Worlds strangest airports or something like that. Also had the airport in St Maartins where the 747s land a few yards from a beach full of sun bathers.

I took the advice of basing patrol planes in Africa and Sicily .... Still am losing transport... Have 2 and 3 most places , but a few with 1's. Guess I need more coverage.



Seminole -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/26/2015 2:47:57 PM)

quote:

I went thru Gibraltar several times in my life, and I don't see where they could put an airfield on that rock.


[image]http://i.imgur.com/hQGijPW.gif[/image]



LiquidSky -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/26/2015 2:50:13 PM)

1's are as useful/useless as none. You need two or better to stop the non existent axis interdiction from sinking part of a ship.

As for Gibraltar I always thought its value in projecting sea power was in its port, not its airfield. Although if they want they can have multiple airfields by just bringing Carriers.



marion61 -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/26/2015 3:07:47 PM)

I guess I should have paid closer attention, and I never got to go up to the top. I never realized there was an airfield there.



HMSWarspite -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/26/2015 5:04:40 PM)

Back to transport losses, I rarely lose any. But the key is leave patrol a/c all along the coast as Baelfin showed. In fact, even though still playing the AI, I practice all sorts of good habits... NF in UK not all in BC, Coastal command a/c all round UK (you don't need to concentrate them/move them elsewhere anyway), etc



reg113 -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/27/2015 7:41:53 PM)

The Gibraltar air field is not at the top. It is on the Spain side of The Rock just a couple of feet above the bay..



gmsitton -> RE: Transport is SUNK!!!! (1/27/2015 9:22:36 PM)

If you turn battle sites on, you can see where Axis air attacked transports. The defense usually just shows 40mm AA gun, but you can see what planes attacked. I was getting pestered by a dozen LW Italian made aircraft escorted by FWs. I bombed the airfields I suspected they were hiding out at and killed ten of them.



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