is this game dead? (Full Version)

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bairdlander2 -> is this game dead? (7/29/2016 2:35:09 AM)

Not too much activity here.I attribute this to it being summer and people spending more time outdoors.Personally I have not opened this game is over a month,though I will get back to it when the cold weather returns.I created a Facebook page if anyone is interested in commenting there.Just enter Gary Grigsby's War in the West in the Facebook search box.Thanks.



zakblood -> RE: is this game dead? (7/29/2016 6:07:24 AM)

nobody can force anyone to use a forum, but understand the reason to post, activity does seems lower over the whole board at times, but no it's still being developed / patched and played, one of my favorite game atm [;)]



Steely Glint -> RE: is this game dead? (7/29/2016 6:30:06 AM)

Dead? Well, I'm playing it and having a ball with it, but not posting about it.



soeren01 -> RE: is this game dead? (7/29/2016 8:30:20 AM)

WitW is the main game I am playing. I just don't have the time to post an AAR or something similar.



quertice -> RE: is this game dead? (7/29/2016 12:16:54 PM)

I play WITW, but game manual is so perfect I have no need to post to ask for help [:D]



jhdeerslayer -> RE: is this game dead? (7/29/2016 9:53:08 PM)

Always have a game going myself.



morvael -> RE: is this game dead? (7/29/2016 11:10:59 PM)

I envy you, I have no time [:(]



Joel Billings -> RE: is this game dead? (7/30/2016 3:40:28 PM)

I can tell you that sales are not dead, so I know there are new players everyday. There are not as many online Multiplayer games of WitW as WitE, and there never have been, but there are games going on. Aside from the fact that the Eastern Front has always been more popular at this scale than the Western Front, my assumption is that players prefer multiplayer games where there is the hope of both attacking and defending. So there are more 2-player games of WitE for that reason (although, the reality is that many players never get past the early phase of the war as players quit once the tide turns, especially if it turns early). In WitW, the Allies have the initiative for the entire game, so there is a strategic attacker and a strategic defender. I think this means an even a higher percentage of WitW games are versus the AI than WitE games. Personally I found the Torch to Tunisia scenario during testing to be great fun 2 player. Although the Allies have the strategic initiative, it's such a finely balanced game with each player facing their own advantages and disadvantages in the air and with logistics that it was nothing like the rest of WitW. For those of you with Torch, I encourage you to try it sometime against another player.

As for forum traffic, clearly there's a bigger WitE community and the fact that we're working on WitE2 means there's a more immediate future to talk about over there. Also, I like to think that WitW was a more refined product at release as we had learned a lot making WitE, so there's been less need for ongoing changes (some may disagree, but I like to think that anyway). Although we've had our share of bugs to fix and balance issues to improve on in WitW, they've been a small fraction of the issues that were dealt with in WitE. We'll continue to make tweaks and bug fixes as important things are brought up, and sometimes we find bugs while working on WitE2 that allow us to improve WitW. So in that way, the game is still alive.



jacktimes2 -> RE: is this game dead? (7/31/2016 6:14:43 AM)

I play it just about every day myself.



szmike -> RE: is this game dead? (8/1/2016 10:23:58 AM)

I think there's not that many problems with WitW comparing to many other games and it has good enough manual, so activity is rather low. Other than that I think playerbase is smaller too, but that's just a guess.



Rosseau -> RE: is this game dead? (8/2/2016 11:19:44 PM)

WitW is a marquee title for Matrix with many improvements (imo) over WitE. Meanwhile, WitE has been supported like no other game around here - 200 page changelog - so this series is sure bet for the long-term. More than 173,000 posts since release!

Compare that with the older John Tiller's Campaign Series (27,000 posts) and still quite popular. I guess people had more questions about WitE [;)]



PaxMondo -> RE: is this game dead? (8/4/2016 3:18:10 AM)

WitPAE - 692,000 posts. [;)]



Michael T -> RE: is this game dead? (8/4/2016 3:45:48 AM)

I hope it's not dead, as I am considering playing it again.



Dobey455 -> RE: is this game dead? (8/5/2016 6:21:41 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo

WitPAE - 692,000 posts. [;)]


Relevance?



Steely Glint -> RE: is this game dead? (8/6/2016 10:32:14 PM)

As long as one of us is still playing it, it's not dead.



BradK82 -> RE: is this game dead? (8/6/2016 11:30:30 PM)

I play this game along with WitE, Toaw WiF and some others. I don't post much because I love reading manuals (one of the joys of wargaming to me was always learning the rules since I was a teen playing boardgames in the 70s.

I also don't play against the AI (so no complaints there) or multiplayer. Basically I always play both sides. What has always interested me is the historical situation and how the game models it. What if this side did this or reacted that way? I think MP games like WitPAE have more traffic because they are communal games.

All this is a longwinded way of suggesting that forum traffic doesn't always tell the whole story. Some are enjoying these games very much.



Rosseau -> RE: is this game dead? (8/8/2016 10:59:44 PM)

WiF is an ideal HTH game due to the randomness and complexity. Played the 1942 scenario through and got my $100 worth [;)]

I do like games that still offer hotseat for sure.



colberki -> RE: is this game dead? (8/13/2016 5:08:40 PM)

I had the game for several months but have not managed to play even one game vs the AI. I am clueless and the air war seems too complicated. Been playing WITE lots instead.



Marvin88 -> RE: is this game dead? (8/13/2016 11:30:29 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: colberki

I had the game for several months but have not managed to play even one game vs the AI. I am clueless and the air war seems too complicated. Been playing WITE lots instead.


Don't give up on WiTW's air war.... it makes for some great play once you learn it.



HMSWarspite -> RE: is this game dead? (8/14/2016 8:59:34 AM)

Put the air war on AI and jump in. Fundamentally you the air is easier than the ground... No SU, no individual units to select and attack with. You can make it complex but you really don't need to when learning.



Canoerebel -> RE: is this game dead? (8/15/2016 7:46:25 PM)

WitW isn't dead for those playing it and enjoying it, but that pool seems to be dwindling.

Look at the AAR page. The last update for a WitW game was in July. As far as the forum is concerned, the game is on life support.

This is a shame, as the war in Western Europe is of intense interest to many war gamers. I took a sabbatical from WitP: AE back in late 2013 (a sabbatical that lasted for more than two years). I was therefore in the market for a new game. WitW came out that December (or maybe it was December '14). I looked at it very closely as a possible purchase, but the reviews I was getting ranged from tepid to discouraging.

I wish WitW had been a great success. I want Matrix games to succeed so that it can keep putting out wargames. But perhaps there are lessons to be learned from WitW. It missed the mark pretty badly, I think.



RedLancer -> RE: is this game dead? (8/15/2016 8:23:16 PM)

I surmise your hypothesis is based upon a straight comparison with WitP:AE and its busy AAR forum. I believe that hypothesis to be flawed.

It is much easier to write a WitP:AE AAR even though the game is bigger in scope. That is because it is WEGO and the game turns shorter. Writing an AAR for WitW, especially in a server game is not easy. In fact it's a royal pain in the **** and takes as much planning as playing. Because the system is IGOUGO you have to capture screenshots and info as you go as once the turn is submitted you cannot go back and get the shots you need or the info you have forgotten. You can lose a lot in a week long turn if you miss it. For me, writing a WitW AAR detracts from playing the game as it takes so much additional effort.

Secondly WitW is a very good game against the AI. Most players play the AI which is why so much effort goes into its coding. Writing about your success against a computer doesn't have quite the same ring to it. I also believe that if you are going to play a full campaign in WitP:AE the added trouble of an AAR is relatively less trouble than with WitW.

WitW is in many respects more complex than WitP:AE. However the WitW Manual is more comprehensive, more revealing about the code calculations and easier to understand. There are a lot less 'how do you do that?' posts here.

WitP:AE has a very active forum with many posts that are OT. That's fantastic; but WitP:AE's forum success is not a direct measure of WitW.




zakblood -> RE: is this game dead? (8/15/2016 9:34:24 PM)

couldn't have said it better myself [;)]



Canoerebel -> RE: is this game dead? (8/15/2016 10:03:27 PM)

Being a negative nelly probably isn't beneficial, so I'll bow out and keep my WitW thoughts to myself. :)



Gilmer -> RE: is this game dead? (8/16/2016 1:20:00 AM)

Well... I have it and have not played it past the Sicily scenario. Why? Because I am doing Let's Pays on Youtube and right now I am in the middle of a Let's Play the Grand Campaign War in the East as the Soviets.

I plan on doing one for War in the West at some point, but hey, let me get done with the current one!I think the game looks fantastic and the challenges will definitely be real and dynamic.

Too many games and not enough time to do Let's Plays. I think games like War in the East and War in the West, maybe counter-intuitively, work well in the youtube format. You can do things quickly and no one expects you to describe the movement and attacks of individual units like the 70th rifle corps. You get to describe what you are doing strategically as you're making attacks for the turn.



nicwb -> RE: is this game dead? (8/16/2016 7:12:26 AM)

I don't think the game is dead but I do think it needs to be freshened up. By this I mean both sides seem to be very strategically confined. You invade/defend Sicily, then Italy, then France. The latter is defined by VP penalties. Elsewhere in the forums a more experienced player basically outlined there were only three worthwhile places for invading France.

Historically I don't think it was that cut and dried. Up till '43 Churchill was pressing repeatedly for the "soft underbelly" approach. But take that approach in the game and the allies are penalised on points. The map shows Greece, Norway and Yugoslavia but they never really feature.



colberki -> RE: is this game dead? (8/16/2016 12:24:37 PM)

I have been reading the manual, AARs and postings. I think I am getting somewhere with the air operations and logistics system. Looking a very interesting game. Maybe a PBEM with a fellow newbie.



Marvin88 -> RE: is this game dead? (8/16/2016 3:15:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: colberki

I have been reading the manual, AARs and postings. I think I am getting somewhere with the air operations and logistics system. Looking a very interesting game. Maybe a PBEM with a fellow newbie.


[sm=happy0065.gif]



Ostwindflak -> RE: is this game dead? (8/16/2016 4:25:02 PM)

Hey H Gilmer, nice to see that you may do a LP of this game. I have watched your other LPs (of the AGEOD games mostly) and enjoyed them. I wasn't aware you are doing one currently of WiTE. I'll check that out too. Keep up the good work in show casing these games.



Gilmer -> RE: is this game dead? (8/16/2016 5:44:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ostwindflak

Hey H Gilmer, nice to see that you may do a LP of this game. I have watched your other LPs (of the AGEOD games mostly) and enjoyed them. I wasn't aware you are doing one currently of WiTE. I'll check that out too. Keep up the good work in show casing these games.


Thanks! By my own admission, I probably started out weak. Some complaining here and there on some of the Ageod titles - probably especially Birth of America 2 and 30 Years War. I am much more positive these days.

I think you are probably more knowledgeable than I am about WITE, so be easy on me. I promise I'm not as dumb as my play-through appears!



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