question about synth oil reinforcements

question about synth oil reinforcements (Full Version)

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joshuamnave -> question about synth oil reinforcements (3/30/2017 7:45:07 AM)
I've just started playing with factories and synth oil plants as part of the force pools. Both the UK and Italy have synth oil plants that the game requires you to place in specific locations, but I can find nothing in the rules as coded to justify this. One CW synth plant must be placed in Kuwait, and one Italian synth plant must be placed in a specific coastal hex in Libya. Both the rule section regarding reinforcements and the optional rule for synth oil say that a synth plant can go in any controlled hex outside an enemy zoc - nowhere either in the rules or when building the plant can I find mention of certain plants going in certain locations. Can someone point me to the relevant rule?

Joseignacio -> RE: question about synth oil reinforcements (3/30/2017 8:46:01 AM)
The RAW rules (2004) are: quote: Where do reinforcements go? (...) AfA/MiF options 5 & 14: Fortifications (see 22.4.9) and synthetic oil plants (see 22.4.11) can arrive in any hex controlled by their major power that isn’t in an enemy ZOC and won’t violate stacking. You can’t place fortification units in off map hexes. However this was in 2004 it seems to have addressed the issue (probable forgetful omission) even though this was in 2001 annual. In fact, don't know how this is in MWIF but in WIF it was printed in the very counter, so it was an implicit ruling (from the WIfdiscussion list). https://sites.google.com/site/frenchwifpage/home/world-in-flames-final-edition/counter-lists/gallery-of-countersheets/cs30-polif-history

Joseignacio -> RE: question about synth oil reinforcements (3/30/2017 8:49:49 AM)
Comments on it in the same list: quote: It represents real libyan oil field. They could have been used during world war 2, but only if you own the hex 2701 where they are located. Historically, they weren't as italy lost libya before being able to use them, and the allied didn't bother as they had enough oil. In WiF terms, you can buiild this synth oil like any other synth oil as long as you own the hex 2701, and it must go on this hex when produced.

joshuamnave -> RE: question about synth oil reinforcements (3/30/2017 9:11:34 AM)
It certainly makes sense, from a historical perspective... and the counter is in fact labeled 2701 but MWIF uses a different hex labeling system so it was not obvious that was what was meant. I'm not sure how I feel about the game being coded according to a set of rules that don't come with the game... it's one thing when a rule is ambiguous or subject to interpretation, but the RAC is not remotely ambiguous and the game should reflect that. In my game, Italy still holds Libya but that may change soon. CW units have landed on Sardinia and Sicily and there are no axis convoys left in the med, nor enough of a fleet to protect them if there were. So I was kind of bummed to have the synth oil arrive and be forced to place it where I can't use it. On the other hand, the CW synth arrived the same turn that Iraqi cavalry marched into Kuwait, so I suppose there's a bit of poetic justice.

Joseignacio -> RE: question about synth oil reinforcements (3/30/2017 9:16:50 AM)
There is no specific ruling in the RAW (RAC?) that the Libyan synth needs to go there, but maybe somewhere in the rules there is the specification that some counters need to go to the specific locations printed in them (in general terms).

paulderynck -> RE: question about synth oil reinforcements (3/30/2017 4:14:49 PM)
The CW one is from Mech in Flames and the Italian one is from Politics in Flames and its unit description says what it is. I think you can avoid building the Italian one because it costs 10 so spend your way down to 8 first and you should only get the mainland one. Units from these kits were included in MWiF but not all special rules that may be involved with them are necessarily coded, so you treat them as regular units, albeit these two have strict deployment locations.

joshuamnave -> RE: question about synth oil reinforcements (3/30/2017 4:52:12 PM)
Actually you can't spend down to 8 and buy the other one. The game won't let me buy a synth oil for Italy unless I have at least 10 BP's, and then it draws randomly. The unit description has a 4 number designation that was meaningless to me until Jose explained that it corresponded to a hex designation that is used in the cardboard and paper version. But since MWIF uses a different hex designation system it looks pretty much like the 4 number designation given to transports. If the game is going to coded according to a rule set that doesn't come with the game, could the units at least be redesigned to have the hex designation printed on it that corresponds to this version of the map?

Centuur -> RE: question about synth oil reinforcements (3/30/2017 4:59:45 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Zartacla Actually you can't spend down to 8 and buy the other one. The game won't let me buy a synth oil for Italy unless I have at least 10 BP's, and then it draws randomly. The unit description has a 4 number designation that was meaningless to me until Jose explained that it corresponded to a hex designation that is used in the cardboard and paper version. But since MWIF uses a different hex designation system it looks pretty much like the 4 number designation given to transports. If the game is going to coded according to a rule set that doesn't come with the game, could the units at least be redesigned to have the hex designation printed on it that corresponds to this version of the map? You are correct. And this bug has already been reported a couple of years ago. Unfortunately, this one hasn't been fixed, since it was considered to be minor. To be honest: I've never seen Italy or the CW building SYNTH in the game.

joshuamnave -> RE: question about synth oil reinforcements (3/30/2017 5:42:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Centuur You are correct. And this bug has already been reported a couple of years ago. Unfortunately, this one hasn't been fixed, since it was considered to be minor. To be honest: I've never seen Italy or the CW building SYNTH in the game. It's unlikely that I ever will again, but not because of the bug. I had never played with factory construction/synth oil before and I was having fun building as many as I could. Makes for an interesting game but not a strategically sound one. Right now I'm in S/O '42 and due to freakishly bad luck on tension/entry rolls, the US did its first gear up in J/F 42, second gear up in J/A, and finally entered the war in S/O. But the CW managed to reclaim nearly every Vichy territory. along with Italian conquests in NAF, and conquered Sardinia without any US help, largely due to Italy and Germany buying factories and synth plants instead of fleets and air. The CW is also amusing itself by piling 4 strat bombers at a time onto German cities that now hold 3 factories and blowing them up about as fast as Germany can repair them. On the other hand, German production is pretty good for 1942, even with 2 damaged factories.. [image]local://upfiles/47374/231A2CED07BE4812875E3657EF63BF25.jpg[/image]

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