Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (Full Version)

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Hollywood7 -> Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 7:23:07 PM)

Sorry in advance if I missed another thread on this, but I am playing Chinese Farm as Israelis and there is a fair amount of arty, to include a bunch of mobile arty and it's just flat out time consuming (and boring) to click through the whole map to find artillery to fire.

Is there a way to setup "repeat fire" for an entire turn similar to way air units have continuous attacks?

Thanks!



Dr. Foo -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 7:32:44 PM)

Not the same thing, but if you set them to tactical reserve they should support any attack.



JapLance -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 7:34:43 PM)

If you put artillery units in Tactical Reserve mode, they will support troops in their range with half of their power, both in attack and defense situations.



Hollywood7 -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 7:42:47 PM)

That's helpful and I appreciate the reply. Not the same as bombarding a single location until told to stop, but I did not know that - thanks.

Does Local Reserve have any affect on arty?



Oberst_Klink -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 7:43:04 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hollywood

Sorry in advance if I missed another thread on this, but I am playing Chinese Farm as Israelis and there is a fair amount of arty, to include a bunch of mobile arty and it's just flat out time consuming (and boring) to click through the whole map to find artillery to fire.

Is there a way to setup "repeat fire" for an entire turn similar to way air units have continuous attacks?

Thanks!

A good way to check it out is...

Tutorial '41: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4382552
Tutorial '42: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4387818
Tutorial '42 - Editor: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4401098
Tutorial '43: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4390285
Tutorial '43 - Combat: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4394374
Tutorial '44: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4397183

BUT... I will address it in future Tutorial 'xx sandbox scenaros.

Klink, Oberst



Meyer1 -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 8:31:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hollywood

That's helpful and I appreciate the reply. Not the same as bombarding a single location until told to stop, but I did not know that - thanks.

Does Local Reserve have any affect on arty?

This was discussed in other thread, such order would make things more tedious, as you'll have to cancel most orders in every turn.



Shadrach -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 9:38:56 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Meyer1
This was discussed in other thread, such order would make things more tedious, as you'll have to cancel most orders in every turn.


Well, not necessarily. If the subordinate commanders, say in HQ units with artillery attached, would have some logic to dictate fire orders for their own units. Given certain rules, like:

- Bigger enemy stacks and higher threat units would get priority for fire missions.
- Dependent on supply level, commander level.
- Enemy close to units in the same formation, i.e. spotted support missions.
- Etc?

It would work the same way as in Command Ops, where you only need to call a direct artillery strike on rare occasions, usually the guns are On-call and will receive fire orders from commanders on the field.

I agree that artillery does tend to get tedious, and if some of the micro-management required could be delegated it would help a lot.






sPzAbt653 -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 10:57:53 PM)

Elmer has similar parameters already, and if you watch him run his turn, you will see him fire his artillery for all rounds every turn at 0% supply and 0% effectiveness, with 0% results. I don't see the benefit in having Ralph spend all the coding time on something like this for the human player. It is better to put your units on Tactical Reserve. If you need more fire power for a tough target, then you can plot your artillery individually. {I rarely even plot artillery fire or air units, they are all set to automatic. It's the way I play, maybe not for everybody, though].



Meyer1 -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 11:39:28 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shadrach

quote:

ORIGINAL: Meyer1
This was discussed in other thread, such order would make things more tedious, as you'll have to cancel most orders in every turn.


Well, not necessarily. If the subordinate commanders, say in HQ units with artillery attached, would have some logic to dictate fire orders for their own units. Given certain rules, like:

- Bigger enemy stacks and higher threat units would get priority for fire missions.
- Dependent on supply level, commander level.
- Enemy close to units in the same formation, i.e. spotted support missions.
- Etc?

It would work the same way as in Command Ops, where you only need to call a direct artillery strike on rare occasions, usually the guns are On-call and will receive fire orders from commanders on the field.

I agree that artillery does tend to get tedious, and if some of the micro-management required could be delegated it would help a lot.





That sounds like a different game [:)] My advice is, if you feel that gets too much tedious, find a smaller scenario. That's what I do.



Meyer1 -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 11:47:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

Elmer has similar parameters already, and if you watch him run his turn, you will see him fire his artillery for all rounds every turn at 0% supply and 0% effectiveness, with 0% results. I don't see the benefit in having Ralph spend all the coding time on something like this for the human player. It is better to put your units on Tactical Reserve. If you need more fire power for a tough target, then you can plot your artillery individually. {I rarely even plot artillery fire or air units, they are all set to automatic. It's the way I play, maybe not for everybody, though].


Yeah. Also I never see the need to bombing a target more than two times in a turn, and after doing that in the next turn is almost always resupply time.



Hollywood7 -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 11:50:24 PM)

Thanks for the input everyone and sorry for re-visiting what must've been discussed already.

I will give Tactical Reserve a try and try some of the other ideas.

Thanks again.



Meyer1 -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/18/2017 11:59:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hollywood

Thanks for the input everyone and sorry for re-visiting what must've been discussed already.

I will give Tactical Reserve a try and try some of the other ideas.

Thanks again.

Remember that when artillery supports an attack (tactical reserve or defense/entrenchment/fortified) uses half of its strength, while direct bombing uses 100% and so consume more supply.
Direct bombing is good for try to des-entrench (is that a word?) the enemy, or to take advantage of a high density hex (see the density dot). Else I prefer to use it in support.
I'm not a great player by any means so take it with a grain of salt [:)]



Waltz -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/19/2017 9:34:41 AM)

Is there a difference in the effect of having artillery dug in vs in tactical reserve?



Oberst_Klink -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/19/2017 10:31:15 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Waltz

Is there a difference in the effect of having artillery dug in vs in tactical reserve?

Apart from the obvious defence benefit in dug-in compared to tactical reserve - no. Both will support attacks in range with 1/2 strength.

Klink, Oberst



Franciscus -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/19/2017 2:41:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Oberst_Klink


quote:

ORIGINAL: Waltz

Is there a difference in the effect of having artillery dug in vs in tactical reserve?

Apart from the obvious defence benefit in dug-in compared to tactical reserve - no. Both will support attacks in range with 1/2 strength.

Klink, Oberst


I didn’t know that...

Thanks !



larryfulkerson -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/19/2017 4:45:34 PM)

I wish we didn't have to comb through all the separate threads for
little nuggets of info like that.



mccartyg -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/19/2017 5:06:21 PM)

The game always needed a seperate artillery fire control menu. The player should be able to digin his artillery units and set them to fire defensively and/or offensively (depending on command test of the supported unit) or to hold fire. Every unit with the proper tube range on the map dimensions should also be able to act as fire support not just those designated as artillery regiments. This was probably the least immersive quality of TOAW and other turn based hex wargames. The next great wargame will take account for every shell, every truck running supply, every artillery piece and who their wired to and supporting. Database length isn't a problem anymore so there shouldn't be any need to limit the details or functions.



Oberst_Klink -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/19/2017 5:49:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mccartyg

The game always needed a seperate artillery fire control menu. The player should be able to digin his artillery units and set them to fire defensively and/or offensively (depending on command test of the supported unit) or to hold fire. Every unit with the proper tube range on the map dimensions should also be able to act as fire support not just those designated as artillery regiments. This was probably the least immersive quality of TOAW and other turn based hex wargames. The next great wargame will take account for every shell, every truck running supply, every artillery piece and who their wired to and supporting. Database length isn't a problem anymore so there shouldn't be any need to limit the details or functions.

One way to 'restrict' or control the participation of offensive/defensive artillery fire is (at last in <10km/hex scenarios) to adjust the range. That will do the trick.
Again, I have to refer to the Tutorial 'xx series where one can toy around with all the important aspects of the game without playing a monster scenario.

Klink, Oberst



mccartyg -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/19/2017 7:47:17 PM)

Ahh yes. That is a good fix. Artillery were rather useless in TOAW3 unless you retreated them or left them mobile (without the dugin supply benefit).



Oberst_Klink -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/19/2017 7:56:37 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mccartyg

Ahh yes. That is a good fix. Artillery were rather useless in TOAW3 unless you retreated them or left them mobile (without the dugin supply benefit).

As I mentioned it earlier: When in doubt, ask the Kraut :D

Klink, Oberst



Lobster -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/19/2017 8:56:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

I wish we didn't have to comb through all the separate threads for
little nuggets of info like that.


You don't. It's in the manual. [;)]

13.11. Long-Range
Supporting Fire
All cooperative Air units with Combat Support
orders, Artillery, and Naval units may automatically
add one-half of their Bombardment Strengths to
each Attack within range. Artillery units will not
support combats if they have Mobile, Retreated,
or Routed deployments. Units must pass a
Communication Check (8.5.1) in order to provide
Combat Support. Air units may fail to react if the
range is long compared to their combat radius.



rtropp -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/20/2017 3:00:00 PM)

just a thought....
I like to handle artillery one at a time. Guess I'm a control freak. It is time consuming but then, if I was in a rush I would play candy crush. :-).
What I thought would help was a button, like the HQ button, so I could take anything with ranged artillery to the top if its stack so it was easily visible.



JapLance -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/20/2017 4:00:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rtropp

What I thought would help was a button, like the HQ button, so I could take anything with ranged artillery to the top if its stack so it was easily visible.



Have you tried clicking twice on the HQ button? I think it does exactly what you want.



Oberst_Klink -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/20/2017 5:34:27 PM)

Another option - List the OOB, sort the artillery.

Klink, Oberst



rtropp -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/22/2017 10:53:30 AM)

Thanks for the tips. The HQ double click gives me all the fixed artillery positions. Sorting the OOB is very helpful. It will help with this and other searches. I am not much for reading manuals online... old fashion I guess. Its OK for searches on specifics, but that doesn't give you a rounded understanding. You miss a lot. Yesterday I received the manual so will be able to start reading it. I was pleased with the quality of print, was worth the extra expense. Between the print manual and you tube tutorials I should be able to move ahead.
Now, if I can continue to cut down on the crashes I will be set. I was going to go through the ini files now that I have found them but I have a feeling that at this point I would only screw up something else. :-).
Thanks to all for your help.



Lobster -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/22/2017 1:37:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rtropp
Yesterday I received the manual so will be able to start reading it. I was pleased with the quality of print, was worth the extra expense.


I am very jealous. [;)]



gbaby -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/22/2017 2:34:06 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: JapLance


quote:

ORIGINAL: rtropp

What I thought would help was a button, like the HQ button, so I could take anything with ranged artillery to the top if its stack so it was easily visible.



Have you tried clicking twice on the HQ button? I think it does exactly what you want.


Wow, hitting the "H" key does help a lot. I didn't realize it would cycle up the Artillery to top of stack regardless if stack had HQ unit or not. Works great.

Have played a long time and never knew this. Forum browsing continues uncovering helpful hints on improving play.



rileydavidsmith -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/27/2017 8:36:37 AM)

JapLance is correct. Click the HQ button once and it cycles all HQ to top of stack. Click a second time and it cycles all artillery units to the top of stack. Keep in mind that if a stack contains both an HQ and an arty only one will show on TOS.



BDukes -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/27/2017 7:37:10 PM)

Very helpful. Thanks!



Silvanski -> RE: Time consuming effort to fire artillery in large game (12/28/2017 12:16:37 AM)

Maybe introduction of an Artillery Assistant, like the Air Staff Assistant (which I never use btw) can provide a solution if you don't like to micro-manage arty stuff



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