RE: Allied conversions

RE: Allied conversions (Full Version)

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Jorge_Stanbury -> RE: Allied conversions (2/3/2017 7:47:59 PM)
In terms of 4-pipe conversions, I prefer all to become APDs my simple rational is that the important year is 1942, and what I lack in that year is amphibious invasion capabilities. Almost anything can be used against submarines (minesweepers, minelayers, chasers, gunboats) including APDs which are quite capable ASW platforms on their own, but very few Allied ships can be used for fast invasions (in direct contrast to Japan, where any cruiser or DD is a capable auxiliar troop carrying ship) Having a big fleet of APDs means that I can do credible small invasions and accept heavy APD losses in 1942 which is the year that matters the most. Once 1943 arrives it is all abundance for the Allies. A 27knot APD/ AVD invasion fleet is pretty much impossible to detect/ intercept until it had reached its objective

bush -> RE: Allied conversions (2/3/2017 7:52:45 PM)
Lokasenna, Well, Regarding the "limiting" of my Amph Invasion TFs, I guess I believe that some passenger liner is not really intended to be used as a run up on the beach and dispatch type of ship. However, I am strictly a vs. the AI player, so I can be stricter with what I allow myself.

Lokasenna -> RE: Allied conversions (2/3/2017 8:08:03 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury In terms of 4-pipe conversions, I prefer all to become APDs my simple rational is that the important year is 1942, and what I lack in that year is amphibious invasion capabilities. Almost anything can be used against submarines (minesweepers, minelayers, chasers, gunboats) including APDs which are quite capable ASW platforms on their own, but very few Allied ships can be used for fast invasions (in direct contrast to Japan, where any cruiser or DD is a capable auxiliar troop carrying ship) Having a big fleet of APDs means that I can do credible small invasions and accept heavy APD losses in 1942 which is the year that matters the most. Once 1943 arrives it is all abundance for the Allies. A 27knot APD/ AVD invasion fleet is pretty much impossible to detect/ intercept until it had reached its objective I concur. Very useful for countering token IJ invasions of various islands that are out of air cover for both sides. The only ways for Japan to stop them are costly in terms of early war fuel stocks at the front/opportunity costs. quote: ORIGINAL: bushpsu Lokasenna, Well, Regarding the "limiting" of my Amph Invasion TFs, I guess I believe that some passenger liner is not really intended to be used as a run up on the beach and dispatch type of ship. However, I am strictly a vs. the AI player, so I can be stricter with what I allow myself. Sure, maybe not the big liners, but the more compelling reason not to use those is because they will take a very, very long time to fully unload. They are better used for shuttling units between bases due to their size and speed. The early "Liberty" ships that you can convert, however (most arrive at Alameda)... I don't see why not. 19000 Endurance, 2000 Troop, 2250 Cargo (IIRC). Plus the others that start on map. Specifically, the Pacific(L) xAKs that convert to xAPs with 1000 Troop/1300 Cargo. Fun fact: if you have an amphibious command ship with amphibious force HQ (AGC/HQm combo), most of these xAPs will basically fully unload in a single day. The AGC+HQm more or less turn them into full blown APAs. Use them!

bush -> RE: Allied conversions (2/4/2017 12:24:12 AM)
I believe the presence of the AGC is all that is necessary for the increase in unloading tempo. The Amph Force HQ helps limit the disruption of the troops themselves.

Dirtnap86 -> RE: Allied conversions (2/4/2017 3:35:31 AM)
With regards to the four-stackers, I convert the Wickes class to DEs (shorter legs) while keeping the Clemsons as APDs because of their longer legs. Haven't really fooled around with AKE/AG conversions because I didn't really know what the AGs did.

BBfanboy -> RE: Allied conversions (2/4/2017 6:39:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Dirtnap86 With regards to the four-stackers, I convert the Wickes class to DEs (shorter legs) while keeping the Clemsons as APDs because of their longer legs. Haven't really fooled around with AKE/AG conversions because I didn't really know what the AGs did. I learned that hard way that an AM or KV in need of depth charges needs to find a tender or a size seven port to get them. AKEs can provide, but AGs are the intended vessel to support smaller ships, and they also help with repairs of small vessels. You don't need a lot of them, but as others have mentioned you can convert for the better AA and have them hauling freight. My issue with this is that AGs are worth a lot more VPs to the IJN sub that picks them off than the original xAK was worth. The additional AA devices are what boosts the ship value.

ny59giants -> RE: Allied conversions (2/4/2017 1:13:10 PM)
Allied Fast Transport TFs - I gather up the AMCs and the old four stackers converted to APDs to form 1 or 2 of these TFs. You have to be careful in their use, but they are valuable to you in 42 and early 43. APs to APAs - I get those that can do this to Mare Island and they sit there until early 43 when I can convert. The Allies need every APA they can get their hands on. xAK Pacific C Class & Dominion M Class to xAPs- I move all those in Burma/India to Cape Town for conversion. Then, most go to USA for use in Pacific while some stay here or at Aden to move troops into India. They are small enough to be able to dock at size 1 or 2 ports when you need to unload Motorized Support and radar. xAK C1-A Cargo & C2 Cargo Class to xAPs - Yes, in 2/42

Yaab -> RE: Allied conversions (2/4/2017 1:44:52 PM)
xAK to AG - this is a great conversion early war. Basically, you get lots of AA weapons pretty fast (xAK AA upgrades kick off in June 1942), you also get more endurance and the option to rearm depth charges. The reduced cargo capacity is actually a blessing for me, because I mostly move cargo in amphibious TFs. Thus I can have i.e ten AGs unloading 250 supply point per day in level 1 (2500 daily cargo limit) port without clogging the tiny docking space which is reserved for any troop transports or tankers/oilers.

Lokasenna -> RE: Allied conversions (2/4/2017 4:24:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bushpsu I believe the presence of the AGC is all that is necessary for the increase in unloading tempo. The Amph Force HQ helps limit the disruption of the troops themselves. An empty AGC by itself helps just the TF that it is in. An AGC with an HQm helps the entire hex.

BBfanboy -> RE: Allied conversions (2/4/2017 7:27:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lokasenna quote: ORIGINAL: bushpsu I believe the presence of the AGC is all that is necessary for the increase in unloading tempo. The Amph Force HQ helps limit the disruption of the troops themselves. An empty AGC by itself helps just the TF that it is in. An AGC with an HQm helps the entire hex. I don't have AGCs yet but I want to use the V Amphib Force HQ for support of an invasion. I have an xAP available to load the HQ. What loss of benefit is there in using an xAP vs an AGC?

Lokasenna -> RE: Allied conversions (2/4/2017 9:30:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BBfanboy quote: ORIGINAL: Lokasenna quote: ORIGINAL: bushpsu I believe the presence of the AGC is all that is necessary for the increase in unloading tempo. The Amph Force HQ helps limit the disruption of the troops themselves. An empty AGC by itself helps just the TF that it is in. An AGC with an HQm helps the entire hex. I don't have AGCs yet but I want to use the V Amphib Force HQ for support of an invasion. I have an xAP available to load the HQ. What loss of benefit is there in using an xAP vs an AGC? My understanding is all of it. You must be in an AGC.

BBfanboy -> RE: Allied conversions (2/5/2017 1:23:19 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lokasenna quote: ORIGINAL: BBfanboy quote: ORIGINAL: Lokasenna quote: ORIGINAL: bushpsu I believe the presence of the AGC is all that is necessary for the increase in unloading tempo. The Amph Force HQ helps limit the disruption of the troops themselves. An empty AGC by itself helps just the TF that it is in. An AGC with an HQm helps the entire hex. I don't have AGCs yet but I want to use the V Amphib Force HQ for support of an invasion. I have an xAP available to load the HQ. What loss of benefit is there in using an xAP vs an AGC? My understanding is all of it. You must be in an AGC. OK - I'll try it anyway - nothing to lose by doing so. Will let you know if the results are discernible.

Lawless1 -> RE: Allied conversions (2/6/2017 8:45:39 PM)
Finally a thread that this NOB can respond to. Many ships can be converted in DaBabe Lite A in Dec 41 to ships with greater AA/ASW assets, the trick is to find an locate them. As was historical the vast Allied fleet is scatter throughout the various areas of operations. Each scenario has its own set of ships that can be converted, below are the ship classes that can be converted in December 1941(with locations) in the Scn#26 BabesLite A, stock map, Dec 7th start. Me against AI. Clemson Class DD to DE, APD, AVD, DM, DMS -- I convert all to APD for the increase, AA/ASW Clemson Class are found in PH. Manila, HK and WC USA Wicks Class DD to DE, APD, My thoughts on the Wicks class is to covert some to APD but leave most for the April update for the long range DE. Wick Class at PH and WC USA Schley Chew Kilty Crosby Dent Talbot Ward Allen Crane Kennison Peary John D. Ford AP to APA (need to protect) I put these at EC and transport supplies to CT until they can be converted. Will use to transport initial LCU to SOPAC before all the IJN subs get parked off the WC. Wharton -- Mare Island U.S. Grant -- Seattle President Polk -- SF President Monroe -- SF President Jackson -- SF Henderson -- SF Barnett -- LA Harris -- SD Joseph T. Dickman -- CT Leonard Wood -- CT AMC to LS(M) need to protect Prince Henry -- Vancouver Australia Star -- Westralia -- Sydney One AMC in Singapore CL to CLA Colombo -- Aden Admiralty S Class - DD, DM Wilcannia xAKL to PC, AG, AMc -- I convert some to PC for ASW/AA Dominon M Cargo Class to xAP Hog Island Tender Class and Harriman Class xAK to AKE Hourace Luckenbach -- Seattle Chattanooga -- Seattle Will A. Point -- Seattle William R. Gibson -- Seattle America Star -- Tacoma Ruth Alexander -- SF Sataria (sp) -- Anchorage Barbara Olson -- Anchorage Katrina Luckenbach -- Anchorage Dorothy Luckenbach -- LA Jacob Luckenbach -- SD Exmoore -- SD Governor Wright -- Naga Elhal Edwards -- Manila Lillian Luckenbach -- Sydney AG Conversions Trasmarine Class xAK to AG and Isthmian Tenders Virginian -- Seattle Utahan -- Seattle Eldorado -- Seattle Cleredon -- Seattle Crown City -- Seattle Admiral Cole -- SF William Luckenbach -- SF Steel Voyager -- SF Steel Tractor -- SF Steel Seafarer -- SF Steel Exporter -- SF Dorothy Philips -- Anchorage Cold Brode -- Anchorage Knoxville City -- Anchorage Trenton -- Anchorage Hawaiian -- Anchorage Panamina -- Seattle Susan Luckenbach -- -- Seattle Steel Navigator -- SF Tuscaloosa City -- LA Enslay City -- LA Ohioan -- LA Arkansan -- LA Liberty -- LA Diamond Head -- LA Steel Ranger -- SD Chickasaw City -- SD Santa Teresa -- SD Charles H. Cramp -- SD Minnesotan -- SD Admiral Y. Williams -- SD Capillo -- Manila American -- Brisbane Steel Age -- Brisbane Missourian -- Melbourne Carolinian -- Melbourne Challenger -- Melbourne Mathern Luckenbach -- Sydney Lena LUckenbach -- Syndey Steel Worker -- Sydney Steel Scientist -- Sydney Steel Mariner -- Sydney Lancaster -- Sydney Cargo Class to xAP Shooting Star -- SF Alcoa Pathfinder -- SF Alcoa Prospect -- Alameda Agwimonte --LA Michael Embiricos -- Aden Filleigh --CT Clan Alpino -- CT Arkaba -- Perth Charon -- Carnanon (sp) Ming Sang -- HK Hai Lee -- HK Yu Sang --HK Johane Justeen -- Townsville Centaur -- Townsville Dardanus -- Brisbane Silkworth -- Brisbane Allara -- Adelaide Iran Knob -- Adelaide Dundula -- Adelaide Illisos -- Melbourne Iron Master -- Melbourne Aole -- Melbourne Corolo -- Melbourne Adelong -- Melbourne Colac -- Melbourne Oaktank -- Melbourne Iron Warrior -- Melbourne Eahunga -- Melbourne Marpressa -- Melbourne Zvir -- Melbourne Wanaka -- Sydney Anhui -- Sydney Aeon -- Sydney C2 Cargo Class to AE Mount Mckinley -- Anchorage Henry S. Grove Bird Class AM to AVP -- Suggestion on how many if any to convert in early 42?

Lawless1 -> RE: Allied conversions (2/6/2017 8:47:05 PM)
Forgot to say just trying to give back for the wonderful support that this community shares

BillBrown -> RE: Allied conversions (2/6/2017 9:46:12 PM)
Lawless1, just want to point out that Wickes DDs do not upgrade to DE until May 1942.

Lawless1 -> RE: Allied conversions (2/7/2017 12:02:01 AM)
Bill, thanks for catching my error. Need to be able to read my notes better, Some of the spelling on the ships are questionable

Lawless1 -> RE: Allied conversions (7/10/2019 2:01:58 AM)
bump

RangerJoe -> RE: Allied conversions (7/10/2019 2:54:34 PM)
There are some good ideas here. The minor problem with the AG is that it will not load resources unless it is in a TF with an AK type of vessel, the same thing with AP type transports. I like to haul the resources with ships that have unloaded while others are unloading and/or waiting for escorts. I do not like to send unescorted vessels since the computer cheats and will find them. Hawaii does not provide enough resources to keep Oahu supplied this helps with that supply production. The same for Manila if you can keep it. Against the computer I usually wipe out the Luzon invasion. [8D]

HansBolter -> RE: Allied conversions (7/10/2019 3:28:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RangerJoe There are some good ideas here. The minor problem with the AG is that it will not load resources unless it is in a TF with an AK type of vessel, the same thing with AP type transports. I like to haul the resources with ships that have unloaded while others are unloading and/or waiting for escorts. I do not like to send unescorted vessels since the computer cheats and will find them. Hawaii does not provide enough resources to keep Oahu supplied this helps with that supply production. The same for Manila if you can keep it. Against the computer I usually wipe out the Luzon invasion. [8D] There is a very simple solution to the lack of resources at Pearl for its industry. The resources needed are at Hilo. Even a single ship, small, short legged xAKL set up as a Continuous Supply TF running between the ports with a coastal setting to keep it out of the waters heavily populated with Japanese subs will have Pearl set for the duration of the game.

BBfanboy -> RE: Allied conversions (7/10/2019 7:01:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HansBolter quote: ORIGINAL: RangerJoe There are some good ideas here. The minor problem with the AG is that it will not load resources unless it is in a TF with an AK type of vessel, the same thing with AP type transports. I like to haul the resources with ships that have unloaded while others are unloading and/or waiting for escorts. I do not like to send unescorted vessels since the computer cheats and will find them. Hawaii does not provide enough resources to keep Oahu supplied this helps with that supply production. The same for Manila if you can keep it. Against the computer I usually wipe out the Luzon invasion. [8D] There is a very simple solution to the lack of resources at Pearl for its industry. The resources needed are at Hilo. Even a single ship, small, short legged xAKL set up as a Continuous Supply TF running between the ports with a coastal setting to keep it out of the waters heavily populated with Japanese subs will have Pearl set for the duration of the game. I'll have to open the game and double-check, but I think I looked at that and the resource production from the big island was not enough to feed all of the industry at PH. I supplement with resources from Nauru or Ocean Island once I have them. There are a lot of empty ships returning from that area after dropping supply or troops, so it costs little in terms of fuel or time to make a stop at Nauru or Ocean Is.

Yaab -> RE: Allied conversions (7/10/2019 7:11:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RangerJoe There are some good ideas here. The minor problem with the AG is that it will not load resources unless it is in a TF with an AK type of vessel, the same thing with AP type transports. I like to haul the resources with ships that have unloaded while others are unloading and/or waiting for escorts. I do not like to send unescorted vessels since the computer cheats and will find them. Hawaii does not provide enough resources to keep Oahu supplied this helps with that supply production. The same for Manila if you can keep it. Against the computer I usually wipe out the Luzon invasion. [8D] The only place the Allies have a net resources surplus in Dec, 194 is Tacoma, CONUSA. Each day there is a about 12k o18k resources ( I dnot remember exactly) that are left free, so load them up on a convoy and dump them in Pearl.

HansBolter -> RE: Allied conversions (7/10/2019 8:18:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Yaab quote: ORIGINAL: RangerJoe There are some good ideas here. The minor problem with the AG is that it will not load resources unless it is in a TF with an AK type of vessel, the same thing with AP type transports. I like to haul the resources with ships that have unloaded while others are unloading and/or waiting for escorts. I do not like to send unescorted vessels since the computer cheats and will find them. Hawaii does not provide enough resources to keep Oahu supplied this helps with that supply production. The same for Manila if you can keep it. Against the computer I usually wipe out the Luzon invasion. [8D] The only place the Allies have a net resources surplus in Dec, 194 is Tacoma, CONUSA. Each day there is a about 12k o18k resources ( I dnot remember exactly) that are left free, so load them up on a convoy and dump them in Pearl. Don't you mean the only place where resources are both being produced and consumed? There is a net resource surplus at every location that produces resources, but has no factories, or overland links to factories, that can consume them.

Yaab -> RE: Allied conversions (7/10/2019 8:27:52 PM)
I was thinking in terms of national economies. The Tacoma surplus outflows on next turn and is replaced by another daily surplus in Tacoma. The code will let you load four 4165 xAK ships daily without fuss.

BBfanboy -> RE: Allied conversions (7/10/2019 9:43:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Yaab quote: ORIGINAL: RangerJoe There are some good ideas here. The minor problem with the AG is that it will not load resources unless it is in a TF with an AK type of vessel, the same thing with AP type transports. I like to haul the resources with ships that have unloaded while others are unloading and/or waiting for escorts. I do not like to send unescorted vessels since the computer cheats and will find them. Hawaii does not provide enough resources to keep Oahu supplied this helps with that supply production. The same for Manila if you can keep it. Against the computer I usually wipe out the Luzon invasion. [8D] The only place the Allies have a net resources surplus in Dec, 194 is Tacoma, CONUSA. Each day there is a about 12k o18k resources ( I dnot remember exactly) that are left free, so load them up on a convoy and dump them in Pearl. This does not make sense when starting from the supply capital of the game (WC USA). You can haul 15 X the amount of supply to PH in those ships as the resources would produce by LI at PH. If PH has HI, the factor is 10 X the amount of supply and a saving in fuel usage. It only makes sense to haul resources where you have an empty ship going from an area rich in resources and poor in supply, and the ship must be able to drop the resources very close to its route back to a supply depot for the next load. Edit: Just opened the game and confirmed my suspicions about Hilo resources and PH needs. In stock Scenario 1 Hilo has 20 Resource points that produce 20X20= 400 resources per turn. PH has HI 20 which requires input of 20X10= 200 resources per turn (+200 fuel). That will produce only 40 supply. PH also has 80 LI which requires input of 80X15= 1200 resources per turn to produce 80 supply. The shortfall is 1000 resources per turn. I ship in resources when convenient but I don't worry if the industry runs out - supply from the WC more than makes up for shortfalls. BTW, the HI points at PH might be somewhat useful as the game requires the Allies to spend HI points on pilot training (don't know about HI for aircraft production and shipbuilding). Normally the USA gets so many HI points per turn automatically that other HI points are not needed, but if significant HI were shut off or destroyed in the USA, every HI point the Allies get elsewhere would be needed in the HI pool. This is why the Japanese should always try to take USA in the first month of game time ... [image]local://upfiles/35791/6439A2FD8DE444A4AF49CD31D377E882.gif[/image]

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