Feedback Road to Smolensk (Full Version)

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Steelwarrior7 -> Feedback Road to Smolensk (12/20/2015 1:49:52 PM)

Just played that scenario in PBEM - with the final goal of taking Smolensk of course and until the last turn (I was with some units in front of Smolenks) I had supply issues - even with units being 3-4 tiles away from Smolensk - always around 21- 30 MP - much more for most of the campaign - so I beleive shortening the supply lines to 20 MP is just not a good idea - as it nerfs mostly any kind of offense - especially as soon as hitting dug in Sov units - just always a few MPs to few to push though...would be great if supply lines would get extended again - I think somewhere between 25-30 MP would be good...



morvael -> RE: Feedback Road to Smolensk (12/20/2015 6:41:20 PM)

Supply lines are ok, if not too generous. Make sure you optimize rail repair, placement of units at end of turn and use air supply and HQBU for best mobility. Limit is still 25MP from HQ for units.



Steelwarrior7 -> RE: Feedback Road to Smolensk (12/20/2015 6:46:23 PM)

I optimized all the above and used all the above - just still lacked the MPs to push through the walls of SOV units - due to being low on supplies...about 7-20 MPs a turn (with air supply and HBQUS as I am out of range of the railhead)- which means at max 1 tile grinding action - but no possible pocketing or breakthroughs..
To explain it - I need about 40 MPs to push through a 2x2 tile hole that I have to create in deliberate attacks against stacked and dug in Soviet units - now even if I can do the first attacks with my Inf only (which means it has be in position and does not have to cross a river first)- I will use all the rest of the 20 MPs just to push a hole in the second line and then move into the ZOC tile. That means I can never force a breakthrough or encircle - and the next turn my opponent can retreat and regroup - if I save up two turns so a max of 40 MPs I can only attack every second turn which gives my opponent again the time to regroup, retreat or counter attack...so how would supply be sufficient or even too much? Except I am supposed to be forced to only push one tile a turn, instead of being able to force breakthroughs...but then my loss ratio is bad and I am extremely slowed down, which ends up in me running out of time to reach goals...

I really love your game - best one until now of the Eastern theatre - but it seems to get tweaked and biased to the SOV side - they will anyways have the snowball of the ever growing industry and manpower - now if you strip the AXIS of the necessary supplies and MPs to break through fortified SOV units - plus script them into a worse moral - you script the AXIS out of any chance to even remotely counter the SOV snowball...




charlie0311 -> RE: Feedback Road to Smolensk (12/23/2015 5:06:29 AM)

Hi,

Breakthroughs against thick defenses need multiple Pz xxx, 5 or 6 and with infantry, can make the opening and then the you can follow with fresh formations.

For the Smolensk scenario you may have not been able to advance your infantry fast enough,



Steelwarrior7 -> RE: Feedback Road to Smolensk (12/23/2015 6:14:42 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: charlie0311

Hi,

Breakthroughs against thick defenses need multiple Pz xxx, 5 or 6 and with infantry, can make the opening and then the you can follow with fresh formations.

For the Smolensk scenario you may have not been able to advance your infantry fast enough,


Yep - that is a challenge in the scenario - also that SOV forces that would usually be used more North in a GC remain here around Smolensk - but also not enough MPS for my motorized units add up to the challenge - against a human player at least...



loki100 -> RE: Feedback Road to Smolensk (12/23/2015 7:24:18 PM)

to add to this. I was Steelwarrior7's opponent so there was an imbalance of a fairly experienced Soviet player (taking what is in this scenario much the easier side) against someone learning the ropes with the German side. We used this scenario as a good learning ground - no great investment of time (we played it 3 times plus a couple of early restarts) but it captures the full range of challenges for the Germans early game.

Point is by game #3 I was presented with a good opening set of pockets and it was clear that Steelwarrior7 had protected his future rail lines. He kept the Pzrs together, and didn't make any outright tactical mistakes.

But in truth by T3 I was never under pressure, I abandoned lines when it suited me, maybe leaving a rearguard to constrict his supplies.

So I do fear that in trying to #PeltonProof the opening it may have gone far in the favour of the Soviets?



heliodorus04 -> RE: Feedback Road to Smolensk (12/24/2015 6:58:37 PM)

I never thought that scenario was particularly well-balanced. I think it has always favored the Soviet side. The difference in experience, therefore, is far more difficult to overcome.

It might be a good time to switch sides and show your opponent how you would do it, while giving him an idea (assuming he has none already) of how the Soviet 41 defense mechanics can work.

I'm also a big fan of Road to Leningrad as a learning game.



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