Bug or Feature??? (Full Version)

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Paul Vebber -> Bug or Feature??? (5/9/2000 9:41:00 AM)

If you have a question on whether to submit something as a Bug , or want clarification... post it here.



Windogg -> (5/9/2000 11:13:00 AM)

Bug? When I deploy troops in the neutral zone, enemy units can be made visible. If I deploy my HQ around the area, I can easily discover the enemy stance. This makes beating the computer very easy.



Kharan -> (5/9/2000 10:59:00 PM)

A feature? A tank which crew has bailed out cant be targeted normally or destroyed by indirect fire. So if in a tough spot, eject the crew and hide them somewhere, and return to the tank when the danger is over. With fast artillery off, also air strikes arent shown in detail. Ideally there would be a middle option. No big deal. A bug? The area which shows where you can move is somehow bugged, and shows the reacheble hexes only in one direction. I dont think I am confusing this with Line of sight. These minor issues withstanding, this is one brilliant game! HE effectiveness is just right, opportunity fire is not fullproof (at last i can sneak up behind tanks again) and map generator works great! Thanks Matrix!



starsis -> (5/9/2000 11:19:00 PM)

Hi. i am running Windows NT service pack 5. i have downloaded lite version of the game and installed it. there are 3 executables in the the target directory - start.bat mech.exe and intro.exe. i can see intro when i run start.bat but then the program just exits. how do i even start the game? installation did not create and clear short-cuts - just INTRO.EXE MECH.EXE OOB Editor and Uninstall. Editor does work though. Any ideas? Thank you.



Paul Vebber -> (5/9/2000 11:46:00 PM)

You can't deploy in the nuetral zone. At least I can't... Sometimes the AI set up close enough to see from your side, sometimes it doesn't... The untargetable nature of a crewless tank is known... Fast arty includes skipping airstrikes, that was left over form SP3... The "movement cone" means unit command is on. ITs just like SP3 - you can only move "toward" your objective. Move infantry only 1 hex to maximize "sneakiness" IT works both ways though infantry can "sneak up behind" other infantry too ! The game requires Durectx 6.1 or higher, something I believe is only introduced to NT in Win 2000, so i don't think it will work with NT below 2000.



Mark_Ezra -> (5/10/2000 5:05:00 AM)

Bug Report. In design of a scen Assignimg the AO unit a vehicle of any kind destroys the vehicle. Kinda funny really...one way to keep the AI from sending his AO to the front in a Benz!



Desert Fox -> (5/10/2000 8:20:00 AM)

I found a few bugs playing the game last night and today. First one is the bottom armor attack. I read through the manual a little and noticed that when armored units go over a hill and run into reverse slope defenders, their bottom armor is sometimes exposed. Well, playing a battle, I got to encounter the computer running its wimpy British MkIVs over a hill and running into my 38ts and panzer II flame tanks. Well, as the message popped up it showed that their bottom armor was something on the order of 170-180 and my 38ts proved helpless until the MkIVs moved off the hilltop. My flame tanks were slightly luckier, usually penetrating, but not always. This happened quite a bit since my whole strategy was to wait till they were in range of my weapons(hence the reverse slope ambush). I am guessing this is not intended. The second bug is when an enemy infantry unit disappears from sight. I don't know if this is always the case, but several times when my units had an enemy unit targeted, it would dissappear by the next turn, but my units would still have it targeted, and if I pressed 'F' they would shoot at the hex the unit was in. I think this is because the enemy unit did not move that my units did not lose the target, however I am pretty sure that they should not still have the target 'in their sights' when they cannot see it. Finally, in the units purchase screen when the campaign begins, pressing the exit button does not exit, it acts like the done button and advances you to the next screen. It works correctly when buying support units after the first battle, but not when buying core and the first support units. Thats all for now, these are minor bugs in reality, just something to fix when you get all the more important stuff done.



Paul Vebber -> (5/10/2000 9:59:00 AM)

The bottom armor thing is still a function of angle that is still a bit funky becasue of the "plateau effect". I will put it down to be looked at. SOunds like there might be a problem with how the angle is being calculated - it should a better angle close up amking reverse slope defenders at an advantage (or at least compensating for teh fact that things don't "tip down" on slopes)...Thanks thats' a good one! The AO executing his subordinates is a know bug. Just buy him a car and leave it in a seperate formation. Since EVERYBODY is in the A0's formation there is no advantage to assigning units to it. The "targetable hidden enemy" is sort of a bug/feature...ITs part of the limited intel so you lose the "big picture" of where the unit is at, but i the unit was targeted it stays targeted so the spoecific unit engaged with it can still fire, but nobody else - the BOrg-like ESP fails... What do you think...bug or "cool limited C3 thing"? :-) [This message has been edited by Paul Vebber (edited 05-09-2000).]



Alby -> (5/10/2000 10:12:00 AM)

quote:

Originally posted by Paul Vebber: If you have a question on whether to submit something as a Bug , or want clarification... post it here.
Command Car shows a picture of a 122mm howitzer or an AT gun,, no biggy, just kinda funny [This message has been edited by Alby (edited 05-11-2000).]



Galka -> (5/10/2000 12:03:00 PM)

Q. Should the mouse Icon freeze up when a unit is moving? It's a small point but I did enjoy the flexablity to pick my next unit to move while the first was in transit.



pauls -> (5/10/2000 1:55:00 PM)

quote:

Originally posted by starsis: Hi. i am running Windows NT service pack 5. i have downloaded lite version of the game and installed it. there are 3 executables in the the target directory - start.bat mech.exe and intro.exe. i can see intro when i run start.bat but then the program just exits. how do i even start the game?
I started it with the Start.bat. The game starts once the intro finishes. You can hit ESC and skip the intro. I'd guess that NT doesn't have a high enough DirectX to run the game and it is failing. Works great so far under W2K. Paul



3rd Recon -> (5/10/2000 3:01:00 PM)

Noticed the exit bug above. In the encyclopedia for germany, command car shows AT gun pic, Last scenario by WBW I think its called "when devils meet", has no description. Thats all ive found. Graet game and the sounds are great. 3rd recon



3rd Recon -> (5/10/2000 3:13:00 PM)

Not sure if this is a bug: When I used the increase battle points button, I wanted to start a long campaign with a german tank BN. so I gave myself 2800 points. I next went to the long campaign and had the default points. Is the battle points button for battles, random campaigns, and designed scenarios only? hope that helps. I would like the ability to start the war with a battalion if possible [img]http://www.matrixgames.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img] 3rd Recon



Alby -> (5/10/2000 6:32:00 PM)

quote:

Originally posted by Paul Vebber: If you have a question on whether to submit something as a Bug , or want clarification... post it here.
The movement of vehicles seems to be jerky was this intentional or do i have a junk PC? ha ha, they seemed to move faster and smoother in sp3, just wondering



3rd Recon -> (5/10/2000 7:05:00 PM)

The polish bunker apears as a non-moveing halftrack in the game. Love the minefield icon. Sounds great too, just about jumped out of my chair when I rolled over one. 3rd Recon Alby, did you try setting the move speed to XXX in the pref screen? I had same problem and saw this on another post. It took care of problem.



Harry -> (5/10/2000 7:29:00 PM)

Hi! Only have played a few hours. Bugs: 1. I think this is an old SP3 Bug. Sometimes if a unit has the "retreating" status, and you fire on it, it will return fire and now have status "ready". (not the russian thing) 2. I have played three scenarios of the long campaign, starting september 1939 as germany, now I have 2 more tankcrews. I have lost tanks, sometime a crew bailed out. Then I pressed the fix-all button, but when I looked into the upgrade screen, there appears a additional crew, assigned to the formation of the lost tank. I can deploy this crew in the next scenario. Feature? 1. I can't change the starting battlepoints when i play a long campaign. 2. I'm confused with the AI Advantage Button: If I turn it on, is it turned off then, or is the advantage then on??? 3. Vehicle moving sounds seems to be too loud in my oppinion. Spellings: 1. Kübelwagen or Kuebelwagen 2. Stielhandgranate not Stielhandgranat OOBs: 1. There is a German FJ Squad with a obsolete FG42 rifle. Seems to be an overseen artefact of OOB convertation. THIS GAME IS GREAT! VERY GOOD WORK! Harry



PR^Spanjab -> (5/10/2000 8:39:00 PM)

I have found in some cases when I select a unit it won't show me the range of their movement. If I move them 1 hex then the range is highlighted but before I can't get it on. Probably not a bug, am I doing something wrong? Spanjab PS NT4 only supports up to DirectX 3 I am afraid [img]http://www.matrixgames.com/ubb/frown.gif[/img]



Harlock_0 -> (5/10/2000 9:07:00 PM)

Hi there. My 1st post on this forum. I never really played the SP series game before, sticking to stuff like panzer general. I was surprised to see that you guys actually are giving the game for free! So I downloaded it and gave it a try on pbem with my friend. Well...you've got a new fan now, this game is great!!! problem: I played the tutorial this morning and managed to win easily against the german ,even tough I killed my hmg and half a squad of infantry because of collapsed buildings. Problem is...I collapsed the buildings with my own half-tracks and tanks..who were stuck there after ramming it without me telling them to. lets say I order them to move from one point in the village to another, the pathfinding ai seems to think that it would be faster to just go trough buildings instead of using the roads ;o) Am I doing something wrong, or do I have to micromanage it and move one hex at a time to make sure it doesnt go crashing in buildings? Question: I've read the manual but must admit I cant really understand all the hq and orders system. is there a place where I can read more on this? or a scenario wich I could use to understand more? Or maybe I'll just play around with it more and finally grab the whole concept. Anyway, this game is great and I'm now looking forward to the next games you guys will make!



Larry Holt -> (5/20/2000 11:17:00 PM)

You have to micromanage it. In the whole SP series, including variations, vehicles will go through buildings, move by enemy infantry and be assaulted, move over known mines (sometimes), etc. I find it best to click my way through, hex by hex. Its tedious but safer. ------------------ An old soldier but not yet a faded one.



Paul Vebber -> (5/20/2000 11:49:00 PM)

If you click on a unit and its movement radius doesn't show up that is telling you the unit has no orders. If it is a "recon formation" unit click it again and full circle will appear. If you move a unit with no initial movement radius it is costing you orders every time time - possibly leaving you "stuck". Keep formations within 3 of teh "0" and you won't have problems with losing comms - and set an objective for each formation so you don't wast orders moving everyone individually! We will keep working the pathfinding AI...ITs been a problem in the whole series. Its generall only a problem when vehicles are in and around cities. Makes you more careful with vehicles around buildings anyway :-)



Kharan -> (5/20/2000 11:53:00 PM)

When buying mines, didn't right mouse click use to sell them again? In SPWAW right click buys 5 mines, just like left click. If a tank crew is the *last* unit on your side, and it is destroyed, the game freezes when you end the turn. Are abandoned tanks counted as destroyed in the end score screen? I'm not 100% sure, but looks like not: Bought 3 light panzers, ejected the crews (and moved them so they didnt return), and waited the battle out. Score said 6 infantry casualties on my side, 0 tank losses. Bought 3 light panzers, ejected the crews, killed one of the crews, waited battle out. Again just 6 infantry casualties. So if a tank is going to be destroyed, an unsportsman player can eject the crew and not give the other player the kill score for that tank. AND he can return to the tank if the opposing player doesnt stay to guard the tank, because it cant be destroyed. There would be more motive to guard the tank if it would produce points. Then you could imagine you had captured the tank. :-) OK, enough of my ramblings. ;-)



dgstokes -> (5/21/2000 2:12:00 AM)

quote:

Originally posted by starsis: Hi. i am running Windows NT service pack 5. i have downloaded lite version of the game and installed it. there are 3 executables in the the target directory - start.bat mech.exe and intro.exe. i can see intro when i run start.bat but then the program just exits. how do i even start the game? installation did not create and clear short-cuts - just INTRO.EXE MECH.EXE OOB Editor and Uninstall. Editor does work though. Any ideas? Thank you.
The game works great on my NT box with service pack 5. You need to go to the MAtrix folder within the main game directory and click on setup icon there. That was the only place I could get to install the game and it worked great. I let it install into the default directory C:\MatrixGames\Steel Panthers World At War and then set up a shortcut to my desktop using the start button icon that is at the end of the list of folders. The SPWaW Icon seems to only be an icon, not a start .exe. You will also find the usable manual under Docs sub-folder within the C:\MatrixGames\Steel Panthers World At War main folder. the individual Manual folder goes nowhere on my system. The game works and plays great on NT guys. Unbelievable, I love it!!!!



Voriax -> (5/21/2000 3:07:00 AM)

Howdy. After a couple scenarios I too have some questions/bugs [img]http://www.matrixgames.com/ubb/confused.gif[/img] - In the 'Frozen Hell' there are two 37mm PstK 36 AT-guns that are flagged as 'fast response artillery'. what's that? I also noticed that these guns often fired two AP shots but they consumed only 1 ammo and 1 firing turn. - In the same scenario it was impossible to shift fire missions of some mortars. When I tried, all directions were 'out of range' Canceling and relocating the target worked though. - It seems that infantry doesn't use handgrenades against soft vehicles. - In couple occasions when enemy aircraft makes it's run, hidden enemy units are revealed briefly like the ac would be mine. This happened in at least two scenarios, and I was playing as the 'non-default' player. - I've suffered couple crashes already. They both happened during artillery bombardment. For a while it went ok but then apparently computer wanted to display a different kind of explosion and HD revved up. Sounds continued for a while but no explosions and then the game just hang up. Fast arty was on and 'weather & battle' sounds were on in the first time and off 2nd time. different scenarios too, might be related to the amount of arty that is firing as there was quite a lot of it in both cases. I also have a bunch of gripes about the Finnish OB but then, I've had those gripes with just about every Finnish OB ever published in SP series...this one looks pretty good though. There are just some weapons I'd replace and I miss Molotovs. Tanks seem to take a lot of killing now. It's great to be able to do some damage to a tank even with a non-penetrating hit. Oh gee, there went the radio mast... And I was really surprised when a tank was knocked out by a non-penetrating turret ring hit. Voriax



Seth -> (5/21/2000 3:24:00 AM)

This definitely is a bug. I may have gotten a slightly bad download. See my posts in the 'What the hell' series. Anyway, after getting it to expand properly, I went to startup, and told it to install. It said it couldn't find setup.exe. With visions of waiting yet another day, and feeling sick, I opened the folder it couldn't find the file in. It was there! WTF? Anyway, after clicking on the .exe, without bothering about the pretty splash screen, it ran fine. The game hasn't crashed yet, so I guess I'm okay. I hope.



Wild Bill -> (5/11/2000 4:33:00 AM)

The game is the most stable of any SP game I have seen to date, both in playing and in the editor. You should be okay, Seth. Alby, check you preferences menu. In fact, all of you, check your preferences. They influence the game greatly and can alter speed, difficulty, graphics, various sound functions, units, etc. It is important to familiarize yourself with these features. Now you can fine-tune the game in so many ways. Wild Bill ------------------ Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games



Desert Fox -> (5/11/2000 6:02:00 AM)

Ok, I have found some new bugs, err, old bugs. I am pretty sure these were 'features' in SP3, but I think they should probably be changed for SPWAW. First is the artillery bombardment dispersal pattern. Basically there is none. All the shells land in the target hex, with maybe one or two to an adjacent hex. This wasn't horrible in SP3 with 200 yard hexes, but now that we are back to 50 or so, I say the dispersal pattern should be over a wide area like SP2. Makes for more effective bombardment too. Second bug is airstrikes. Those planes cost a lot and they only usually get in one pass before they become unavailable. If I recall correctly, SP3 made each air unit do a morale check compared to how many bombs they had left. Well, I never liked that because after one bomb run they use it all up and never come back for strafing. The same thing happens in SPWAW. They come in, use their bombs, then rarely, if ever, return to strafe. This is especially bad because they cost a ton of points now. I don't know how everyone else feels, but I would like you guys to disable this so that the planes will come back until they are damaged by something on the battlefield like in SP2. Today, I only got 3 strikes out of a pair of Bf-110s, and none of them did any appreciable damage. Considering I was facing about 100 tanks or so, I really really wanted them to come back and strafe the heck out of the computer. I don't know if this is a bug or feature or what, but ammo trucks and dumps only seem to transfer ammo to units at the rate of about 3-4 rounds per gun per turn. This is horrible because with these weapons' accuracy and the fact that it takes a lot more shots to kill tanks, it really isn't practical to take on the afforementioned 100 tanks with only about 20 units capable of destroying them, without getting very lucky or running out of ammo. I would like to see the transfer rate upped significantly, or at least some sort of scale where small calibre rounds can be transferred en masse while big rounds may take lots of time to transfer. Finally, is there any way to reduce the volume of the tank movement sounds? I like hearing the rifle sounds nice and crisp and clear, but to do that means tank sounds are really loud.



Paul Vebber -> (5/11/2000 7:21:00 AM)

There are two types of shot ppatterns, onboard and offboard. On board mortars are pretty accurate, offbaord artillery will land across a range of hexes... If the Offboard is all landing in teh same hex something is amiss, A four gun battery should land in 4 hexes "in a row". Some Aircraft oare gorund attack specialist and will come back (looks a 1 flag in top armor. If you want all planes to act that way you will have to change it in your OOBs. THen they should comback until they have no more "good" weapons. There is still some work to do on the A/C. But frankly they are out of place in the game at this scale they just weren't used as players use them as close to friendlies. We will take a look at the Ammo replacement rate, I didn't see any complaints in testing, but we are certainly open to revisiting it. You have to pick your shots carefully and close to realistic ranges and manage shooting and moving carefully. IF you move over half all teh time and shoot like in old SP youaaare right you will run out of ammo. You have to keep your troops unsupressed (there is a BIG bonus for having 0 suppression) and not shoot the first opportunity you have, but wait until you are in effective range.USe teh penetration table against your target, while you can't tell for sure you can kill, you can tell for sure when you can't :-)



3rd Recon -> (5/11/2000 8:06:00 AM)

Marine log rifle pit is a half track icon. 3rd Recon



Desert Fox -> (5/11/2000 8:47:00 AM)

Thanks for the info Paul. I am gonna look for a ground attack specialist in the future, but I still think 200+ points is too much to spend on 2 or 3 passes. I also don't usually use off board artillery, but I think I am going to if all my on board stuff is gonna be really accurate all the time. As for the ammo resupply, it works fine in a delay or defend mission where you just sit on a hilltop with an ammo truck to your back. In that situation, my tanks would not run out of ammo. However, in something like an advance or assault mission, I regularly run out of ammo, even though I usually don't shoot once I have moved since it gives bad accuracy. In those cases, I have an ammo truck tag along and keep it out of the line of fire. When one of my tanks runs out of HE or AP or whatever, I send them back for resupply, but because the transfer rate is so slow, it takes a really long time to get ammo back up to a useable level so that the tank can get back into the action. This is even more of a problem with tank destroyers and self propelled guns.



Alby -> (5/11/2000 9:28:00 AM)

quote:

Originally posted by Paul Vebber: If you have a question on whether to submit something as a Bug , or want clarification... post it here.
Played campaign UK vs Ussr 45-46 B26 mauradar appeared to be a truck flying across the screen, same icon in the purchase screen, a truck(i think, definately not an aircraft) also, how do reply without quotes!! ha ha



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