Anti-Sub missiles in ASuW role? (Full Version)

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HalfLifeExpert -> Anti-Sub missiles in ASuW role? (2/10/2018 7:33:35 PM)

This is really a general question that has been on my mind for a couple days. This isn't really about doing this in CMANO, but just a discussion.


With certain Anti-Submarine missiles, chiefly ones that deliver a torpedo right on top of the target submarine, would it be conceivably be possible to use them against surface ships?

If the torpedo has a homing warhead, would it be possible to program the torpedo to swim back up to a shallow depth and search that way?


To me that seems like an interesting way to attack surface ships, as a warhead going off below the waterline could be more devastating that some convention AShM.

I got thinking about this because of a prototype German missile from WWII, the HS-294, which would be launched by an aircraft, the a short distance from the target, would be guided into the water, where it would function as a torpedo.




djm -> RE: Anti-Sub missiles in ASuW role? (2/11/2018 3:02:11 AM)

If memory serves, I think Russia's old SS-N-14 (SILEX) could be used against surface ships...



Dysta -> RE: Anti-Sub missiles in ASuW role? (2/11/2018 5:35:47 AM)

The problem is, rocket torpedo needs to fly at high altitude during the terminal stage, and then descend slowly to the sea:

[image]http://img.koreatimes.co.kr/upload/news/090622_p04_SKorea.jpg[/image]

If RUM is used to kill ships, the weakness will be the descending stage when torpedo is still carried with a parachute. The opponent may intercept and/or evade them when detected.

While it's sounds like the rocket torpedo can ultimately render CIWS and air defence useless, it still need to search the target in the water, also the decoy and anti-torp weapons are also a reality.



HalfLifeExpert -> RE: Anti-Sub missiles in ASuW role? (2/11/2018 7:02:56 AM)

This is true, and this concept certainly has its drawbacks, but to me it seems like this could be an interesting way of making existing ships more multi purpose.

Also could it be possible that, firing in salvos, such a tactic might be more effective per weapon that makes it through defenses?



amizaur -> RE: Anti-Sub missiles in ASuW role? (2/11/2018 7:54:40 AM)

Air-delivered ASW torpedos tend to have relatively small warheads that are unlikely to cause serious damage to even medium size surface ships. And they would have to land few hundred meterss from target to aquire it and home. So they would be vunerable to any ship terminal defences. If the homing system/logic allows attacking surface ships, then they could be really used against ships as a desperate measure if nothing else was available. But in game this possibility would be exploited much more often so I would consider it "gamey"... ;).



ComDev -> RE: Anti-Sub missiles in ASuW role? (2/11/2018 9:22:21 AM)

Modern ASW have min depth settings that prevent them from attacking surface ships [8D]

Hence the dual AS.12 / Mk46 helo loadout in 1982 when the RN destroyed the Santa Fe.



VIF2NE -> RE: Anti-Sub missiles in ASuW role? (2/12/2018 1:17:36 PM)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AUM-N-2_Petrel

The AUM-N-2 Petrel, also known as Kingfisher C and AUM-2, was an air-to-surface missile produced by the United States as part of Project Kingfisher. Intended for use against enemy surface ships and surfaced submarines, giving aircraft the ability to deliver aerial torpedoes from outside the range of defensive armament, it saw brief operational service in the late 1950s. The project was never considered a high priority by the Navy, however as it was useless against submerged submarines, which were considered the greatest potential threa



SeaQueen -> RE: Anti-Sub missiles in ASuW role? (2/12/2018 3:26:30 PM)

It might depend on the safety settings of the weapon. It probably also depends on the weapon endgame behavior. The way a torpedo strikes a submarine might be different from how a torpedo strikes a warship (e.g. exploding underneath as opposed to physically hitting it with the intent of penetrating the pressure hull). Therefore one might expect an anti-submarine warfare torpedo to be less effective versus a surface ship. They also typically have smaller warheads. Also, in the case of VLA, the question is purely academic because by the time you get close enough to use it, you probably are already attack with the 5' gun.



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