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Drongo -> (3/13/2003 1:49:08 PM)

Posted by Medicinman
[QUOTE]I have noticed when watching a FOW air to air battle when the attacker fires at range then defender goes red is usually a kill, when the defender continues with red and red and red without a RANGE number those appear to not count in air loses daily report (I key).[/QUOTE]

I would agree with your assesment. After doing beta testing on the air combat, I found that an air to air attack message followed by multiple red kills (without a pause) represents only one kill (or very rarely, just a damaged a/c). Don't know what causes it, maybe the pilot forgot to take his thumb off the button.


Posted by Hard Sarge
[QUOTE]I think I am going to uninstall the game and redownload the patch, if others were seeing what I am seeing they would be screaming, but since they are not, it must be my game[/QUOTE]
Mate,

Go ahead if you need to be sure but I can confirm I've seen the same type of results as you are seeing, during my various 2.30 air battles (but it does vary).

Depending on the circumstances, the A6Ms can reek havoc with early allied land based fighters. The F4Fs can get ripped up as well but overall, they'll tend to come out only slightly inferior, thanks to their better quality pilots. As you said, the P-38s will do better than the Jap fighters, but not much better unless the pilots are at least good (70+).

Be aware that there is more emphasis on pilot quality difference in 2.30 combat results. The allies are a pretty bland mob at the start. My rule of thumb with the UV air results is that everything will balance out in time, even if you feel the P-40 was never historically outfought to the extent your seeing.

Re : Air Combat Display - In terms of watching the combat display, when you see an a/c "hit", it can be relied upon to mean just that. What you can't rely on is whether the aircraft was actually destroyed, despite what is shown on the screen. A hit of any type on an enemy aircraft will simply mean that you have inflicted damage.

Re : AAR's - this is more accurate than the combat display in determining a/c destroyed (although not 100%) but be wary of the damaged totals as they represent the total hits on aircraft, not total aircraft hit and damaged (ie If an a/c is hit 3 times, it will show as 3 damaged a/c).

Re : Squadron kill figures - These are 100% accurate and will include not only those aircraft shot down in combat but also those crashing on the return flight (but only if they were damaged by the squadron) or being shot down by Flak after being damaged during the air combat. The squadron kill figures means how many aircraft that the squadron "hit" that then failed to return to base. Pilot kill scores are based on the same method.

The figures shown in the aircraft losses table of the Intelligence Display Screen are also 100% accurate.

Hope this info helps.

Cheers




Hard Sarge -> (3/13/2003 6:22:40 PM)

Hi David B
well in my game I was talking about (uninstalled the whole thing, so don't have it anymore)

all the JP fighters were coming from Rebaul (which was the other hassle, every raid was 84+ Zeros and 3 to 15 Bombers)

which I think what I was seeing was more Morale based, but the hassle is, for what ever reason, my Cats never picked there morale back up, pull them from the battle and let them sit for a week and morale only would get back to 50%, fly them back and Fat is already 20-30+ next day put them on Cap and there Morale is shot, noticed that the P-40's didn't do that, they seemed to stay high, the 39's, well, if they got kills it stayed up, if they didn't it was in the 50's

but I still can't see a well rested Cat group of 4 Squadrons jumping 30 Zeros, and loseing 10-15 planes to 1 Zero (FOW off)

maybe in my game, the Cats were not getting the kills they needed to keep there morale up, and with out the morale, they wern't getting the kills

Hi Mman
yea I was seeing that too, one part that was strange though, you would, 5 or 6 planes go red in a row, or destoryed just flash on the screen over and over again, I also don't count that now, but most times it happens, one pilot gets a lot of kills that mission ?

I have been watching the air battles more now, and looks like a lot of times, the whole fighter group was breaking off, which stinks when one plane is damaged and 24 planes break off, worst one was when 16 planes bounced a undefend Nell group, first plane in was damaged, so the whole pack broke off and went home, while the Nells finished there bomb run

Hi Drongo
LOL now you reply :)

still think my game was screwed up, the AI will attack me now, in the game I was talking about, it would not (I could sit out side the port, with a 3 CV TF and just pick off ships as they left port and the AI would do nothing, and it had (recon ?) 140 some fighters and at least 80 bombers there, I was only getting some 45-50 fighters up on Cap)

even if you feel the P-40 was never historically outfought to the extent your seeing. ?
don't have a hassle with the P-40's, my Cats are getting slaughtered, the P-40 was all but holding it's own, in fact, had to move all of them from PM over to Lunga to give the Cats a break, and they ended up breaking the Attack on Lunga, and like I said, they were a good day, bad day, type of deal (still, in the first two months, I never had a battle that I shot down more then 2 Zeros, the 3rd month I nailed 3 once, in the 4th, I had a big day and nailed 5 (rooks ?, replacements?)

towards the end, I even started t

o pull my fighters off of the bases, the AI only had 6 bombers in the area, it was losing as many Zeros if I fought him as if I didn't

reinstalled the game and went to a different Scen, 13 instead of 14 (later war, the map looked interesting)
and I am still seeing some of the same thing, only it is with the 38 now, the 39 will get hammered and then return the favor, a real bomber buster, so end of day, tend to lose 10-15 of them, but they do damage back, the 38 gets attacked and they break off, the F4u is Hog Heaven (still, Morale looks to be the key, got 1 killer unit, and they got high Morale and kills, the other 3, are in the 50% for morale and have to be shut down for rest, and have low kills totals, so think they fed off of each other, to stick in battle and get kills, you need morale, to get morale and stay on Cap/excourt, you need kills)

HARD_Sarge




Yamamoto -> (3/13/2003 11:17:20 PM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Drongo
[B]The figures shown in the aircraft losses table of the Intelligence Display Screen are also 100% accurate.


[/B][/QUOTE]


Yes and I really wish they would change that. What's the point of Fog of War if you can just flip over to another screen and get 100% accurate results. Why not give 100% accurate results for ships too? It should be a lot easier to tell when a ship sinks than when a plane is destroyed flying home after a battle.

Yamamoto




Hard Sarge -> (3/13/2003 11:44:25 PM)

Well, I could see, removing being able to tell what the lost planes were, until the end of the game (for the bad guys)

I mean, I don't think I have ever changed my plans based on seeing that 10 planes were shot down yesterday

see it now, oh man, shot down 10 planes, dumb pilots, thought I had nailed 12 of them, well, that is it, call the Adm, and tell him to turn around and get back into port, until I know them 2 planes are down, I not going anywhere out on the open seas

can kind of see where planes lost when a ship goes down, should be counted as OP or Combat losses, but in the long run, you still got to guess

oh boy, big battle today, really hammered them Kates before they knew I was there, I just know I hurt that CV and Cvl, hehe and that CS sure got snookered when it tried to leave Rebaul, hmmmm, 17 planes were destroyed on the ground, hmmm, was the CV or the Cvl going down ?, yuck, sure hope I see that CS still floating, hate to be chasing a sunk ship, when it not sunk yet !

oh well, I think we still need it, but maybe put it back on another screen, in case other people don't want to see it when they open up the info page

HARD_Sarge




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