Is there anyway to delay pirates? (Full Version)

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Sokar408 -> Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/27/2016 4:51:48 AM)

Like the title askes: Is there a way to delay the pirates from spawning, instead of having them spawn at the start of the game?I think it ruins the game somewhat, that they are there immediately, as I tend to start a pre-warp. Its been a while since I played last, but I'd like to have a game where I have at least a little bit of time, before I have to start paying protection money ;)



Bingeling -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/27/2016 5:21:51 AM)

You can put them weak and distant.

At game start you can go into the editor and remove the spaceport of the nearest crews. I would not recommend using the editor to solve situations that happen in the game, though.

Apart from that, there is nothing that I know of.



Sokar408 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/27/2016 6:03:30 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bingeling

You can put them weak and distant.

At game start you can go into the editor and remove the spaceport of the nearest crews. I would not recommend using the editor to solve situations that happen in the game, though.

Apart from that, there is nothing that I know of.


If I remove the spaceports, will they be able to build a new one at some point?



Bingeling -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/27/2016 12:38:30 PM)

Pirates can build as many as they want using a construction ship. But have a main spaceport that functions pretty much like your capital, it has a huge store of stuff. If they lose this they are crippled.

They may of course survive, the only way to be sure to be rid of them is to destroy all their construction ships. But if a close pirate crew at the start of the game lose its spaceport, they probably lack the resources and economy to build a new one, and even if they do they will be weak for a long time.

Without cheating: When DWU launched I did an AAR here on the forum where I had lots of pirates, nearby. My "starting" pirates were annoying, when I finally managed to destroy their spaceport (using a fleet), I did not meet that crew again until I expanded half way across the galaxy. They set up a new home on the "other side". And that destruction was quite a while into the game, as it took some time to become strong enough to bust a large pirate spaceport.

Btw, the reasons why the pirates are there "right at the start", is due to the story setting. The galaxy was destroyed and the races lost their space travel capabilities. But some crews kept ships and the ability to roam among the starts, and those are the pirates when the game start. When the races rediscover the space travel during pre warp, they get in conflict with the guys that had the stars for themselves for quite some time.



Hattori Hanzo -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/27/2016 3:04:26 PM)

as Bingeling says Pirates are one of the main ingredient of the story of Distant Worlds and although they are pesky you have
to deal with them somewhat.. [:(]



Retreat1970 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/27/2016 3:16:34 PM)

You can pay protection, wait until they leave then cancel protection. If they come back, request protection again and repeat. I consider this as an exploit, but if you're having problems, it works.



moonraker65 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/27/2016 4:10:14 PM)

Settings, settings and settings. If you want just a few pirates in the game then you must change the settings on the first screen or you'll be overwhelmed. Best settings for just a few pirates is few for how many and very weak for strength. I find at that level they are far more manageable with at most 2 or 3 gangs near your starting position



Lucian -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/28/2016 6:20:52 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Retreat1970

You can pay protection, wait until they leave then cancel protection. If they come back, request protection again and repeat. I consider this as an exploit, but if you're having problems, it works.


The downside with that strategy is that they become more and more pissed off and increase the frequency of spy sabotage strikes against you. Having your energy research base + scientist blown up by an angry pirate spy in the early game can be rather upsetting.



Retreat1970 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/28/2016 3:48:19 PM)

Pirates annoy, they should never be in a position to threaten your empire. Explore and use agents to find their bases and eliminate them asap. Pirates destroying a mine or base is not a big deal (easy to replace). If you have characters in a small base, and it blows up due to agents, that's your own fault.



moonraker65 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/28/2016 4:08:39 PM)

They can be annoying but if you play it right they can also be an asset especially for smuggling those hard to get resources to finish your bases and ships with



Blabsawaw22 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/28/2016 9:03:22 PM)

I've never had the pirates who "smuggle" resources be a good thing.. every time they come to dock in my spaceport, my game sends me a message telling me they detected contraband or illegal goods or what not..

and then they destroy every single pirate ship trying to smuggle resources to my spaceport.. and nothing gets through..

so..... not helping me as of yet.



Retreat1970 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/28/2016 9:28:45 PM)

Trace scanners will do that you know. I've really never had to use smuggling.



moonraker65 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/28/2016 9:36:06 PM)

I was thinking more early game and expansion. That's when they can be the most useful. Mid - late game pirates can be hunted down and the treasure from their destroyed bases used to top up the empire funds



Blabsawaw22 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/28/2016 11:35:15 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Retreat1970

Trace scanners will do that you know. I've really never had to use smuggling.


oh my god.... you just actually gave me the answer and nobody else has ever said that in years of my playing the game...

it is the trace scanners! and I definitely put them on my basses!!! that's what it is!!! god fricken God dangit!! all the time.. it was just that!



Retreat1970 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/28/2016 11:41:27 PM)

lol [:)]

Also, if I remember correctly, smuggling is bugged. I was supposedly paying for the resources brought in, but I never saw my income decrease. It was free stuff. So I added smuggling to my list of "exploits" and I don't use it.



Lucian -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/29/2016 4:39:49 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Retreat1970

Pirates annoy, they should never be in a position to threaten your empire. Explore and use agents to find their bases and eliminate them asap. Pirates destroying a mine or base is not a big deal (easy to replace). If you have characters in a small base, and it blows up due to agents, that's your own fault.


When you have only ONE energy research base and ONE scientist at the beginning of the game and it is blown up due to pissed off pirates before you even begin to research FTL, that is most certainly a big deal and a hell of a lot more than merely annoying.

That's why I try to never annoy pirates too much in the very early game with constantly accepting and rejecting protection treaties. The above scenario happened to me too many times for comfort.



Aeson -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/29/2016 4:44:04 AM)

quote:

Also, if I remember correctly, smuggling is bugged. I was supposedly paying for the resources brought in, but I never saw my income decrease.

Smuggling bonuses are paid by the private sector, probably because the private sector is the sector which actually buys the resources even though it's the state which offered the bonus. Moreover, since bonuses come out of cash on hand, your income (cashflow) will not be affected no matter how much is being paid in smuggling bonuses. The state's bonus income can, however, be severely adversely affected by smuggling if things get out of hand, as it is actually possible to drive the private sector into bankruptcy if enough smuggling is going on, and a private sector which has no cash on hand cannot buy freighters, mining ships, or passenger ships. This can snowball into more severe issues for the state since insufficient numbers of freighters and mining ships will cause resource issues and low numbers of passenger ships can cause issues for resort base income and migration.

That's basically a nightmare scenario, though. It's not like anyone ever drove their private sector deep into bankruptcy through the payment of huge smuggling bonuses for resources they didn't really need.

quote:

When you only have ONE energy research base and ONE scientist at the beginning of the game and it is blown up due to pissed off pirates before you even begin to research FTL, that is most certainly a big deal and a hell of a lot more than merely annoying.

Or it's a reason to ask yourself "why didn't I put my scientist and most of the labs on my significantly less easily destroyed spaceport, and just build a small, cheap Energy Research Base to get the chance of spawning a scientist?" The scientist's research skills work as long as they're somewhere with an appropriate lab type and no other lab has a better overall location + character bonus; they don't have to stay at the rather insecure size-180 Research Station Sharkbait.



Lucian -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/29/2016 4:54:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aeson

Or it's a reason to ask yourself "why didn't I put my scientist and most of the labs on my significantly less easily destroyed spaceport, and just build a small, cheap Energy Research Base to get the chance of spawning a scientist?" The scientist's research skills work as long as they're somewhere with an appropriate lab type and no other lab has a better overall location + character bonus; they don't have to stay at the rather insecure size-180 Research Station Sharkbait.


Yep, tried that, and had my entire spaceport blown up too. Several times. Granted I usually start with a small spaceport, probably wouldn't happen with medium or large but I dont really want to outlay those relatively large costs (and maintenance) so early in the game. Honestly I'd much rather not upset the pirates too much at the beginning of the game and then exterminate them later when the loss of any one station is insignificant.



moonraker65 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/29/2016 8:33:00 AM)

Research bases can however with time be turned in to formidable targets once research is sufficient to put some of the better weapons on them. Once you get up to large scale construction it's definitely worth designing research bases which are armed to the teeth. The same goes for mining stations



HerpInYourDerp -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/29/2016 5:17:30 PM)

I think his point is that he doesn't have the time to get those stations up to self-sufficient status or the necessary redundancies if he has to constantly face pirate aggression early on.



Retreat1970 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/29/2016 5:27:48 PM)

Most my research points come from spaceports. Most my scientists are on spaceports. I make a size 80 research station to get location bonuses. If it blows up it blows up. Easy to replace.

I honestly have never had an agent destroy my spaceports. Ever.



moonraker65 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/29/2016 6:53:17 PM)

But you can get other empires agents blowing them up whilst under construction which can be very annoying



Serenitis -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/30/2016 2:19:04 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Retreat1970
I honestly have never had an agent destroy my spaceports. Ever.


Lucky you.
Pirate spies are trivial to get to comically OP levels which the AI just spams you death with. And you can do absolutely nothing about it.
Small ports and research bases seem to be a favourite target for sabotage, followed by mines and anything that is currently being built.
I've lost a few medium ports to sabotage, but so far not a large.
And no amount of counter intel agents can stop a +250% saboteur.

I lost patience with stuff like this long ago, and as soon as something like this starts up I just open the editor and kill every pirate spy in existence. I refuse to deal with that kind of BS when there is no means to stop it "in game".



Retreat1970 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/30/2016 3:14:19 PM)

quote:

Lucky you.


I've played a lot of games. It's not luck. But I do make it a priority to eliminate pirates asap. If an agent is bugging me, I'll buy them off, but then they are #1 on my list.



Lucian -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/31/2016 3:18:46 AM)

You cant eliminate pirates before you research FTL.

I've never had a Medium or Large starport destroyed by sabotage, not entirely anyway. But I have had many small starports or research stations (along with my only scientist, the AI loves choosing the place where my scientist is) completely blown up after pissing pirates off with the accept/reject spamming strategy at the start of the game. There is definitely a price to be paid for using that strategy which I guess is a good thing.

Now I just pay them off and bide my time until losing a single station is no longer a massive catastrophe OR until I have something better than a small spaceport. Then I take sweet revenge.



Retreat1970 -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (1/31/2016 4:13:10 PM)

That sounds like a good plan if you're having trouble. I start with a med or large SP. Sure it costs more, but it's worth it (as you've found out). I usually don't build anything (except SP) until I have warp, unless my homeworld is a moon. A research station isn't something I worry about at all. A small bonus to research isn't critical (and I'm saying this as an Atuuk lol), and if you lose one it shouldn't be a catastrophe as you say. Keep scientists on SP, until later.

As far as agents go, there are no OP agents before warp, but they can be better than yours. Pay them off if you have to. Warp comes quickly. Then find em [:)].



Tanaka -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (2/6/2016 10:01:40 PM)

If you use the AI Improvement mod it limits their reach.



WCG -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (2/8/2016 5:41:17 PM)

I like the pirates, but I realize that's just personal preference. However, in previous games, I'd set pirates to "many" (which meant they were a big problem in the early game), but when I eventually encountered other empires, those empires were quite weak. I figured that was at least partly because of the numerous pirates.

So, in my current game, I set pirates to "few" and "distant." (I left them at normal difficulty, though I increased the overall game difficulty and aggression a bit.)

The results surprised me. Pirates didn't arrive until after I'd already built a strong spaceport. I didn't have any ships built yet and (obviously) nothing else in my solar system to protect, so I told them to shove off when they demanded protection money. They attacked the spaceport, which was pretty much suicidal. I destroyed one ship and drove the others off.

I haven't seen them since. On the diplomacy screen, they're not angry with me (they're just "cautious"), so they're not sabotaging my stations or anything. It's weird (and too easy, actually).

I've only encountered two other empires, so far, and they're both a lot weaker than me. So I'm not sure if setting the pirates to "few" helped them out at all. Of course, not paying protection money - and not needing to defend my empire against continual pirate attacks - helped me out hugely. So I might have made the game easier, when I was trying to make other empires a bigger threat.

Anyway, if you don't like pirates, you might try that. On the other hand, this might just be pure luck, too. I don't have pirates anywhere nearby, and the first bunch just happened to show up when I was perfectly set for them. That's not likely to happen again, I suppose. I really don't know.



NephilimNexus -> RE: Is there anyway to delay pirates? (3/1/2016 4:28:15 AM)

Load your homeworld Spaceport with Boarding Pods and let the Pirates attack you. Then scrap their captured ships for large amounts of free tech points.

You're welcome.

Honestly never had any problem dealing with them, even on a PreWarp Empire start. Whenever they first appear they will head directly to your homeworld and threaten you. If you accept the fly off and if you refuse they'll try to raid you homeworld.

Here's the thing: They started off with only 2 small raiding ships. If you're Spaceport has enough firepower to fend them off (and unless you did something really stupid like letting the AI design it for you, then your Starport can easily beat them) they won't come back for years. Either their 2 puny raiders will die or get driven off. Either way, they'll go look for easier prey after that, and even once they find some Neutral planets to raid, again it will take them many years to reach a positive income, fuel and resource flow to even begin building up enough ships to pose any kind of real threat.

Simply put, unless you've gone out of your way to set them to Strong, starting NPC pirates are paper dragons. They blow a lot of smoke but the reality is that they'll crumble at the slightest touch.



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