More than two factions? (Full Version)

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erazerhead99 -> More than two factions? (11/14/2017 10:09:31 PM)

Will the game be able to handle three or more factions and shifting relations between them? I am not too familiar with the last game and cant remember to have ever played a scenario with more than two participants. I would love to fiddle around with creating a Syria-Iraq '11-'18 scenario with its confusing and shifting multitude of players.



Tamas -> RE: More than two factions? (11/15/2017 8:54:26 AM)

I could remember wrong, but I don't think you can switch units between the two factions that you define for each scenario - this is an operational level game after all.

The way scenario designers have been dealing with things like that is keeping units deactivated and parts of the map off limits behind exclusion zones, and such.

Another way to handle something like an irregular force switching sides is to script the removal of their units belonging to their starter faction, when even conditions are fulfilled (or just at a given time) and give the other side new units as reinforcements on the territory the force is supposed to control.

The event engine (together with the theatre options which are basically manual triggers for events) is very versatile.



Cfant -> RE: More than two factions? (11/15/2017 11:22:52 AM)

But still there may be more factions than two? So maybe a shock-bonus for Western Allies, but not for Sowjets in WW2?



*Lava* -> RE: More than two factions? (11/15/2017 12:53:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cfant

But still there may be more factions than two?


Nope.

There are only 2 playable sides nominally referred to as Force 1 and Force 2.

Though you can designate different factions, these factions in one or another must be aligned with one of the 2 forces.



Cfant -> RE: More than two factions? (11/15/2017 1:25:18 PM)

You say nope, but mean yes, hm? [;)] So we have Allies vs. Germany. Allies have faction one (Britain) and faction two (Soviets). Everyone is glad. Maybe Germany is not, but everyone else.



*Lava* -> RE: More than two factions? (11/15/2017 3:15:21 PM)

As far as TOAW is concerned the allies are one faction be they composed of Britain and the Soviets. More correctly, they are one force. A force may be created to represent different nations, but they are still on the same "side" and are in opposition to the other force. Therefore it is, at maximum, a 2 player game.

The original question seems to ask whether there can be 3 or more separate forces (3 or more players) and the answer is no. There are only 2.

The OP seems to want to be able to have certain "factions" able to shift alliances. In the above example, could Britain, for example, change from the Allies to the Axis? This can be done via the events editor but it is a rather complex process.



erazerhead99 -> RE: More than two factions? (11/15/2017 3:26:29 PM)

Thank you for your answers. Well, even the most versatile operative wargame engine can not adapt do everything, i suppose.



*Lava* -> RE: More than two factions? (11/15/2017 5:46:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: erazerhead99

Thank you for your answers. Well, even the most versatile operative wargame engine can not adapt do everything, i suppose.


I'm not saying you can't do it. It just requires a lot of work and testing. The transition won't be seamless as you will have to withdraw units of the old faction from one force and replace them with new units in the other force. But I'm sure you could make that work in a believable manner for the scenario you are thinking of. You would also have to change grid possession on the map from one force to another before the units would deploy, but if you do it correctly grid possession change and the appearance of new units should occur on the same turn.

So like I said before, a lot of work. But it can be done.



Cfant -> RE: More than two factions? (11/16/2017 5:45:12 AM)

OP's question is answered. My question is still open: Can you give different bonuses and mali to units? Is it possible, that in a "Europe at War" the Brits get a bonus, but the Soviets not? In TOAWIII it was not possible. That's an other question then "is it possible for three people to play the game the same time" [;)]



Freyr Oakenshield -> RE: More than two factions? (11/16/2017 2:29:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Cfant

"is it possible for three people to play the game the same time" [;)]



this has been answered above by lava:


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lava
The original question seems to ask whether there can be 3 or more separate forces (3 or more players) and the answer is no. There are only 2.




*Lava* -> RE: More than two factions? (11/16/2017 6:34:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cfant

OP's question is answered. My question is still open: Can you give different bonuses and mali to units? Is it possible, that in a "Europe at War" the Brits get a bonus, but the Soviets not? In TOAWIII it was not possible.


In all previous versions these bonuses were applied to a force and there was no way to distinguish units or formations. Looking at the advertised changes to the editor, nothing suggests any major changes in how it works.

Thus, the answer would be no. You can only apply bonuses to the entire force.





Lysimaque -> RE: More than two factions? (11/16/2017 6:45:09 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lava

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cfant

But still there may be more factions than two?


Nope.

There are only 2 playable sides nominally referred to as Force 1 and Force 2.

Though you can designate different factions, these factions in one or another must be aligned with one of the 2 forces.


THat pretty sad, 4 factions would make multi player awesome.



Dr. Foo -> RE: More than two factions? (11/20/2017 10:04:12 PM)

I was hoping for this as well. There is an awesome scenario in the old board game Gulf Strike. Soviets invade Iran from the North and the US intervenes to prevent them from gaining the southern oil fields and Bandar-e Abbas giving them control of the Strait of Hormuz. Of course, the Iranians were not happy with either size and fought both invaders.

It was a very fun scenario and I always thought it would make a great TOAW scenario.



Lobster -> RE: More than two factions? (11/20/2017 10:53:59 PM)

The number of notable conflicts where there are more than two sides fighting each other are very limited. In the scenario mentioned above why wouldn't the Iranians side with one or the other? Fighting two super powers at once is not going to result in a win. Just ask Hitler about that. However, I can see where having more than two forces would be desirable. World at War would be one. There could be a period of time where the Western Allies minus the Soviets are fighting the Japanese and the Soviets are fighting the Western Allies. Or a scenario where the Western Allies and the Soviets are racing to Berlin and the Germans are trying to hold them both off. So more than two forces would be a good thing.

However, the coding required would likely be a very complex and long process. A rewrite of the entire game might be better instead of trying to modify existing code. But I really don't know.



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