Supply Consumption (Full Version)

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vaned74 -> Supply Consumption (3/19/2016 9:01:03 PM)

After reading a lot of great posts on supply consumption in the game, especially Alfred's, I have been doing some testing as there seemed to be some anomalies.

The model Alfred describes of "shots" and supplies required changing (I would have to look up the post again) is dead on. Except, there does seem to be some weirdness in actual game play.

Therefore, I set about to isolate various conditions and test them one at a time.

The basic setup -

I created a scenario (#70) and shrunk the map to just an area around Suva, Luganville, Noumea, etc. I got rid of several bases and placed Japanese units of different types on hexes that were:

1. Not in a base
2. Had no base anywhere on the island.

This was done to ensure that the only supply available was that in the actual unit.

I then conducted seven types of tests (actually ran multiples and played with a few other things as well). The basic tests were:

1. Supply consumption for repairing disabled squads.
2. Supply consumption for taking on replacements.
3. Supply consumption when hit by air attack - with light flak (MGs only).
4. Supply consumption when hit by air attack - with heavy flak.
5. Supply consumption when hit by air attack - with no flak.
6. Supply consumption when bombarding.
7. Supply consumption when building forts in a non-base hex.

A picture of the basic setup is below. I will then start a thread for each of the above tests with pictures at various stages in the test. And the first test result will be in this thread.



[image]local://upfiles/30501/8F8491F0D03C45299273A9CED45C5E88.jpg[/image]



vaned74 -> RE: Supply Consumption (3/19/2016 9:03:46 PM)

Test #1 - SUPPLY CONSUMPTION FOR REPAIRING DISABLED SQUADS

There is no supply consumption for repairs.

The table below is for a unit with 90 support, and 90 disabled IJA infantry squads. It shows supply at start of each turn, required, and status of squads in the unit. Pictures of the unit at various points to follow.




[image]local://upfiles/30501/F0C24D0B993141F58FF152BE702D5944.jpg[/image]



vaned74 -> RE: Supply Consumption (3/19/2016 9:04:33 PM)

And here is the unit in question at start - I call it the "Repair Me Brigade".



[image]local://upfiles/30501/6727B7125052465788BFBC3591543199.jpg[/image]



vaned74 -> RE: Supply Consumption (3/19/2016 9:05:04 PM)

And at a later date. You will note 2 squads repaired from the disabled category - but no cost in supply other than the normal consumption of 1 ton per squad per 30 days.

[image]local://upfiles/30501/9B9D073406F54B49AD5BAAD4F24E9912.jpg[/image]



vaned74 -> RE: Supply Consumption (3/19/2016 9:06:18 PM)

And a further later date. 3 more squads repaired - no additional supplies used other than routine daily consumption of 5 tons.

[image]local://upfiles/30501/46BE7E2EAD56469480E41B8535BC03FC.jpg[/image]



vaned74 -> RE: Supply Consumption (3/19/2016 9:07:20 PM)

And again - same deal. More squads repaired - no additional supplies required other than ordinary consumption.

[image]local://upfiles/30501/39FBB9A2E3FB42C8A0E7B242D511DEEF.jpg[/image]



vaned74 -> RE: Supply Consumption (3/19/2016 9:09:13 PM)

And then an iteration of this where I was curious if only squad type devices did not cost supplies to repair. So I made a device that had a load cost of 30 and ran the same test. No supplies required to repair that either. The unit started with all devices disabled (except support). 5 days later - 25 supplies consumed - 5 weapons repaired.

[image]local://upfiles/30501/C1F86531C82040018D6CF8DB18BD7AC8.jpg[/image]



PaxMondo -> RE: Supply Consumption (3/20/2016 12:44:00 AM)

Agrees with my testing of disabled squads about 4 years ago ... no supply consumed to repair them.



Lokasenna -> RE: Supply Consumption (3/20/2016 3:44:06 AM)

No need to test a supply cost to repairing disabled squads. It's been documented elsewhere that it does not cost supply to repair squads.

However, it will increase the supply consumption of the unit, thereby indirectly costing supplies.



Alfred -> RE: Supply Consumption (3/20/2016 6:52:08 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

No need to test a supply cost to repairing disabled squads. It's been documented elsewhere that it does not cost supply to repair squads.

However, it will increase the supply consumption of the unit, thereby indirectly costing supplies.


The other indirect supply cost is that support devices are factored into the repair routines. Those support devices need to feed themselves. Have insufficient supply to feed the support devices to the point that you have unready support devices, the repair of the other devices in turn suffers.

This is what is meant in the manual that supply is involved in making devices ready.

Alfred



Yakface -> RE: Supply Consumption (3/24/2016 11:21:15 AM)

It has been pointed out before that the 'Alfred model' of supply usage, though good for most situations, does not reflect what happens in game at least in the case of the anti aircraft fire routine.

Effectively the model Alfred proposes is that firing has no direct supply usage. The effect it has is to raise a units 'supplies required' figure by an amount depending upon how many 'shots' are fired (up to 10). This can effectively increase the supplies required up to 100%. In order to identify how many supply points are used divide the supplies required figure by 30 for a daily usage number. Nominally there should also be extra usage for the repair of devices and draw down of new devices.

This model most noticeably breaks down when it comes to anti-aircraft fire. There is an enormous supply leak somewhere in that routine as shown by your testing in another thread and something I noticed an pointed out a year or two ago: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3778277&mpage=1&key=. It was the discovery that 270 units of supply had been used in one day by a base unit with some anti-aircraft capability, that first prompted me to post.

The consequences of such a large supply drain are serious for the game - It seems China, Singapore, Philippines early in the game and Japanese outposts later, can be drained of supply simply by flying recon missions to get AA units to fire inordinate quantities into the sky.

Maybe the Alfred model is how things should work........but, at least in the case of AA, it is not how it working currently in game.



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