Moving infantry (Full Version)

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vbmark -> Moving infantry (4/7/2001 2:54:00 AM)

Hello, The manual says, "Moving infantry only one hex confers considerable benefits to defense and spotting. Moving more than one hex makes it much more vulnerable to spotting and fire." Does this mean one hex per turn? Or does it mean I can click one hex away each time for as far as I can go on a turn? Thanks.



Panzer Capta -> (4/7/2001 3:09:00 AM)

One hex at a time is akin to "cautious movement". Take you full allotment of movement (or however many you wish), but move the unit one hex at a time. It doesnt mean moving only one hex per turn (although that would likely be cautious too, but you would unlikely be much of participant). Panzer Captain.



DoubleDeuce -> (4/7/2001 3:20:00 AM)

I usually see how far my total movement would take me (according to the highlighted movement area). I then see where the best route would be keeping close to woods, buildings if possible. Then I move one hex at a time until I spot something or trigger enemy op-fire. I can then jump into a nearby hex that offers some cover depending on what happens during the move. If my unit survives any ambushes!



AJVa -> (4/7/2001 3:24:00 AM)

quote:

Originally posted by vbmark: Hello, The manual says, "Moving infantry only one hex confers considerable benefits to defense and spotting. Moving more than one hex makes it much more vulnerable to spotting and fire." Does this mean one hex per turn? Or does it mean I can click one hex away each time for as far as I can go on a turn? Thanks.
One hex/turn = crawl; full movement, even if done step by step, means your grunts are running (in pace if done by clickin every single hex in their path ;) ) . So the answer is hex/turn.



vbmark -> (4/7/2001 3:24:00 AM)

quote:

Originally posted by Double Deuce: I usually see how far my total movement would take me (according to the highlighted movement area). I then see where the best route would be keeping close to woods, buildings if possible. Then I move one hex at a time until I spot something or trigger enemy op-fire. I can then jump into a nearby hex that offers some cover depending on what happens during the move. If my unit survives any ambushes!
I like that idea. Thanks.



AJVa -> (4/7/2001 4:58:00 AM)

Darn, just when I thought I had this movement & spotting thing figured out. Saw the replys and had to do some testing. What I previously thought was that the movement and speed of the unit were linked (farther u go faster u move), thus making units moving several hexes more easily spotted. What I found out was that sometimes when a infantry unit moved as far as it could it ended up having speed of 2mph and on other occasions 3-7mph ( terrain and number of hexes moved were equal unit was the same ). When unit ( german rifle sqd ) had end speed of 2 mph it was quite hard to spot ( spotter was allso german rifle squad ), but when speed exceded 4 mph it was almost allways spotted. This leaves me confused. What determines the speed a infantry unit ends up after moving severel hexes? Experience check maybe?... cause I noticed that while moving hex by hex, unit's speed sometimes decreased. Sorry for typos & poor grammar, am a Finn whith rusty english (finnlish). :rolleyes: Oh and thanks in advance for enlightening answers. :)



AJVa -> (4/7/2001 5:54:00 AM)

Did some more testing and noticed that you could pick preferred speed for your infantry units ( everytime using full movement ) by repeatedly moving and clicking undo until the speed is right. Weird stealth-cheat ( that is if speed and stealthines are reversely correlated ). :confused:



vbmark -> (4/7/2001 8:52:00 AM)

quote:

Originally posted by AJVa: Did some more testing and noticed that you could pick preferred speed for your infantry units ( everytime using full movement ) by repeatedly moving and clicking undo until the speed is right. Weird stealth-cheat ( that is if speed and stealthines are reversely correlated ). :confused:
So does the speed have a correlation with the concept that, "Moving infantry only one hex confers considerable benefits to defense and spotting."?



Warrior -> (4/7/2001 10:04:00 AM)

Only problem with moving one hex at a time, with infantry or vehicles, is that it decreases your move radius. Me, I like to go full bore and only stop when shot at.



Kluckenbill -> (4/7/2001 10:17:00 AM)

I always thought it meant 1 hex per turn, but based on AJVa's test I guess I was wrong. This should certainly help speed up my grunts in the attack.



Flashfyre -> (4/7/2001 1:31:00 PM)

An interesting sidenote to this is that of minefields and movement. Currently playing a beach assault, and I have noticed that by only moving my US squads 1 hex (into a known mine hex) per turn, they seem to survive with no casualties. Crossed 3 minefield hexes, in a row, this way with almost 2 whole companies. Notice the almost.....when I tried to move more than 1 hex/turn through a known minefield and a supposed clear hex, they found the clear one to be mined as well. (BOOM! 2 casualties from mines. :mad: I think the original intent (and it does sometimes work) was to make a 1hex/turn move equal to low-crawl, and thus reduced chance to spot/hit by enemy units.



AJVa -> (4/7/2001 1:58:00 PM)

quote:

Originally posted by vbmark: So does the speed have a correlation with the concept that, "Moving infantry only one hex confers considerable benefits to defense and spotting."?
Based on my limited experience with this exelent game I would say that moving infantry only one hex/turn gives a great defensive bonus if shot at ( oppfire or following turn of your opponent ). Usually my grunts are shot up quite badly if ambushed while moving at top "speed" ( meaning several hexes ). Thing I would like to know is what effect does the infantry "end" speed ( mph reading ) have in all of this. I "know" that "end" speed is just one of many factors that is used in calculating spotting, to hit, aiming, etc,... or is the number of hexes moved used instead. With vehicles number of hexes moved and speed ( mph ) seem to correlate but with infantry ( including cavalry ) this correlation seems to be a bit random. And yes I realize that time is not linear in turn based games it bends and warps and all that... snip I gues I should do some more tests, but with so many different ( and random ) factors that are involved it's quite a feat ( boring ). Any ideas? :confused:



AJVa -> (4/7/2001 3:53:00 PM)

Been testing infantry units (size 1) moving towards spotter with differing speeds ( mph ) and differing number of hexes moved ( distance to spotter being the same with all units ). And what I found was that speed ( mph ) affects spotting: 2mph = hard to spot 3mph or faster quite easily spotted, but when advancing unit was spotted speed did not seem to affect spotters hit chance nor did the number of hexes moved. So it seems that the "end" speed (mph) is the key, whether u move one hex/turn or several hexes/turn doesn't seem to matter, speed (mph) does ( you can move several hexes and still end up having speed of 2mph which seems to be the minimum ). I gues my belief of hex/turn movement giving defensive bonus was affected by terrain ( when I expect enemy to be nearby I used to move units only one or two hexes per turn and allways moved in terrain that offered best defencive bonus, on the other hand when I moved my reinforcement units to battlefront I moved at top speed ( as many hexes as possible ) and used terrain that allows fast movement, but allso poor defensive value. So is there a bug in infantry movement or am I just getting mixed up with my analysis? :confused: I liked the idea of sniper slowly crawlin to a good position, but now it seems the sniper can "speed crawl" several hexes. Pleace tell me I am wrong. :mad: :(



AJVa -> (4/7/2001 6:46:00 PM)

Tested infantry (ge rifle sqd) assault against moving and nonmoving armor (T-34). It made no difference how many hexes assaulting infantry had moved, what affected hit change was again speed (mph) and ofcource speed of the assaulted tank. Moving one hex/turn gave infantry speed of 2mph, but using ful movement gave random speeds between 2 and 7 mph (usually 2 or 3mph). Somewhere in this forum I read something about infantry assault bug, does this seemingly random infantry speed have anything to do with it? If so this has been taken care of in v5.0. Right? :D



Arralen -> (4/8/2001 1:57:00 AM)

How it should be: 1) Inf. moving 1 hex/turn gets defensive/hiding bonus 2) Unit speed depends on total hexes moved that turn - no matter if you do it hex-by-hex or all-at-once. 3) Unit movement radius has a certain bit of uncertainty .. you may not reach the last highlighted hex every time (this is not random factor, or because of being shot at, but because of different movement costs in different terrain, which are not always calculated exactly for the 'preview higlightning'); or you may move a hex forward to a high-cost hex and find that you can indeed cross it, and not only go into it .. And now there's a bug: Inf. movement speed is not always calculated correctly. I noticed this with v4.0 (4.1?) .. got a scout group that went 2-2-3-3-2-2 mph , no matter if moving them hex-by-hex or all-at-once over open Grassland. Mailed Paul about it, but he said this is only cosmetic, as the game uses 'hexes moved' to calculate boni/mali for units ... .. but your tests seem to indicate that this isn't (always?) the case, but it uses the 'speed value' instead ??? A.



murx -> (4/8/2001 4:22:00 AM)

I think elite /recon units gain a special bonus - so even if they move at their top speed 'behave' like normal troops would after moving only one hex. It makes them tougher (they are recon and know ho to cover larrge distance without getting shot/sighted). murx



Arralen -> (4/8/2001 4:35:00 PM)

elite - gets +10 experience, that's it. (exp. helps detecting/avoiding ?!) recon vehicles - don't get the vehicle mali on spotting recon - no orders for moving, spotting boni Hope this helps (and is -still- correct) A.



AJVa -> (4/8/2001 6:42:00 PM)

quote:

Originally posted by Arralen: And now there's a bug: Mailed Paul about it, but he said this is only cosmetic, as the game uses 'hexes moved' to calculate boni/mali for units ... .. but your tests seem to indicate that this isn't (always?) the case, but it uses the 'speed value' instead ??? A.[/B]
boni/mali ? Maybe it's the hangover or am I just dumb. :confused: Thing I noticed was that when infantry targeted tank prior assault to hit chance seemed to be modified by the speed (mph) that the assaultee had during that time. At 5mph hit chace was some 20% less (before any other modifications) than when the same unit had speed of 2mph. Only "problem" was that unit could move, prior assault, just one hex or run around using full allotment of movement and in the latter case could still end up with random speed (2-5mph) most often 2mph. Cosmetic maybe. Was just curious. :)



AJVa -> (4/8/2001 8:19:00 PM)

Oh and there was this spotting thing. The infantry units that had speed (mph) higher than 2mph were a lot more easily spotted than those that had speed of 2mph; and total hexes moved seemed to have no effect. Cosmetics again, but I brought this up since I thought someone might be interested (there's been bitching abaut lesser things I think). :rolleyes: AV



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