Not possible to make sapper squads? (Full Version)

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Joneleth -> Not possible to make sapper squads? (6/30/2018 12:03:26 PM)

https://imgur.com/jrVFCfd

Sappers 41 stop production sep 41

But Sappers 42 doesnt start production until oct 42. That means there is a period of 13 months for the soviets where they cant produce any sappers?



HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Not possible to make sapper squads? (6/30/2018 4:11:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joneleth

https://imgur.com/jrVFCfd

Sappers 41 stop production sep 41

But Sappers 42 doesnt start production until oct 42. That means there is a period of 13 months for the soviets where they cant produce any sappers?


Working as designed and intended.



Joneleth -> RE: Not possible to make sapper squads? (6/30/2018 4:21:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joneleth

https://imgur.com/jrVFCfd

Sappers 41 stop production sep 41

But Sappers 42 doesnt start production until oct 42. That means there is a period of 13 months for the soviets where they cant produce any sappers?


Working as designed and intended.


So just to confirm, even though it would make alot more sense that Sappers 41, end in sep 42 and the next one start in oct 42.

Your saying the soviets wont make any sapper squads at all for an entire year, and its impossible for you to reinforce any of your existing sapper SU? Not to mention that your able to construct new sapper SU, but they still stay at 0-5% toe because no sapper squads will ever fill them?



thedoctorking -> RE: Not possible to make sapper squads? (6/30/2018 4:45:18 PM)

I remember this was an issue several versions ago but thought it was fixed with 1.11.

Here's a shot of the Sapper Squad 41 drawn from a 1.11.03 game I just started yesterday. Note that the dates go until 1945

[image]local://upfiles/56634/C79E6F00B01F4D5DBE1AA42C08364796.jpg[/image]



Joneleth -> RE: Not possible to make sapper squads? (6/30/2018 4:53:24 PM)

Apperantly it was unintentionally fixed in 11.02, i found this in the ToE patch notes:

68. [799] Sapper Squad 41: last year changed from 1942 to 1945, men changed from 9 to 8, upgrade changed from [845] Sapper Squad 42 to 0, update TOE changed from YES to NO.


Which clearly indicate they thought the end year was 1942, even though it was set to 1941(so it was only active for 1 month).

But now its fixed in 11.02 and forward.


However, it was clearly not as designed and intended that Sappers 41 were only active for a single month.



Denniss -> RE: Not possible to make sapper squads? (6/30/2018 7:37:32 PM)

This was a data issue fixed in 1.11.01 (after introducing it in 1.11.00). In 1.11.02 the 39/41 versions were separated from the 42 version, the 42 version is now exlusively used by on-map assault (combat) Sapper units whereas the sapper support units are supposed to be construction engineers/defensive specialists.



chaos45 -> RE: Not possible to make sapper squads? (7/2/2018 4:31:17 PM)

so do sapper regiment SU units use the 41 or 42 version? As the on map units are garbage CV wise and nobody uses them esp in mid/late war where you need massive CV values to push lvl 2/3 german forts.



Denniss -> RE: Not possible to make sapper squads? (7/2/2018 10:44:36 PM)

Depends on game version, in .01 units use all three sapper types, in .02 the 42 version is just used by onmap assault engineer brigades.
in a future version the 39/41 version will be downgraded to construction engineers (limited engineer value) with the 42 version staying at assault engineers. This will force playes to build the Assault engineer brigades if they want to use massive/concentrated engineer power to break through fortified areas. Soviets simply didn't have an engineer/pioneer organization comparable to wehrmacht - this was hastily created in 42 and came into broader use in 43 in larger semi-independent units.



chaos45 -> RE: Not possible to make sapper squads? (7/3/2018 3:57:08 PM)

maybe you should just make the engineer assault brigades attachment then?

or just add a new assault sapper regiment for 43+ that is an attachment.

I would concur that assault engineer units for the soviets are prolly 1943+ for actual force org.

Also you say limited engineer value....I assume you are only talking for assault fort reduction? Not limiting their ability to dig-in and assist in fortifying correct?







Denniss -> RE: Not possible to make sapper squads? (7/3/2018 7:04:50 PM)

from 1.11.02 notes
Added new ground element type - Eng-Sapper Squad to represent non-combat engineers
(sappers). Compared with Engineer Squad it has recon value 0 (vs 1), CV and replacement
priority 2 (vs 3), support need 5 (vs 6), and engineer value 5 (vs 10).
AFAIR this engineer value is used for offensive actions only, dig/fortify should be the same as engineer squad



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