RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) (Full Version)

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M60A3TTS -> RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) (1/27/2018 4:27:11 PM)

One final go.

Will it end quickly?

I really don't know.

Just over a year ago, I played against someone named HardLuckYetAgain who was rather new to the forums. I didn't have any expectations, although newer forum members often lack PvP experience. We got started into the game and I saved a few screenshots, not having any plans of doing an AAR. Rather soon after we started, it was apparent there was an all-out drive on Moscow by HLYA in the making. His panzer corps committed along that Axis were more numerous than games people typically do AARs on. Before we had 10 turns in, it was pretty much game over. That was my 2nd shortest contest, bested only by player A-Game who did the oft repeated Wiking SS Victory Tour straight into an undefended Kharkov on turn 6.

Returning to present day, I was given a gift this morning in my one current solo game of an Axis turn 11 where I found about 600,000 of my Soviet troops pocketed. It was a gift because it confirmed my suspicions that:

(a) I really haven't adjusted to the fact that recent patches have significantly helped the Axis player

(b) My early game needs much more focus on the here and now and less time on building towards the future in terms of AP spend, industry evacuation among other things

(c) Since HLYA is very much about winning the game in 1941 and my early game performance needs serious improvement, I must consider myself the underdog. If I can get through the year with a semblance of an army with industry and a manpower base, the odds may even up somewhat.

For the game that is coming, HLYA is practicing his opening moves while I try to come up with a plan to survive now, thrive later.




SparkleyTits -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/27/2018 4:51:11 PM)

Good luck to both of you!



smokindave34 -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/27/2018 10:21:16 PM)

Good luck M60! Here is some motivation for you....

[image]local://upfiles/27926/6BF39CF2B78E494F95271E8F84DDE84F.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/28/2018 9:18:09 AM)

If you hold Moscow in December 41 I'll be impressed to be honest. There's virtually no margin for error playing the Soviets in 41 verses top opposition. Good luck (you'll need it [:D])



Dinglir -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/28/2018 10:22:16 AM)

I am currently playing HardLuck and one of my impressions is that he is very inventive.

So do not get caught up in a preconceived idea of him hitting Moscow full strength. He might, and then again, he might not.



M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/28/2018 2:08:17 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dinglir

I am currently playing HardLuck and one of my impressions is that he is very inventive.

So do not get caught up in a preconceived idea of him hitting Moscow full strength. He might, and then again, he might not.


Agreed. Each panzer corps will be identified from turn 1 onwards. He can change between Leningrad and Moscow fairly quickly. Those committed to the south for a few turns will be a bit more stuck on that path.



STEF78 -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/28/2018 3:48:02 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

...
Just over a year ago, I played against someone named HardLuckYetAgain who was rather new to the forums. I didn't have any expectations, although newer forum members often lack PvP experience. We got started into the game and I saved a few screenshots, not having any plans of doing an AAR. Rather soon after we started, it was apparent there was an all-out drive on Moscow by HLYA in the making. His panzer corps committed along that Axis were more numerous than games people typically do AARs on. Before we had 10 turns in, it was pretty much game over. That was my 2nd shortest contest, bested only by player A-Game ...

Same story for me, just replace A-game with Bozo

Good luck!



M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/28/2018 4:23:58 PM)

Thanks all. Once we get started, I will be posting the 1941 campaign in real time. That will give everyone the benefit of seeing things as they unfold. Sure, HLYA could see what everything looks like but I trust him to do the right thing, and it's not like he needs more help. [;)]

One of the first things before the battle starts will be to determine how much core industry will need to be evacuated, beginning on turn 3. The 4 HI and 4 arms at Minsk have to be considered a loss on turn 1. Here are the initial numbers:

Heavy Industry. Retain 177 of 236 or 75% of the base. That will allow the loss of 59 factories. There are 108 factories considered at risk in 1941, so 49 must be evacuated. 392k railcap needed
Armaments. Retain 278 of 370 or 75.14% of the base. That will allow the loss of 92 factories. There are 224 factories considered at risk in 1941, so 132 must be evacuated. 633.6k railcap needed
Vehicles. Retain 120 of 150 or 80% of the base. That will allow for the loss of 30 factories. There are 50 factories considered at risk in 1941, so 20 must be evacuated. 96k railcap needed

An additional 20-25k railcap will be the minimum needed to evacuate other factories such as T34, KV1, IL2, etc.

Total 1.15m against the railcap. The goal will be to complete the moves in 12 weeks, Turn 14. Included in all these calculations has to be the real possibility of losing Moscow.



Stelteck -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/28/2018 5:48:55 PM)

My opinion on factory evacuation is that it could be a good idea to keep all Vehicule factories.

You can also loose more armaments as you will probably swim in armement points anyway, except end 1941.

For Heavy industry, your choice is good but do not go below.

Relative to named components, it could be interesting to fully evacuate the IL-2 factory as the plane is usefull right now. Others are less important.




Telemecus -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/28/2018 5:55:08 PM)

One interesting point brought to my attention by KenchiSulla.

Factories can be evacuated before they start production. For instance the T60 factory at South Stalingrad is only one point (very cheap in rail cap), can repair (a lot? it can I assume?) before production starts, and is not then susceptible to bombing to keep it down to a production of 1 from November onwards. Or an evacuation later if Stalingrad is threatened.



M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/28/2018 6:09:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Stelteck

My opinion on factory evacuation is that it could be a good idea to keep all Vehicule factories.

You can also loose more armaments as you will probably swim in armement points anyway, except end 1941.

For Heavy industry, your choice is good but do not go below.

Relative to named components, it could be interesting to fully evacuate the IL-2 factory as the plane is usefull right now. Others are less important.




With the cluster of 30 vehicle factories in Moscow and 25 arms to the south in Tula, there may be room for some give and take. That will be especially true where Moscow is immediately threatened and Tula is not.

Taking out all IL-2 factories in Voronezh makes sense provided the railcap is there.



M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/28/2018 6:14:02 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

One interesting point brought to my attention by KenchiSulla.

Factories can be evacuated before they start production. For instance the T60 factory at South Stalingrad is only one point (very cheap in rail cap), can repair (a lot? it can I assume?) before production starts, and is not then susceptible to bombing to keep it down to a production of 1 from November onwards. Or an evacuation later if Stalingrad is threatened.



Thanks. At 224 against the railcap for one factory, it's a consideration. There wouldn't be much loss since it doesn't start producing until turn 16.



ericv -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/28/2018 6:55:10 PM)

Following AAR's here is like following a really good TV Show on HBO

. Good luck and have fun



M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/29/2018 7:34:15 PM)

Things to do on Turn 1 before any units are moved.

Some people have lists of this kind. Here is what is planned, once the turn arrives.

The following commands to 50% TOE
Black Sea Fleet Air
Baltic Fleet Air
Urals MD
Volga MD
Volga MD Air
Kharkov MD
Kharkov MD Air

Support units removed from Hanko Fortified Zones

STAVKA to support level 9
Army and corps support levels set to 0
Transfer all SUs in Military Districts to STAVKA.
VVS to National Reserve
Disband relevant fortified zones




M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/29/2018 7:57:14 PM)

Here is what my spreadsheet looks like for arms factory evacuation. I update the right hand side of the sheet with the current factory counts to keep track of what is still sitting where.

[image]https://i.imgur.com/TrdPtnd.jpg[/image]



M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/31/2018 3:42:52 AM)

"The whole situation makes it increasingly plain that we have underestimated the Russian Colossus, who consistently prepared for war with that utterly ruthless determination so characteristic of totalitarian States. This applies to organizational and economic resources, as well as the communications system and, most of all, to the strictly military potential. At the outset of the war we reckoned with about 200 enemy Divisions. Now we have already counted 360. These Divisions indeed are not armed and equipped according to our standards, and their tactical leadership is often poor. But there they are, and if we smash a dozen of them, the Russians simply put up another dozen. The time factor favors them, as they are near their own resources, while we are moving farther and farther away from ours. And so our troops, sprawled over an immense frontline, without any depth, are subjected to the incessant attacks of the enemy."

Franz Halder
Chief of the German General Staff
11 August 1941




ledo -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/31/2018 4:37:03 AM)

"Pfft. Hold my beer and watch this."

Adolf Hitler
Head of State
12 August 1941

Edit: I'm sorry, I couldn't help it. That's a pretty great quote from Halder though, and a pretty early realization, I always assumed they still thought things were going well in August.



M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/31/2018 4:37:47 AM)

Turn 1 22-27 June 1941

Air Activity

There are 122 attacks on our airfields this week, resulting in the loss of almost 5,500 aircraft on the ground. Many air regiments are total losses. Approximately 400 more are lost to other causes. It is necessary to send all units suffering from heavy damage and low morale to the National Reserve. At the same time, we will adhere to this guiding principle:

The VVS will attack the ground and air forces of Germany and her allies from the first week of war until the last.

Our level bombers will specialize in unescorted night attacks while tactical bombers conduct escorted attack in daylight. The IL-4 and DB-3 aircraft have extended operational ranges of 102 and 77 hexes respectively and can deliver a payload of 1000Kg. This compares favorably to the fast bombers, SB-2 and Pe-2 which only carry a payload of 600Kg and operational ranges of 33 and 23 hexes respectively.

Our tactical bomber force is less developed in terms of quantity, but we will convert older I-153BS models to IL-2 as inventories allow. As quickly as practical we will get the tactical assets on line.

Our fighter and fighter bomber forces need to rid themselves of some older equipment and there will be some upgrades, but not massive ones. We need to use our admin point resources to meet a large number of demands.

Our reconnaissance aircraft will identify enemy ground units and airfields in order to select the most lucrative targets for our air strikes. We have an insufficient number of these regiments currently, but additional regiments will be brought into being starting in August.

Our transport arm is insignificant, but re-supply by air will not be a priority for some time. When airhead supply used to be effective in 1941, there was a real need for this, particularly in the area of Leningrad. Now that this is no longer possible, the building of air transport units will not happen until 1942 at the earliest.

Once the air units were sent to the Reserve this week, air recon flew a limited number of missions to identify opportunities for counterstrikes on enemy airfields by our bombers. The primary targets were the 1st and 4th Luftwaffe air bases containing 100 operational and 162 damaged aircraft and located in Suwalki, East Prussia. An additional five airbase locations were identified and targeted in seven strikes.

A total of 43 enemy aircraft were destroyed in these attacks at a cost of 76 of our own.



SparkleyTits -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (1/31/2018 5:40:57 AM)

Drown them all in the red tide comrade!



Mamluke -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (2/1/2018 1:29:46 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

Turn 1 22-27 June 1941

...

Once the air units were sent to the Reserve this week, air recon flew a limited number of missions to identify opportunities for counterstrikes on enemy airfields by our bombers. The primary targets were the 1st and 4th Luftwaffe air bases containing 100 operational and 162 damaged aircraft and located in Suwalki, East Prussia. An additional five airbase locations were identified and targeted in seven strikes.

A total of 43 enemy aircraft were destroyed in these attacks at a cost of 76 of our own.



for Soviet standards in early turns, this is very good yes?

so do you painstakingly select 1 by 1 each air wing to send to reserve? as HLYH would be proud of?
or do you have a more efficient method? because what I do is go to commanders report, select one type of air regiment and send all of those to reserve.
I would appreciated advice M60 :)

also, Good game and have fun! and thanks for the AAR!



M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (2/1/2018 2:37:37 AM)

43 aircraft destroyed was small consolation for losing 5,800 aircraft on turn 1, but it's better than just sending everyone scampering to the reserves. And maybe it sends an early message that my planes carry bombs too. [:)]

I sort the air units on the commanders screen by total on turn 1. Smallest to largest. In that case, I could select an entire base where there were no aircraft left and send them to the reserves. This was done about 5 times. Then I shifted later to sort by morale, lowest to highest and took out all with morale less than 40, one by one. Finally, airbases with units not involved in fighting and zero air miles accrued had the units air transferred to other bases where air power is concentrated, such as it is.



charlie0311 -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (2/1/2018 2:59:38 AM)

You may hover the mouse over an ab when in air transfer mode. The morale of all units in the ab will be displayed in the pop up. Select a low morale unit from the cr, then go to air transfer mode, viola. Sometimes I get 4 or 5 air units with "one" click in this manner.



M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (2/2/2018 8:31:45 PM)

Ground Overview

A total of 673k men, 7.9k guns and 8.5k AFVs in 134 units are isolated. This includes 83 divisions consisting of 42 rifle, 11 motorized, 20 tank, 6 mountain and 4 cavalry divisions.
An additional mechanized corps, the 5th, has no escape route and will be lost. A final group of 3 tank divisions are likely to be isolated next week. This will eliminate approximately 12 of the starting 27 mechanized corps. The pockets that have been formed are to no surprise, unbreakable.

Riga is lost in the north as 41st Panzer Corps crosses the Daugava. Just as elsewhere, much of the front's units are isolated. Northwest Front garrisons Pskov and takes position on the bank of the Velikaya.

In the center, Minsk is not taken as 39th Panzer Corps does most of the surrounding of units in this area. 56th and 57th Panzer Corps conduct minimal fighting and are north northwest of Minsk and able to adjust their line of march towards Leningrad, Velikye Luki, or Minsk-Smolensk. Only 10th Army HQ remains cut off in the Bialystok pocket, allowing 3rd, 4th and 13th Army HQs of Western Front to take up position well east of Minsk.

In the south, there are no surprises as HLYA conducts an extended Lvov pocket with all remaining panzer corps. Southwestern Front falls back with what remains towards Kiev and the Dnepr's eastern bank. In the far south, Southern Front begins to fall back on Odessa.

Rail unit movement included the 2nd Mechanized Corps of 9th Army, Southern Front. This has the strongest pair of tank divisions, the 12th and 16th. These are two of the three divisions remaining free that are equipped with T-34 tanks and are joining 13th Army of Western Front at the Dnepr land bridge. Another pair of rifle divisions from Moscow Military District are sent north of the Neva River near Leningrad. A pair of mountain divisions are on rail from the south.

There was one personnel change, F. Tolbukhin replacing P. Filatov of 13th Army, Western Front.

There were 16 fortified zones at immediate risk of loss which were disbanded. Two rifle corps HQ were also disbanded.




M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (2/2/2018 11:51:54 PM)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bm1gSgJptY

Week 1

Northern Situation

[image]https://i.imgur.com/lQSU2Am.jpg[/image]

Southern Situation

[image]https://i.imgur.com/HvinkxB.jpg[/image]



Dinglir -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (2/3/2018 12:55:09 AM)

One Point for super nice graphics.

I love it!



SparkleyTits -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (2/3/2018 9:00:19 AM)

That eye candy is amazing!



smokindave34 -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (2/4/2018 9:53:51 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

Ground Overview

A total of 673k men, 7.9k guns and 8.5k AFVs in 134 units are isolated. This includes 83 divisions consisting of 42 rifle, 11 motorized, 20 tank, 6 mountain and 4 cavalry divisions.
An additional mechanized corps, the 5th, has no escape route and will be lost. A final group of 3 tank divisions are likely to be isolated next week. This will eliminate approximately 12 of the starting 27 mechanized corps. The pockets that have been formed are to no surprise, unbreakable.

Riga is lost in the north as 41st Panzer Corps crosses the Daugava. Just as elsewhere, much of the front's units are isolated. Northwest Front garrisons Pskov and takes position on the bank of the Velikaya.

In the center, Minsk is not taken as 39th Panzer Corps does most of the surrounding of units in this area. 56th and 57th Panzer Corps conduct minimal fighting and are north northwest of Minsk and able to adjust their line of march towards Leningrad, Velikye Luki, or Minsk-Smolensk. Only 10th Army HQ remains cut off in the Bialystok pocket, allowing 3rd, 4th and 13th Army HQs of Western Front to take up position well east of Minsk.

In the south, there are no surprises as HLYA conducts an extended Lvov pocket with all remaining panzer corps. Southwestern Front falls back with what remains towards Kiev and the Dnepr's eastern bank. In the far south, Southern Front begins to fall back on Odessa.

Rail unit movement included the 2nd Mechanized Corps of 9th Army, Southern Front. This has the strongest pair of tank divisions, the 12th and 16th. These are two of the three divisions remaining free that are equipped with T-34 tanks and are joining 13th Army of Western Front at the Dnepr land bridge. Another pair of rifle divisions from Moscow Military District are sent north of the Neva River near Leningrad. A pair of mountain divisions are on rail from the south.

There was one personnel change, F. Tolbukhin replacing P. Filatov of 13th Army, Western Front.

There were 16 fortified zones at immediate risk of loss which were disbanded. Two rifle corps HQ were also disbanded.




One question - why did you choose to disband the rifle corps HQ? I've always taken the approach that they would disband automatically so I didn't spend AP to do it ahead of time.



M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (2/4/2018 6:28:07 PM)

In this case they belong to 13th Army under Tolbukhin who is defending the land bridge. I wanted his leader stats to immediately impact the divisions under the disbanded rifle corps who of course have less than stellar leaders. I am using this tactic sparingly, as I definitely need to get the most from my AP spends in the first ten turns.



smokindave34 -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (2/4/2018 8:27:04 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

In this case they belong to 13th Army under Tolbukhin who is defending the land bridge. I wanted his leader stats to immediately impact the divisions under the disbanded rifle corps who of course have less than stellar leaders. I am using this tactic sparingly, as I definitely need to get the most from my AP spends in the first ten turns.


Thanks M60. I guessed that may be the case but wanted to check to be sure. Don't want to miss out on any Soviet strategy tips from you.



M60A3TTS -> RE: RODINA ---M60A3TTS (Soviet) vs HLYA (Axis) No HLYA at start (2/5/2018 4:56:06 PM)

Week 2
June 28- July 2

Air Activity

There was a significant reduction in operations due to the arrival of the VVS into the reserve. There were further night bombing missions this week by Long Range Air Command but without any meaningful effect. Losses were 181 aircraft to 16 Axis. Morale cycling begins as 27 air units arrive at three bases southeast of Voroshilovgrad. Three more bases south of Rostov contain another 20 for similar purposes.

Ground Activity

The Western Front units in the Bialystok pocket have all surrendered.

The two panzer corps of PG4, Army Group North, 41st and 56th have turned west and are in a position to either advance to the north or attempt a western advance north of the land bridge. The 39th and 57th Panzer Corps of 3rd and 2nd Panzer Groups are in a position where they can assault the land bridge directly.

STAVKA’s 20th and 24th Armies deploy in response behind and to the north of the land bridge. A mixed screen of NKVD regiments and parachute brigades deployed forward to provide a screen north of the land bridge. Tolbukhin’s 13th Army of Dmitri Pavlov’s Western Front remains in a position to defend the land bridge. The two transferred tank divisions from 2nd Mechanized Corps to 13th Army received additional T-34 tanks during the most recent reinforcement phase. The other three depleted armies of Western Front deploy what few divisions that are pulled together along the eastern bank of the Dnepr. The Orel Military District deploys the troops it has to the Dnepr as well, to the south of Western Front. Mikhail Efremov’s 21st Army is assigned to the Orel Military District at this time.

Northern and Northwestern Fronts have little to do for the moment. Two rifle divisions north of the Neva River are in the initial stages of fortifying the ground of hex X83Y16. Another rifle brigade is just to the west to keep the fortifications at their present level. All remaining units that are available defend in the Pskov area.

In the south, many units remain in the Lvov pocket. Nearly 332k men and 4.3k AFVs are trapped as the Germans complete their encirclement of those units unable to maneuver safely away from the panzer juggernaut.

Southwestern Front under Mikhail Kirponos deploys east of the Dnepr. Southern Front of Yakov Cherevichenko does likewise. A small portion of Southern Front falls back on Odessa while 18th Mechanized Corps of 9th Army pulls back by the city of Nikolaev. Another two rifle divisions are positioned at the entrance of the Crimea.

Personnel Changes

Zakharov G. replaces Borzikov A. of STAVKA’s 20th Army
Rokossovsky K. replaces Kalinin S. of STAVKA’s 24th Army.
Vatutin N. replaces Korobkov A. of 4th Army, Western Front





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